A Flat Earth - Thoughts?

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Addendum_Forthcoming:

Dalisclock:

Ok, that kinda works with the kinda insanity we're seeing here.

Why is the world generally hottest at the midpoint between the north pole and the "Ice wall" at the edge? Shouldn't it be warmest in the center?

Also, shouldn't navigation be flawed since the lines of longitude get farther away from each other the future "Edgeward you get? Isn't one of the points of coordinates is that degrees of latitude and longitude are essentially consistant with each other?

Or is that another conspiracy? Are geographers around the world working for the Templars/Patriots to suppress free will and impurify our precious bodily fluids?

I know you guys aren't the ones to be asking questions because you're not flat earthers but I'm having fun asking really simple questions and trying to see how the flat earthers try to explain it away.

Because science is fun.

How the hell does it kind of work? It's equally broken. Don't they teach astronomy in the navy? I figured you guys would spend a lot of time stargazing, regardless, given what the fuck else do you do on a boat when not on rostered duty? When I was on sentry duty, that's all I ended up ever doing. Sitting in a dugout. All night.

Wait? What?

I lost you there. I was talking about lines of longitude/latitude, not stargazing. I'm not really sure what that was all about.

MrCalavera:

Sexual Harassment Panda:

Redlin5:

The idea that 'everyone is in on a grand lie' can be intoxicating. Why the fact the Earth is actually flat turned into a popular conspiracy theory will always baffle me.

This.

I clicked the thread to ask what reason they state as to why there's a cover up and need to push the round-earth idea. I don't want to delve into the crap but an abridged version would be neat if anyone is offering.

See, it's great that you were to ask that. I've recently encountered a reddit thread also making fun of flat earthers and someone posted an entire list of answers.


I dunno about you, but i'd pick options C and D and W,T,F.

How is it hiding more land? Surely there's less land with a flat earth theory because you've taken a 3D shape and flattened it out? Either that or both have the exact same amount of land because you've got all the same continents. I realise you've got some batshit logic to believe in a flat earth to start with, but that just makes no sense

Dalisclock:

Wait? What?

I lost you there. I was talking about lines of longitude/latitude, not stargazing. I'm not really sure what that was all about.

Surely they taught you astronavigation in case there was critical compromising of your surface vessel's navigational equipment during a war? How to use Polaris in the Northern Hemisphere, and how to use Crux and the brightest stars of Centaurus if maneuvering south of the equator?

Like the point I was making is that if there was a flat Earth, how do they account for things like circumpolar constellations?

For a person on a ship the stars wouldn't display their variance if flat Earth was a thing. And being on a ship travelling oceans whereby starlight navigation is doable precisely because the world isn't flat would probably be the first thing you'd notice.

Xprimentyl:
Have any of you had any first-hand experience with flat earthers? Has anyone entertained their ?proofs? and claims? If not, I suggest you do; the absolute authority with which that state shit that is patently wrong is mind blowing. For most rational people, it?s easy to dismiss them, but for curious, rational individuals, it is fascinating to witness the fervor with which they believe what they do and astounding how ironically closed-minded they are to everything that suggests anything other than what they?ve convinced themselves is true. I am by no means an expert in the maths, sciences and theories involved, but those aside, I find it impossible to believe that all of the countries with space programs, and each of the individuals involved in them, could collectively perpetuate a decades-old lie about the shape of the earth.

I used to work with one. He was in our drafting department until he finally retired.

I always found it amusing, like arguing religion or feminism in that there's always another level of apologetics to counter any conceivable argument.

I think it's important to understand the flat earther claims though, so you can grasp what you are actually arguing against. They believe the "real" map has the north pole in the center and Antarctica serving as the lip of the bowl (this is why the ocean doesn't just spill out of the edges). The sun and moon are much smaller, cooler and closer than commonly accepted, and the sun and moon circle overhead. That gravity doesn't exist, and instead that the effects we usually attribute to gravity in common human experience are actually a combination of buoyancy and the disc moving upwards.

The more entertaining ones also believe that the UN uses the "real" map as their logo because they are a Luciferian satanic organization and that such organizations gain power from public ritual and public displays of the truth behind their deceptions. They consider mass media to be much the same (with most media stars being brainwashed slaves of the real power behind things), using awards shows and concerts to engage in large scale satanic ritual, and using certain fairly common bits of imagery (mirrors, showing only one eye in a shot, butterflies, relating sexualized women to cats) as demonstrating the truth in plain sight in the same fashion.

Dalisclock:
Why is the world generally hottest at the midpoint between the north pole and the "Ice wall" at the edge? Shouldn't it be warmest in the center?

Because the sun is much closer and much smaller than you believe, and travels in a quasi-circular path mostly over the tropics, meaning that the tropics are literally closer to the sun in a meaningful way much of the time?

Dalisclock:
Also, shouldn't navigation be flawed since the lines of longitude get farther away from each other the future "Edgeward you get? Isn't one of the points of coordinates is that degrees of lattitude and longitude are essentially consistant with each other?

You have this one wrong - lines of longitude are not equally spaced regardless of position on the globe, they are closest near the poles and wider apart the closer to the equator you get being approximately equal in length but not parallel (because they constitute straight lines running a complete circumference of the globe and passing through both poles this is necessarily true), while lines of latitude are parallel to each other. On sufficiently small scales the result is grid-like, but it's not actually a grid.

Their position regarding the spacing of longitude lines only gets wrong in the southern hemisphere, and increasingly so the farther you go south.

Dalisclock:
Do flat earthers also see dudes walking around on the moon like in that Rick and Morty episode?

What are you talking about, no one has ever been to the moon! The moon landing was clearly faked in a movie studio to own the Commies. And yes, there is an unsurprising overlap between flat earthers and moon landing deniers.

Addendum_Forthcoming:

Dalisclock:

Wait? What?

I lost you there. I was talking about lines of longitude/latitude, not stargazing. I'm not really sure what that was all about.

Surely they taught you astronavigation in case there was critical compromising of your surface vessel's navigational equipment during a war? How to use Polaris in the Northern Hemisphere, and how to use Crux and the brightest stars of Centaurus if maneuvering south of the equator?

Like the point I was making is that if there was a flat Earth, how do they account for things like circumpolar constellations?

For a person on a ship the stars wouldn't display their variance if flat Earth was a thing. And being on a ship travelling oceans whereby starlight navigation is doable precisely because the world isn't flat would probably be the first thing you'd notice.

So, to your first questions, No, I wasn't taught astronavigation in basic training and being an engineer I spent a vast majority of my time down in the deepest part of the ship so I rarely saw the sky to begin with(I actually went days without seeing sunlight at times). And no, I didn't get trained in advanced training either. I can't be 100% sure but I'm fairly positive the only ones who might have been taught how to navigate by the stars were the guys whose job it was to navigate(Called Quartermasters in the Navy) and pretty much no one else. I didn't ask around about it when I was in but I don't recall "How to navigate at sea using the sun and stars" coming up in conversation....ever.

Normally people are more surprised by the fact I only fired a weapon in the military on one day....in basic training. I never touched a government issue firearm after that. This is the first time I've ever been asked about being trained to navigate by the stars.

But I agree with you the other points. I actually didn't even consider that.

Dalisclock:

So, to your first questions, No, I wasn't taught astronavigation in basic training and being an engineer I spent a vast majority of my time down in the deepest part of the ship so I rarely saw the sky to begin with(I actually went days without seeing sunlight at times). And no, I didn't get trained in advanced training either. I can't be 100% sure but I'm fairly positive the only ones who might have been taught how to navigate by the stars were the guys whose job it was to navigate(Called Quartermasters in the Navy) and pretty much no one else. I didn't ask around about it when I was in but I don't recall "How to navigate at sea using the sun and stars" coming up in conversation....ever.

Normally people are more surprised by the fact I only fired a weapon in the military on one day....in basic training. I never touched a government issue firearm after that. This is the first time I've ever been asked about being trained to navigate by the stars.

But I agree with you the other points. I actually didn't even consider that.

Ahhh. Yeah, I can see that. I was infantry, so orienteering was considered a 'pillar of being a soldier'. Which makes more sense than a naval engineer, given the infantry is pointless if it can't get someplace and it's far more hypothetically congruent that the infantry will find themselves someplace they need to enter or leave on foot and possibly only under its own power to guide itself.

That being said, celestial navigation wasn't a big thing, either. It was more things like dead reckoning and topographical triangulation, and internalizing regional magnetic declination for charting courses. Only two of which might be consistently useful if you're fighting over large bodies of water as opposed to fighting on a land mass with observable points of reference.

What surprises me personally is that people do not know how to use a compass. That they do not understand the basics of it. The people that would miss entire towns by double digit degrees of miscalculation because of it even under the shortest of traversed distances if in rugged terrain.

Though that being said I imagine dead reckoning is more hit and miss on the high seas. Given uneven water surfaces, uneven water displacement (like, say, after unloading soldiers and materiel) and damaged enginery and its total output may be illusive or harder to chart.

Celestial navigation is a recent hobby of mine. Plus it's interesting ina revelatory sense. Why the stars are such powerful mythologized and concrete aspects of various world religions and social constructs. You appreciate why groups like Aboriginal Australians incorporated it into a holistic animist interpretation of the world and how it relates to themselves given their crucial nature.

In the Southern Hemisphere, we don't have anything as convenient as a Polaris. It's actually 6-7 more steps determing whether you are consistently passaging across a celestial latitude. And because of that, there are organic reasons why cultures at the equator and south of it holds the constellations of Crux and Centaurus in such high regard, for example. It's a pretty fascinating topic. The whole reason why the constellation of Crux appears on so many flags in the South Pacific is due in part to its relevance in terms of its hemisphere's asterisms and the intimacy of oceanic frontiers.

And this leads me to whyI think flat earthers are kind of sad to me. It's not that they believe such things. Plenty of people believe in things beyond empirical proof ... it's the fact that they would take such a beautiful, ever-present, intimate relationship to the universe, a realm for which our sapience recognizes it as a part of ourselves, born of it and recognizing itself, and cheapen that intimate and personal perspective to the cosmos and its revelation by refusing to simply look at the stars.

I mean if you want to talk 'spiritual enlightenment' ...I can't think of anything more touching, more romantic, than interpreting your passage through time and space by learning how, say, Magellan tracked longitudinal position shifts to an exacting degree by observing the moons of Jupiter.

That being said, if you're interested, I'm sure you might be able to get your hands on various volumes of an 'almanac of corrections'. I'm not sure what specifically it might be called in the USN, but they're usually gigantic books that allow a ship to chart and navigate waterways by sun or starlight by season and time of day.

Even if it is considered defunct, whether for emergency or decorum reasons I'm sure the Navy produces their own each year. It's nowhere near as complicated as you might think it is. As an engineer with a likely head for numbers and visually solving mechanical problems, you'll probably puzzle out how it works over a weekend.

Impress/bore your colleagues with how you guys did blue water navigation in ye olden times.

One thing I do want to ask and I think as a naval engineer you might be able to answer concerning navigation. Prior active GPS monitoring of ships calculating total surface speed to the minutest degree, how did you guys chart dead reckoning over long passages of open water given uneven sea surfaces and possibly damaged enginery and lacking a modern tachometer of things like land vehicles? It's not like you can have a speedo cable to a wheel, and it's not like the rotational speed of the propellor drive necessarily means a ship's speed and battle damages might occult actual performance ...

It's easy to determine whether a land vehicle's instrumentation can't be trusted (or a helicopter's for that matter in terms of blade rpm and centre of gravity, altitude, and in relationship to the ground)... But on a ship I imagine that might be much harder to determine and when all you have is ocean in every direction, there is a far reduced correlation between propellor rotation and distance travelled overtime than with wheels on the ground, and it's far harder to intuit speed just by eyesight.

I mean, if you're 0.2 knots slower than you think you're travelling, that's the difference of being visible to another ship if at the correct speed in a day or two later planned rendezvous with a fleet or convoy, or not being visible at all and being hidden by the horizon if not. Paricularly if we take datum swell into account like tidal forces on water surfaces.

Is it literally a case where once you get attuned to the performance of a ship you simply 'know' when something is wrong with her? You feel like she's a bit sluggish, or something 'feels off'? Kind of like me and my 'classic' (not old) bike I've riddewn around the clock 4 times. I just know when I need to replace anair filter, I just know when she's firing slightly off ...

Oh, actually ...have you been on other same class and design of ship and it simply 'doesn't feel right' in comparison to an older ship you started your career on? Not merely the different interpersonal dynamics of the crew itself, or with refittings for newer equipment, but the machine in a holistic sense itself just doesn't feel the same? Like it doesn't 'purr' the same (or in the case of the bowels of the ship 'scream')?

MrCalavera:

Sexual Harassment Panda:

Redlin5:

The idea that 'everyone is in on a grand lie' can be intoxicating. Why the fact the Earth is actually flat turned into a popular conspiracy theory will always baffle me.

This.

I clicked the thread to ask what reason they state as to why there's a cover up and need to push the round-earth idea. I don't want to delve into the crap but an abridged version would be neat if anyone is offering.

See, it's great that you were to ask that. I've recently encountered a reddit thread also making fun of flat earthers and someone posted an entire list of answers.


I dunno about you, but i'd pick options C and D and W,T,F.

Ok, wow... to believe the earth is flat Is already stupid enough, but for those reasons? Just stop it, you idiots. "Take your pick?" So, they mean they don't know, but they've wildly speculated and therefore *drops the mic* evidence.

"Free energy?" What does that even mean?

"Hide the creator?" So, hundreds of years ago, mankind did some Wizard of Oz-type yanking back of the curtain, discovered the all-powerful deity responsible for existence, and decided to hide this discovery with what would quite literally be the most complex lie in the history of ever. Oh, and this all powerful deity has just allowed this to happen.

"Hide your spirituality" What does that even mean? You can't hide an intangible, subjective quality of another person let alone those of ALL the non-Christians who know better than the flat earthers and have no interest for their supposed fishbowl described in the Bible.

"Hide more land/resources?" And "they're" saving all this land and resources foooooooooor? I mean, for this lie to work, they have to be a pretty tightly-knit group; "all of Antarctica and it virginial resources" seems like a lot to withhold for what objectively has to be very few. Let alone SELLING and meting out land and resources is something more in line with a prototypical clandestine world power.

"Hide scientific knowledge?" Ok, now they're hypocrisy is showing. They refuse to believe science, but believe science might be hiding valuable science in Antarctica. Let that sink into their flat heads...

"Hide what's in Antarctica?" I pains me to even dignify that with a response. Instead of appearing as the sixth item on a list of reasons for a flat earth deception, this could have just be made the title of the list and spared us their ambiguous, baseless speculations.

"Hide that you are the center of the universe/that you are special?" This is just infantile. For centuries, the world's governments have colluded to make people feel "less special?" Fuck right off with that nonsense. If anything, I can lend credence to a vast, amazing universe that we might not be the center of, but are extraordinarily special in that we've yet to see anything like us, that in the infinite expanse of the universe, our little blue BALL is the most incredible one. I'd like to think God is capable of at least a little more than what essentially equates to an ant farm. One thing we can certainly agree on, flat earthers: you all are in-fucking-deed "special."

Dalisclock:
I know you guys aren't the ones to be asking questions because you're not flat earthers but I'm having fun asking really simple questions and trying to see how the flat earthers try to explain it away.

Oh, I completely understand. That mentality is exactly how I found myself as far down this rabbit hole of idiocy as I have, inundated by "flat earth" videos trying to wrap my head around the utter nonsensicalness of it all. I could actually talk to some of them and try to have a serious discussion, but I don't want to risk getting too close to that much concentrated stupid for any prolonged period of time; it's got to be mildly radioactive at least. Also, it feels good when I can share the experience of the utterly incredulous with someone!

Palindromemordnilap:
How is it hiding more land? Surely there's less land with a flat earth theory because you've taken a 3D shape and flattened it out? Either that or both have the exact same amount of land because you've got all the same continents. I realise you've got some batshit logic to believe in a flat earth to start with, but that just makes no sense

It doesn't have to make sense when you believe every alternative is a lie; instead of thinking it through and actually explaining themselves, they just smirk and shake their heads at how "indoctrinated" we all are to the lie. Asking an rational question of flat earthers and expecting the obvious answer is like asking a toddler to make change for a $100 bill; what you'll get will likely be sticky, covered in slobber and worth significantly less than $100; my brain is filled with the empty fruit cups and snack-packs of Cheerios from flat earth rationale. It'd almost be cute if these people didn't also drive cars, have jobs, y'known, the myriad tasks of day-to-day life that require complex mental functions and logic. Some of the more prominent flat earthers have said that if NASA would turn the Hubble telescope around and take a picture of the round earth, they'd admit they were wrong, but flat earthers also contest every picture NASA has ever taken "from space" is fake. So they want NASA to take pictures from space as proof that NASA's pictures from space aren't fake. This is how you simply can't win against that much stupid.

Xprimentyl:
Some of the more prominent flat earthers have said that if NASA would turn the Hubble telescope around and take a picture of the round earth, they?d admit they were wrong, but flat earthers also contest every picture NASA has ever taken ?from space? is fake. So they want NASA to take pictures from space as proof that NASA?s pictures from space aren?t fake. This is how you simply can?t win against that much stupid.

I once had a coworker try to convince me that the Hubble was actually a spy satellite because....reasons. I sometimes wonder if he wasn't a flat earther and we just never broached the topic. He also believed Evolution wasn't real.

Xprimentyl:

?Hide scientific knowledge?? Ok, now they?re hypocrisy is showing. They refuse to believe science, but believe science might be hiding valuable science in Antarctica. Let that sink into their flat heads?

?Hide what?s in Antarctica?? I pains me to even dignify that with a response. Instead of appearing as the sixth item on a list of reasons for a flat earth deception, this could have just be made the title of the list and spared us their ambiguous, baseless speculations.

?Hide that you are the center of the universe/that you are special?? This is just infantile. For centuries, the world?s governments have colluded to make people feel ?less special?? Fuck right off with that nonsense. If anything, I can lend credence to a vast, amazing universe that we might not be the center of, but are extraordinarily special in that we?ve yet to see anything like us, that in the infinite expanse of the universe, our little blue BALL is the most incredible one. I?d like to think God is capable of at least a little more than what essentially equates to an ant farm. One thing we can certainly agree on, flat earthers: you all are in-fucking-deed ?special.?

Hiding Scientific Knowledge/Hiding what's in Antartica: Unless the flat earthers are implying that Lovecraft's "At the Mountains of Madness" was more then just fiction, I'm not sure where they're going with this. Or is there a secret Nazi base/entrance to the hollow earth down there?

As for "You are the center of the universe/special", isn't that essentially the point of Tribalism/Nationalism/Patriotism/most religions/Narcissm/Racism/most other -isms, that you are the special, or you are one of the special people? I don't the world really suffers from a lack of people feeling they're part of the most important group in some way. "I am part of the best political party", "This is the best country on earth", "We are the smartest" "We are the most enlightened" "We are the real [X]". This are not rare attitudes among humans, they're pretty fucking common. Exactly how does hiding a flat earth change anything?

Dalisclock:
As for "You are the center of the universe/special", isn't that essentially the point of Tribalism/Nationalism/Patriotism/most religions/Narcissm/Racism/most other -isms, that you are the special, or you are one of the special people? I don't the world really suffers from a lack of people feeling they're part of the most important group in some way. "I am part of the best political party", "This is the best country on earth", "We are the smartest" "We are the most enlightened" "We are the real [X]". This are not rare attitudes among humans, they're pretty fucking common. Exactly how does hiding a flat earth change anything?

This makes me think of something I'd like to hear a flat earther explain: are they not collectively guilty of Pride, i.e. one of the seven deadly sins? More irony, or hypocrisy, that they want to throw the literal words of the bible at any and all logic and reason that defies their beliefs in a quest for affirmation of this heaven-sent uniqueness, as proof that God dotes on them in this fishbowl made just for us because we're so damned great. Explains the arrogance with which they simply refuse to consider the intelligence of others, the studies and discoveries that came long before their bible was even a thing. Also, that man alone has been able to hide God and the truth of His creation from everyone, does that not mean God has been subjugate by man? What is more prideful that that, the idea that uniquely special mankind somehow has dominion over the very God that made them so uniquely special? There's a special place in Flat Hell for that kind of mortal sinning, flat earthers...

"Winning an argument with a smart person is difficult; winning an argument with an arrogant idiot is impossible."

Dalisclock:
Hiding Scientific Knowledge/Hiding what's in Antartica: Unless the flat earthers are implying that Lovecraft's "At the Mountains of Madness" was more then just fiction, I'm not sure where they're going with this. Or is there a secret Nazi base/entrance to the hollow earth down there?

Surely believing in a flat Earth means you've ruled out a hollow Earth? Unless you think the earth is flat but, like, super thick I suppose...

Palindromemordnilap:

Dalisclock:
Hiding Scientific Knowledge/Hiding what's in Antartica: Unless the flat earthers are implying that Lovecraft's "At the Mountains of Madness" was more then just fiction, I'm not sure where they're going with this. Or is there a secret Nazi base/entrance to the hollow earth down there?

Surely believing in a flat Earth means you've ruled out a hollow Earth? Unless you think the earth is flat but, like, super thick I suppose...

You'd think but Flat Earth-ism is so ridiculous that I wouldn't rule it out. Logic need not apply so why restrict yourself?

Palindromemordnilap:

Dalisclock:
Hiding Scientific Knowledge/Hiding what's in Antartica: Unless the flat earthers are implying that Lovecraft's "At the Mountains of Madness" was more then just fiction, I'm not sure where they're going with this. Or is there a secret Nazi base/entrance to the hollow earth down there?

Surely believing in a flat Earth means you've ruled out a hollow Earth? Unless you think the earth is flat but, like, super thick I suppose...

image

Dirty Hipsters:

image

Holy crap, I'm seeing 4 South-Americas and 4 Africas in there. Which of course begs the question: which is the evil one?

Chimpzy:

Dirty Hipsters:

Holy crap, I'm seeing 4 South-Americas and 4 Africas in there. Which of course begs the question: which is the evil one?

Obviously the one with the goatee.

Ok, after listening to several +1 hour-long hosted debates between Flat Earther's and their logical debunkers on YouTube, I've come to a pretty shocking conclusion: I think there might be some truth to this whole Flat Earth idea.

Now, now, before you judge, I'm fucking kidding; my brain hurts. But I have decided there's a dark and sordid side to it all, meaning beyond the mindlessly idiotic, I think there's some genuine, intentional, cult-like manipulation and God complexes at work. Hearing some of the more "prominent" flat earthers and their willingly ignoring, inability to refute and outright refusal to face stark facts and evidence put before them, it's clear there's some overt narcissism and clinical psychopathy at play; they literally having nothing save for the ability to prey upon the weak-minded. Flat Earth Hero, who sounds completely ignorant before even prescribing the flat earth aspect, posted a video (manifesto) stating his mission to "bring forth heaven on earth" and "become a leader." He also went so far as to put forth a challenge to debunkers in which he promised to pay $100,000 dollars (he looks and sounds like he might have $38 to his name) to anyone who can "prove" the spherical earth using flight charts. This challenge brought him near instant fame/infamy within the flat earth and debunking communities respectively; it was quickly accepted and beaten, and he's since back-peddled doing the whole "no, what I meant was" moving of the goal posts. A YouTuber named Jeran coyly says he just wants people to know "the truth" and never intended to start a religious-like movement is spreading his truth via his moniker... Jeranism. With +128K followers. And he's got a Patreon.

There's a bunch more, and most fall somewhere between clear trolls like Delano (who couldn't be taken seriously if he tried his hardest) and idiots simply repeating shit trolls, con artists and/or other idiots of have said before, but there are just enough that are honestly disturbing in their narcissistic, psychopathic delusion to be concerning. I'm a bit concerned for my friend (the reason for this thread;) I want to put him into the "idiot-repeating-idiots" category, but I also know him to be passionate, stubborn and knee-jerky enough to do something stupid like donate to a Jeran or other "truth-seeking," flat earth cause. As he's a new father to my goddaughter and not rich or influential by any stretch of the imagination, I feel like I need to do something before he does. I don't know what that is, but ignoring it while he digs further and further in feels irresponsible?

It was probably easier to have sent people to space than to do all the steps necessary over the course of centuries to cover up that the Earth is flat. Also, like, why? I understand 9/11 conspiracy theories about how it was done on purpose as an excuse to go to war, etc. there's a REASON for a conspiracy. What reason would there be to lie to you about the Earth being flat? Are they trying to trick you into sailing off the edge of the world by telling you the Earth is round? Is there some kind of treasure at the edge of the world that are being hidden?

Gatx:
It was probably easier to have sent people to space than to do all the steps necessary over the course of centuries to cover up that the Earth is flat. Also, like, why? I understand 9/11 conspiracy theories about how it was done on purpose as an excuse to go to war, etc. there's a REASON for a conspiracy. What reason would there be to lie to you about the Earth being flat? Are they trying to trick you into sailing off the edge of the world by telling you the Earth is round? Is there some kind of treasure at the edge of the world that are being hidden?

They only thing I can think of is for the sake of feeling special (in the sense of "I'm different from all those sheep-people, and even better because I don't get dissuaded by conventional knowledge")

CaitSeith:

Gatx:
It was probably easier to have sent people to space than to do all the steps necessary over the course of centuries to cover up that the Earth is flat. Also, like, why? I understand 9/11 conspiracy theories about how it was done on purpose as an excuse to go to war, etc. there's a REASON for a conspiracy. What reason would there be to lie to you about the Earth being flat? Are they trying to trick you into sailing off the edge of the world by telling you the Earth is round? Is there some kind of treasure at the edge of the world that are being hidden?

They only thing I can think of is for the sake of feeling special (in the sense of "I'm different from all those sheep-people, and even better because I don't get dissuaded by conventional knowledge")

Which is wierd because there are plenty of ways of feeling special. Such as....
-Create something new and interesting.
-Discover something that has never been seen before.
-Solve a mystery that has baffled people for years/centuries. Like, actually solve it, with evidence, not just make up a bizarre theory about space aliens and such.
-Build meaningful relationships with people.
-Find a hobby you enjoy.
-Get a job that makes you feel useful and fulfilled.
-Join a religion and achieve some kind of spiritual satisfaction.
-Join a cult where only you are heir to Cthulhu's secret knowledge(I ain't judging).
-Have an over-inflated sense of your own self worth in the face of overwhelming evidence to Contrary(AKA Donald Trump Syndrome).
-ETC

Seriously, Feeling special ain't hard. Why choose the most possibly idiotic way to accomplish this goal?

Dalisclock:
Seriously, Feeling special ain't hard. Why choose the most possibly idiotic way to accomplish this goal?

Because most of those take actual effort, and the rest are really just variations on the theme.

Xprimentyl:
Ok, after listening to several +1 hour-long hosted debates between Flat Earther?s and their logical debunkers on YouTube, I?ve come to a pretty shocking conclusion: I think there might be some truth to this whole Flat Earth idea.

Now, now, before you judge, I?m fucking kidding; my brain hurts. But I have decided there?s a dark and sordid side to it all, meaning beyond the mindlessly idiotic, I think there?s some genuine, intentional, cult-like manipulation and God complexes at work. Hearing some of the more ?prominent? flat earthers and their willingly ignoring, inability to refute and outright refusal to face stark facts and evidence put before them, it?s clear there?s some overt narcissism and clinical psychopathy at play; they literally having nothing save for the ability to prey upon the weak-minded. Flat Earth Hero, who sounds completely ignorant before even prescribing the flat earth aspect, posted a video (manifesto) stating his mission to ?bring forth heaven on earth? and ?become a leader.? He also went so far as to put forth a challenge to debunkers in which he promised to pay $100,000 dollars (he looks and sounds like he might have $38 to his name) to anyone who can ?prove? the spherical earth using flight charts. This challenge brought him near instant fame/infamy within the flat earth and debunking communities respectively; it was quickly accepted and beaten, and he?s since back-peddled doing the whole ?no, what I meant was? moving of the goal posts. A YouTuber named Jeran coyly says he just wants people to know ?the truth? and never intended to start a religious-like movement is spreading his truth via his moniker? Jeranism. With +128K followers. And he?s got a Patreon.

There?s a bunch more, and most fall somewhere between clear trolls like Delano (who couldn?t be taken seriously if he tried his hardest) and idiots simply repeating shit trolls, con artists and/or other idiots of have said before, but there are just enough that are honestly disturbing in their narcissistic, psychopathic delusion to be concerning. I?m a bit concerned for my friend (the reason for this thread;) I want to put him into the ?idiot-repeating-idiots? category, but I also know him to be passionate, stubborn and knee-jerky enough to do something stupid like donate to a Jeran or other ?truth-seeking,? flat earth cause. As he?s a new father to my goddaughter and not rich or influential by any stretch of the imagination, I feel like I need to do something before he does. I don?t know what that is, but ignoring it while he digs further and further in feels irresponsible?

You gotta get rid of that child. Flat earthers can't be allowed to breed.

Xprimentyl:
I think there's some genuine, intentional, cult-like manipulation and God complexes at work.

As someone living with a mother who believes in almost every conspiracy under the sun; including the Romaine Lettuce contamination being a conspiracy to irradiate all of the lettuce to remove the nutrients(???) and that Marijuana is illegal because it's actually a cure for cancer (I don't know if Flat-earth is included, but no way am I asking)...

A cult is definitely an apt thing to call conspiracy theories.
At their core, these larger conspiracies are religions. They believe this big invisible bad entity is causing all of their grief, and if they just BELIEVE hard enough, they'll defeat it and everything will be wonderful. There is very little you can do to change their mind, because they've not only had their entire worldview shifted, but they've invested so much into it that admitting they were wrong could be devastating. Imagine you spent 8 years of your adult life leaving everyone else behind to isolate yourself into a small community, and then having someone tell you those past 8 years were embarrassingly bad and your new friends are too (and would drop you like a hat the second you stopped believing).

And yes, they most definitely pick followers up from both the desperate and the gullible. When you feel like the world has kicked you down, there's always a cult to say "You're not bad, you're special, and if you believe in what I say, you're better than the rest of the world. It's not your fault, X did it. Here, look at all these people that will be your new friends, all you have to do is believe in the same thing as us."

Funnily enough, as strong as my mother would say her beliefs are, she clearly wavers when she feels in danger. She's all for "Natural cure-alls", but when they don't work and she starts feeling really bad, that's when she caves and goes to a real doctor. She never learns from it.

Nuuu:

Xprimentyl:
I think there's some genuine, intentional, cult-like manipulation and God complexes at work.

As someone living with a mother who believes in almost every conspiracy under the sun; including the Romaine Lettuce contamination being a conspiracy to irradiate all of the lettuce to remove the nutrients(???) and that Marijuana is illegal because it's actually a cure for cancer (I don't know if Flat-earth is included, but no way am I asking)...

A cult is definitely an apt thing to call conspiracy theories.
At their core, these larger conspiracies are religions. They believe this big invisible bad entity is causing all of their grief, and if they just BELIEVE hard enough, they'll defeat it and everything will be wonderful. There is very little you can do to change their mind, because they've not only had their entire worldview shifted, but they've invested so much into it that admitting they were wrong could be devastating. Imagine you spent 8 years of your adult life leaving everyone else behind to isolate yourself into a small community, and then having someone tell you those past 8 years were embarrassingly bad and your new friends are too (and would drop you like a hat the second you stopped believing).

And yes, they most definitely pick followers up from both the desperate and the gullible. When you feel like the world has kicked you down, there's always a cult to say "You're not bad, you're special, and if you believe in what I say, you're better than the rest of the world. It's not your fault, X did it. Here, look at all these people that will be your new friends, all you have to do is believe in the same thing as us."

Funnily enough, as strong as my mother would say her beliefs are, she clearly wavers when she feels in danger. She's all for "Natural cure-alls", but when they don't work and she starts feeling really bad, that's when she caves and goes to a real doctor. She never learns from it.

What's worse is that is just another form of conformity. Making them no better than the "sheeple" they mock or despise.

As for your mom's case, you should show her the clip from Far Cry 3. You know the one. That will help her learn.

If you find yourself alone and feeling down on yourself this weekend, the documentary Behind The Curve is on Netflix; watch it, and you'll instantly feel better about yourself.

It's an earnest documentary shot by a non-flat earther that simply gives flat earthers a platform to say their piece. No mocking or jabs at their intelligence, just flat earthers explaining themselves, and from time to time a voice of reason like a scientist or doctor will weigh in; it's "The Office," but ten times the cringe because it's not scripted. They speak to several of the more prominent figureheads from the flat earth community, and egomania runs rampant (i.e.: each claiming to be the reason for the flat earth movement while discrediting the others.) It's sad, scary, perplexing, but it's mostly pathetic, particularly the awkward implied romance between Mark Sargent and Patricia Steer, ugh, it's physically painful to see him get "friend zoned" by her each time they're on screen together. Worth the watch, I guess, nonfiction about staunch believers of fiction.

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