Samtemdo8:

Lil devils x:

Eacaraxe:
The world's wealthiest people are in a space race to privately develop habitable environments beyond Earth, while actively perpetuating the problems in the first place. Exactly how much hope do you think the rest of us should have at this point?

We should be hopeful they are stupid enough to leave off into space so the rest of us can fix what we have here. Maybe we will get lucky and rogue hackers will redirect their ships into the sun.

Ok what is with this bullshit conspiratorial nonsense that the world's elite will build a rocket ship and fly to a planet they can go to while Earth dies?

Its asinine and ridiculous. We only just got to the moon and that was an expensive process.

It started after the whole Elon Musk starting SpaceX and stating they will offer spaceflights for the wealthy.

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/spacex-says-japanese-billionaire-will-be-first-passenger-moon-flight-ncna910441

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/09/style/axiom-space-travel.html
https://www.space.com/elon-musk-spacex-mars-mission-price.html

It just grew from there.

CaitSeith:

Unfortunately that's not the way those who are impacting the global environment see it. Moreover, changing the climate on the opposite direction to undo what has been done is impossible in the current circumstances (a massive coordinated effort is required just to slow down the current trend, and the key people aren't willing).

EDIT: I mean, it would be interesting if we eventually manage to create the means to undo the change, and manipulate the global climate to fit our needs, as the technique could be to terraform other planets; but we need to hurry, because the infrastructure that allows us to do so may be compromised if all resources have to be dedicated to handling the increase in natural disasters and the effects of extreme weather.

We could reverse the trend in like 10 years, all it takes is a bunch of carbon-free energy. First, energy to replace what's generated from fossil fuels, and second to operate carbon sequestration technology. Scientists come up with a new way to suck carbon dioxide out of the air and/or turn it into useful products like every other week, and the downfall of the technology every single time is that the process they invented takes more energy to hide the carbon than burning an equivalent amount of fossil fuels would produce.

But if we had some kind of energy technology that could be scaled up quickly to support whole nations and operate in any location that has water to cool towers and relative geologic stability, that released no carbon emissions from energy production and used a type of fuel that's used for almost nothing else, wouldn't that just be amazing? We could reverse climate change with more clean power, we could recycle all our waste with more clean power, we could make ocean water potable to relieve droughts with more clean power, we could set up whatever transportation systems we want with more clean power, we could eliminate most of the smog with more clean power, think of the grand environmental gains we could have with more clean power.

Unfortunately, it feels like nuclear was never invented.

tstorm823:
[quote="CaitSeith" post="18.1057059.24306039"]...carbon sequestration technology.

...and there's the problem. We have no carbon sequestration technologies, nor any on the horizon, efficient or effective enough to implement on a global scale. Besides that, any hypothetical carbon sequestration technology wouldn't just have to match and exceed carbon release, it would have to match and exceed global deforestation and desertification.

Global reforestation is what it would take, and global reclamation of desertified land. Good luck with that.

Eacaraxe:

tstorm823:

CaitSeith:
...carbon sequestration technology.

...and there's the problem. We have no carbon sequestration technologies, nor any on the horizon, efficient or effective enough to implement on a global scale. Besides that, any hypothetical carbon sequestration technology wouldn't just have to match and exceed carbon release, it would have to match and exceed global deforestation and desertification.

Global reforestation is what it would take, and global reclamation of desertified land. Good luck with that.

One of the technologies that is closest to working apparently is seeding with the air with a chemical I cant quite remember but the end product (to get the carbon on the ground) causes acid rain. Which will cause all sort of havoc to wildlife, plant life, water tables and us. A solution is create acid rain... and as far as I've heard, it might be our best option (other than going renewable and reforesting)

EDIT

tstorm823:

Unfortunately, it feels like nuclear was never invented.

It's called marketing by coal companies. Gotta protect those profits

tstorm823:

CaitSeith:

Unfortunately that's not the way those who are impacting the global environment see it. Moreover, changing the climate on the opposite direction to undo what has been done is impossible in the current circumstances (a massive coordinated effort is required just to slow down the current trend, and the key people aren't willing).

EDIT: I mean, it would be interesting if we eventually manage to create the means to undo the change, and manipulate the global climate to fit our needs, as the technique could be to terraform other planets; but we need to hurry, because the infrastructure that allows us to do so may be compromised if all resources have to be dedicated to handling the increase in natural disasters and the effects of extreme weather.

We could reverse the trend in like 10 years, all it takes is a bunch of carbon-free energy. First, energy to replace what's generated from fossil fuels, and second to operate carbon sequestration technology. Scientists come up with a new way to suck carbon dioxide out of the air and/or turn it into useful products like every other week, and the downfall of the technology every single time is that the process they invented takes more energy to hide the carbon than burning an equivalent amount of fossil fuels would produce.

But if we had some kind of energy technology that could be scaled up quickly to support whole nations and operate in any location that has water to cool towers and relative geologic stability, that released no carbon emissions from energy production and used a type of fuel that's used for almost nothing else, wouldn't that just be amazing? We could reverse climate change with more clean power, we could recycle all our waste with more clean power, we could make ocean water potable to relieve droughts with more clean power, we could set up whatever transportation systems we want with more clean power, we could eliminate most of the smog with more clean power, think of the grand environmental gains we could have with more clean power.

Unfortunately, it feels like nuclear was never invented.

Whatever scientists come up doesn't matter if it doesn't get implemented; and the people that have the resources to implement them don't seem inclined to do so anytime soon. Maybe if scientists think how to make sucking massive amounts of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere not only doable but profitable, maybe actual progress would start happening (I'm being only half sarcastic here, because right now it's more profitable to hamper the implementation of such tech).

CaitSeith:

Whatever scientists come up doesn't matter if it doesn't get implemented; and the people that have the resources to implement them don't seem inclined to do so anytime soon. Maybe if scientists think how to make sucking massive amounts of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere not only doable but profitable, maybe actual progress would start happening (I'm being only half sarcastic here, because right now it's more profitable to hamper the implementation of such tech).

It is profitable (theoretically). The processes being invented for carbon sequestration turn carbon dioxide and/or methane into things like carbon fiber, thermoplastics, ethanol, etc. You can make useful consumer products literally out of thin air. The only issue really is that it's all very energy inefficient, so it would require a large increase in energy production, and our current method of increasing energy infrastructure is fossil fuels. Renewables are nice, but powering our current energy demands and trying to power fixing the environment would require coating like 20% of the earth in hardware (given current technology), a prospect that's both implausible and environmentally destructive in its own way. If we could just get back on track with nuclear, we could solve the problems.

tstorm823:

CaitSeith:

Whatever scientists come up doesn't matter if it doesn't get implemented; and the people that have the resources to implement them don't seem inclined to do so anytime soon. Maybe if scientists think how to make sucking massive amounts of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere not only doable but profitable, maybe actual progress would start happening (I'm being only half sarcastic here, because right now it's more profitable to hamper the implementation of such tech).

It is profitable (theoretically). The processes being invented for carbon sequestration turn carbon dioxide and/or methane into things like carbon fiber, thermoplastics, ethanol, etc. You can make useful consumer products literally out of thin air. The only issue really is that it's all very energy inefficient, so it would require a large increase in energy production, and our current method of increasing energy infrastructure is fossil fuels. Renewables are nice, but powering our current energy demands and trying to power fixing the environment would require coating like 20% of the earth in hardware (given current technology), a prospect that's both implausible and environmentally destructive in its own way. If we could just get back on track with nuclear, we could solve the problems.

We'd probably need to do something as drastic when we terraform other planets in the future anyways. Why not terraform Earth back to shape?

I do.

Depends on the day. I'm gonna be stubborn for the time being, but I reserve the right to go out, buy a pistol, and blow my brains out if it becomes clear that we've passed a point of no return.

...Talking about this shit really isn't healthy for me or for my mood.

I mean on the one hand the right is making a comeback. On the other, there's evidence to suggest that this is a last, desperate gasp as right-wing politics are utterly failing to find the same support among Millenials and Gen Z as they did Baby Boomers, the people who actually give a damn about the planet and human rights. And there's only so many more elections before baby-boomers start succumbing to old age. So there is hope to be found. Will it be enough? I don't know. But there's a reason I'm waiting on going out and buying that gun.

Though I am considering buying a gun for self-defense purposes now. If, god forbid, a deranged, hateful lunatic ever breaks into my house, I have no intention of being the one who dies for their delusional philosophy.

I do have hope, just not for myself. Does that make sense?

I recently went to Indiana for a month and the people there were so friendly, I didn't hear a car horn once. Well, okay one time but that's because I was with my friend, who isn't from there. I was flabbergasted. Get some alternate perspectives, stop hanging around with people who bring you down or encourage the bad parts of your relationships.

Even though I have no feelings on marriage nowadays, I still meet good, young people who ARE getting married and they don't seem to care about others who are for/against marriage. They just wanted to do it and I say good for them. Those are people with hope, not just for themselves, but for each other.

Go to college, get married, have kids. Or don't. The world will go on, despite what current events indicate.

Samtemdo8:

erttheking:
Depends on the day. I'm gonna be stubborn for the time being, but I reserve the right to go out, buy a pistol, and blow my brains out if it becomes clear that we've passed a point of no return.

Don't, I 'd rather let mother nature take me in an end of the world scenario.

Eh? Mother nature is slow, a gun is quick. a 'Kills Sammy' disaster could take decades to get you. A gun is gonna get you day 1

FYI, this is going to be entirley from an American perspective. I don't feel like specifying that constantly. Depends on how nihilistic I'm feeling the day you ask. Today probably isn't a good day to ask. An article on CNN about how most people think we'll get another four years of our fearless leader made me realize I agree with them! I don't want it, but I'm pretty sure it's gonna happen. I have zero faith in the left actually uniting together and realizing we have no choice but to work with the Liberals. It's a two-party system and not voting isn't a solution. Unless we're picking up weapons, we gotta play by their rules. Not voting is how the right maintains control. The recent abortion laws make me feel like I'm going traveling back in time and the situation on the border is just sickening. We'll probably have another mass shooting before the month is out.

And that's just the states! I'm pretty sure the U.K. is gonna get fucked with Brexit. Can't wait for the Troubles 2: Electric Bogaloo on the Irish border and of course the economic fallout. Can't wait to see what shitty PM they get to replace the last one. France is fucked because they don't realize that fucking over the middle and lower class is not the way to fight Climate Change, maybe actually target the people responsible for 99.9% of it.

And man, that's just all the shit I feel like typing. I'll consider myself lucky if I die of natural causes right now.

Hawki:
So...yeah.

I must admit that at this point, if you were asking me this, the answer is no. And the main reasons is down to climate change, the problems it'll cause, and the issues that are driving it.

It's reached the point where I've found it difficult to engage in hobbies - like, I've found myself actively forcing myself to comment on this site, because I just need some level of relief from this constant sense of despair I've had ever since the last ICCC report. And for every bit of positive news, there's about ten bits of negative news. That's not even going into how my country's just elected a prime minister who brought a lump of coal into parliment to show everyone that there was nothing to worry about. Or how we could be facing 3 degrees warming by the end of the century, or societal collapse by 2050. Or how throughout all of human history, we've never lived in a world that's been 1 C less or more than pre-industrial times, whereas even a 1.5 C warming would be a period unlike anything we've seen. That's not even taking in the moral issues of flora and fauna.

That said, I guess I wanted this topic to be more inclusive - I'm sure we all have our own fears and hopes for the next century, or half century, or however far you want to look ahead. So I guess the question is what's your outlook for the 21st century, and what are the issues that keep you up at night? You know what issue weighs down on me the most, but it's still not the only one. Like, is it the end of the world as you know it, or do you only fear fear itself?

Or both? 0_0

Oh please, in regards to temperature change, the Earth has run the gamut of high and low temperatures for millions of years, life can survive temperature change. What we're causing a problem with is destruction of life and creation of harmful chemicals, radiation, and garbage. There's too many humans and too many of us taking from the land at the cost of everything else.

Silentpony:

Eh? Mother nature is slow, a gun is quick. a 'Kills Sammy' disaster could take decades to get you. A gun is gonna get you day 1

The disaster could also not kill you, I hope you are aware.

"If you see ten troubles coming down the road, you can be sure that nine will run into the ditch before they reach you."
Calvin Coolidge

tstorm823:
Would you prefer that people couldn't impact the earth's climate? Would you prefer that we were trapped in Earth's natural cycles that would plummet us into another glacial period that makes half the globe uninhabitably frozen over with no way to grow food?

Man-made climate change is baby's first step into becoming a civilization that can control the environment. It's absolutely true that you need to worry more about a walking toddler hurting themselves than an infant stuck on their belly, but we don't panic and despair and wait for the infant to kill themselves, we celebrate first steps because learning to walk is what will allow that person to take care of themselves.

Humanity has gained the ability to impact the environment on a global scale, and we will inevitably learn to use that power to maintain the climate we need to thrive rather than depend on the coincidental conditions of nature to cradle us gently. That's awesome. Have a little more optimism.

Being able to change the climate is pretty terrifying when you think of the fact that right now, the places causing the worst global warming won't be the worst effected, until the refugees come and possibly full on invasions anyway.

What happens when somebody changes the climate to better suit them and either don't care or actively weaponises the fact it causes tsunamis and flooding around the equator?

I don't know. I think we might be kinda fucked. Like, I think we might have passed the critical point of no return on things like climate change and just the alliances we have and just general international working together. I feel like we are closer to flinging nukes at each other then we have been in a very very long time.

However, the thing that gives me pause as to thinking we are totally fucked is that the younger generation seems to doing things right and it sounds like they will outnumber the older generation very soon so hopefully they can keep that youthful exuberance and make their voices and demands for social progress heard. I think at least in this country, this might be the first time when the youth generation could really make a difference and they seem to have it in their head to do so and have the numbers needed.

Worgen:

However, the thing that gives me pause as to thinking we are totally fucked is that the younger generation seems to doing things right and it sounds like they will outnumber the older generation very soon so hopefully they can keep that youthful exuberance and make their voices and demands for social progress heard. I think at least in this country, this might be the first time when the youth generation could really make a difference and they seem to have it in their head to do so and have the numbers needed.

Pretty much this. I'm just waiting for the politicians to die off and to be taken over by millennials.

Marik2:

Worgen:

However, the thing that gives me pause as to thinking we are totally fucked is that the younger generation seems to doing things right and it sounds like they will outnumber the older generation very soon so hopefully they can keep that youthful exuberance and make their voices and demands for social progress heard. I think at least in this country, this might be the first time when the youth generation could really make a difference and they seem to have it in their head to do so and have the numbers needed.

Pretty much this. I'm just waiting for the politicians to die off and to be taken over by millennials.

Part of the problem with that is how things work in the states. A lot of the younger generation are in cities and such, but with how the electoral system works. That actually limits how much influence they have and gives a lot more power to less populated states. IE, ones with an older population.

Yeah I'm pretty sure things will work out, one way or another

Samtemdo8:

Silentpony:

Samtemdo8:

Don't, I 'd rather let mother nature take me in an end of the world scenario.

Eh? Mother nature is slow, a gun is quick. a 'Kills Sammy' disaster could take decades to get you. A gun is gonna get you day 1

Hmm, I was more thinking to get washed away by a tidal wave or consumed by an earthquake or blown away by a hurricane. The last of which kinda sounds epic because at least you get to by high in the sky.

Yeah but the sky part doesn't kill you. Its the flying debris, the chuck of rock cracking your ribs and splintering your lungs, the nail through the eye, the steal rod through the Peripheral artery and then the literal back-breaking crash to the ground, dragged for a hundred feet, skin on the back tearing off in strips, muscle and bone breaking off, to come to a bloody heap, hopefully dead, looking like Pyramid Head got you and you forgot the safe word.

The future is an illusion. Life is just a connection of nows. You never live in the future. It'll always be there outside your reach teasing you with the promise of untapped potential. You have to enjoy the now cause that's the only real thing. Putting off joy for the sake of a utopian future full of rainbows and unicorns is the only real way of having a bad life. You can have long term goals but you must live them daily, they must be your present. They must be part of your continued existence. If you notice you're just suffering through a meaningless life for the sake of some promise then that's a sign you need to examine your situation critically. No goal worth striving for feels hollow as you strive for it.

As for hope, that's something you need to do when not in control of your situation. I have expectations and aims and so on but I don't hope for them. I merely tackle them straightforwardly and do my best to not disappoint myself at my efforts. That's all you really need. If you fail at something then that's just how you measured up, hoping you wouldn't is kinda like asking to cheat your way into unearned privilege despite your faults, it's unseemly.

tstorm823:

But if we had some kind of energy technology that could be scaled up quickly to support whole nations and operate in any location that has water to cool towers and relative geologic stability, that released no carbon emissions from energy production and used a type of fuel that's used for almost nothing else, wouldn't that just be amazing? We could reverse climate change with more clean power, we could recycle all our waste with more clean power, we could make ocean water potable to relieve droughts with more clean power, we could set up whatever transportation systems we want with more clean power, we could eliminate most of the smog with more clean power, think of the grand environmental gains we could have with more clean power.

Never bet on technology you don't yet have. It's like nuclear fusion: experts kept predicting it was 50 years away for decades. At least it's finally come down now and current estimates are about 30 - but I still wouldn't put that past being the calculated optimism of people who want to win physics research grants.

Specter Von Baren:
Oh please, in regards to temperature change, the Earth has run the gamut of high and low temperatures for millions of years

Not whilst we've lived on it, it hasn't.

I don't think the problem is that the human race faces annihilation. It's that it faces mass shortages of key things like food. That will lead to animal and plant extinction, mass starvation, refugees, resource wars, and general unhappiness and decreases in living standards that will probably be global. Quite how bad is anther matter. We might be talking about losing a decade or a few decades of development, and in a catastrophe situation, centuries.

To be honest, I don't know. I just know that this will be determined by others, regardless of what I do. So I can only go about my daily life as best I can, hoping for good things but preparing for the worst.

Let's see here...

First, we've got a total wackjob as president, that was evident not just from day 1 but while he was campaigning, yet he was voted in anyway. That's not what kills all hope in me, what does is the fact that Trump's opponent would be barely if any better and that it couldn't have been more obvious that was the case if and yet, people still pretend like elections actually make a difference. If it did, people like Trump and Hilary would be lucky if they could be receptionists at some backwater City Hall somewhere let alone have any chance at all of getting into some sort of elected position, President of the United States is right out. Having to choose between having a live grenade stuffed in your mouth and having a stick of dynamite stuffed in your mouth isn't a choice yet that's exactly what elections have been for decades now. They're not even putting a token effort to try to make it look like it isn't anymore. That, and the utterly ridiculous 2 party system just means that our choices are extremely limited. What's scary most of all is that not only do the people of this the country believe that their vote actually makes a real difference but are divided along those 2 party lines. It all ends up coming down to "REPUBLICANS BAD!!! VOTE DEMOCRAT!!!" and "DEMOCRATS BAD!!! VOTE REPUBLICAN!!!" that everything political ends up becoming. Rather than, you know, going with someone else entirely that actually has a vast majority of good ideas that actually improve our country our choices are between 2 both who we would be lucky if they had 1 good idea for every 100 terrible ideas they have. What destroys all hope in me is the blatant obviousness of all of this and despite that most people seem to still believe that elections accomplish anything whatsoever.

As for alternate energy sources, climate change, all that, if there's anything humanity has consistently proven it's that we as a whole will just ignore problems until they become so big we just can't anymore. The difference between that and every other problem we've solved is if the year or so tops (if that) it would take for us to fix these problems once we got off our collective rear ends and actually tried to solve them is too long for us to not face cataclysm before we can pull it off.

Let's face it, the human race is far far too widespread and numerous for there to be any chance whatsoever of us going extinct short of something that would render the Earth completely uninhabitable near instantaneously. If a cataclysm happens we're capable of surviving at all we will, and after a few decades or at worst centuries we'll pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and go back to exactly what we were doing before it happened.

In short, no. We'll survive no matter what happens, but we won't thrive for much longer.

Nnnnnnnnnnnnope. I just let myself sit in my own little bubble of a world that only affects me and those around me, and pretend the rest of it in the far off lands of other provinces/countries doesn't exist so I don't collapse under the weight of how much shit is going on. Of course, the world is full of good, and it's not all nightmares and awful like North American media would like you to believe. But for a world that is supposed to be wonderful and amazing, there sure is a lot of crap to weigh it all down. Needless to say, I don't read/watch the news.

You've got corrupt people in the government(s) fighting for every chance they can get to take every right away from its people it can get away with, mega corporations running huge amounts of the world's economy and not sharing a ton of their wealth to benefit anyone but themselves, corruption in politics, an increasingly terrifying level of growth on the internet that has lead to (But is not limited to)... Extremely public levels of racism, sexism, animalistic behaviour, swatting for funsies or to kill the other person, doxxing for the purpose of ruining someone else's life, Us vs Them mentalities fueled further by smaller communities that encourage it, outrage culture, literal fucking Nazis, and so much more. (And if you call right now, we'll DOUBLE the offer!)

I don't even vote. I did it once, never gave a shit to do it again. I don't trust the political system to ever work in my favour. Why would I? The political leaders of each party can spew all the fancy words and flowery nonsense they want of how they wanna change things, but the reality is the world is so fucked with the way it works that I don't have confidence it'll ever change. "But that's what voting them in is for, so they can change things!" Woopie-dingle-fucking-doop, there's enough of a chance they'll just turn around on everything they promised (Or never even get far enough to implement anything they promised) and and screw us over entirely, making my vote end up in the spot of some total asshole. I'd rather not get emotionally invested in a system that I don't believe in.

Not to mention that I'm right smack in the middle of my 20's and I'm seeing a corporate run system that intends on paying me as little as it can get away with, jacking up the price of everything I need to live to the point I'll probably never get what my parents did, all while trying to balance my constantly decreasing state of mental health.

Fantastic

Specter Von Baren:
There's too many humans and too many of us taking from the land at the cost of everything else.

You've got that right. By 2027 the world population is estimated to have quadrupled in the past hundred years, since 1927!

STOP HAVING SO MANY KIDS!

Drathnoxis:

Specter Von Baren:
There's too many humans and too many of us taking from the land at the cost of everything else.

You've got that right. By 2027 the world population is estimated to have quadrupled in the past hundred years, since 1927!

STOP HAVING SO MANY KIDS!

So, Thanos was right all along?

Marik2:

Drathnoxis:

Specter Von Baren:
There's too many humans and too many of us taking from the land at the cost of everything else.

You've got that right. By 2027 the world population is estimated to have quadrupled in the past hundred years, since 1927!

STOP HAVING SO MANY KIDS!

So, Thanos was right all along?

I don't know who that is...