Star Trek Picard and HBO's Watchmen Comic Con Trailers.

Picard looks pretty good.

Watchmen....not so much.

That looks nothing like watchmen. Its a good bet it was just a generic gritty spuerhero show, and focus groups forced it to be renamed a familiar IP just to give it a chance.

Also yay Picard!

Silentpony:
That looks nothing like watchmen. Its a good bet it was just a generic gritty spuerhero show, and focus groups forced it to be renamed a familiar IP just to give it a chance.

Also yay Picard!

I hope that one internet article I read practically begging that HBO take their own original approach to Watchmen rather then adapting the comic faithfully can get bitten hard in the ass if it fails.

Damon Lindeloff is poison.

Like all I wanted, was Zack Snyder's Watchmen with a TV series' pacing and mabye a different music track.

Okay, is it just me, or is STP looking stupid. Like, really stupid. Like, stupid even for Star Trek?

It's got a whole lot of action and flashy ships, and in the middle of it all is an eighty something. This going to be like Generations where we have Shatner trying to be an action hero?

Anyway, if you can snag a Lower Decks trailer, that would be great.

Hawki:
Okay, is it just me, or is STP looking stupid. Like, really stupid. Like, stupid even for Star Trek?

It's got a whole lot of action and flashy ships, and in the middle of it all is an eighty something. This going to be like Generations where we have Shatner trying to be an action hero?

Anyway, if you can snag a Lower Decks trailer, that would be great.

Maybe? From what I've gathered from the trailer the little girl Picard is saving is an ex-Borg Queen so maybe it'll be more mystery with the younger cast doing the action bits?

Hawki:
Okay, is it just me, or is STP looking stupid. Like, really stupid. Like, stupid even for Star Trek?

It's got a whole lot of action and flashy ships, and in the middle of it all is an eighty something. This going to be like Generations where we have Shatner trying to be an action hero?

Anyway, if you can snag a Lower Decks trailer, that would be great.

nvm.

Samtemdo8:

What is STP?

Star Trek: Picard.

...what? Least it gets a better acronym than Star Trek: Discovery (STD).

Hawki:

Samtemdo8:

What is STP?

Star Trek: Picard.

...what? Least it gets a better acronym than Star Trek: Discovery (STD).

Sometimes I get confused by acronyms.

The bloody hell is even going on in the Watchmen trailer? It just seems to be a lot of people with their faces covered prancing around doing violence and I can't tell who is supposed to be doing what...which kind of seems like the point of the show judging by some of the things said, so good job maybe?

Palindromemordnilap:
The bloody hell is even going on in the Watchmen trailer? It just seems to be a lot of people with their faces covered prancing around doing violence and I can't tell who is supposed to be doing what...which kind of seems like the point of the show judging by some of the things said, so good job maybe?

Yeah, based on the trailer I can't figure out which side is supposed to be alt-right and who is supposed to be antifa, so I know intuitively who to root for or against according to my political biases. I can only hope the miniseries falls so short of the original comic's gold standard of quality and insight, that it provides me political grandstanding in bite-sized pieces I don't actually have to think about, and can easily and conveniently regurgitate on demand. Because help me, if it does not pander to my severely lacking attention span and capacity for critical thought, I will be very angry at its writers, directors, and producers and harass them on social media.

Can we do a refresher on why we should hate the Watchmen movie? It's been a while since I've seen/ read both. It glorified rather than horrified with the violence. Stupid sex scenes to Tom Waits. No octopus. Anything else?

Palindromemordnilap:
The bloody hell is even going on in the Watchmen trailer? It just seems to be a lot of people with their faces covered prancing around doing violence and I can't tell who is supposed to be doing what...which kind of seems like the point of the show judging by some of the things said, so good job maybe?

I think it's supposed to be like the Dark Knight but the heroes are making any attempts to stop copycats

I started off very skeptical of Picard, but the trailer does reduce some of my fears. Even the small bits of Picard we get really seem like the same guy from TNG, and as long as it stays true to that at the core, any stylistic updates and tonal changes are fine with me. I'll watch the first couple episodes at least.

trunkage:
Can we do a refresher on why we should hate the Watchmen movie? It's been a while since I've seen/ read both. It glorified rather than horrified with the violence. Stupid sex scenes to Tom Waits. No octopus. Anything else?

Watchmen the comic is about how superheroes are stupid, but the film does everything possible to go against this. The whole thing is rendered in Snyder-wank-vision 100% of the time. He treats every moment as if it's as important and momentous as any other moment which just makes it all feel too slow and self serious. Every line feels like it's part of a speech rather than a conversation, every location is shot in a way that it's obvious that it's a set or a CG backdrop, the costumes (superhero and civilian) all look like costumes rather than actual clothes, and the supersuits are considerably cooler than their comic versions, and Dan Dreiberg isn't nearly schlubby enough. It's not necessarily a bad film, it's so overwrought and high camp that it's actually kind of fun, but in spite of how closely it follows the text of the comic it's not really Watchmen.

I'll watch them when I can, neither having CBS All Access nor HBO. Watchmen looks like it could be interesting depending on what they do with it and Picard feels oddly like "Joss Weedon has some spare Firefly scripts we could adapt." I kind of like the idea of Picard on the run from the Federation (and every other hostile power) trying to do the one thing that's right. Given that whole Lucutus of Borg phase he had, I can't imagine Section 31 (if not Starfleet intelligence itself) not having a contingency plan for him.

Either could soar or fall flat. We'll see.

Tireseas:
I kind of like the idea of Picard on the run...

Oh yeah, because "captain goes rogue/vigilante/fugitive" is something we've never seen in Trek before. Let alone being the entire plot of one of the TNG movies. Honestly, your post somehow made me less enthusiastic for the show due to reminding me of Insurrection and the Voyager finale, and I finally managed to memory hole those just like I have the Highlander sequels that definitely never happened. So thanks?

Hawki:

Samtemdo8:

What is STP?

Star Trek: Picard.

Short term potentiation in my world...

Silentpony:
Maybe? From what I've gathered from the trailer the little girl Picard is saving is an ex-Borg Queen so maybe it'll be more mystery with the younger cast doing the action bits?

I wondered if the girl might have been Data's daughter (an android Data made in TNG): it could fit with the notion of restoring Data because she might have some sort of key or knowledge to make it feasible.

If I remember rightly from the series - bear with me I haven't seen it in decades - Data's daughter had a catastrophic reaction to the emotions Data programmed her to have, major system collapse and shut herself down. They could potentially write her back into existence: maybe Starfleet put her in storage and someone rebooted her.

Tireseas:
I kind of like the idea of Picard on the run from the Federation (and every other hostile power) trying to do the one thing that's right.

I get little feeling of being on the run from the trailer - I'd expect some confrontation or threat scene. Thus it feels to me more like either Starfleet declined to get involved, or okayed a covert mission. In either case leaving him to sort himself out with what is effectively a private ship and operation.

Agema:
I wondered if the girl might have been Data's daughter (an android Data made in TNG): it could fit with the notion of restoring Data because she might have some sort of key or knowledge to make it feasible.

So much nerdsturbation going on about this new character, basically nobody's looked at the low-hanging fruit for the fact Hugh, Data/B4, and Seven are all in the trailer. The whole Borg angle is a bit too obvious, but at the same time misleading.

How were the Borg introduced to the Federation again?

Eacaraxe:

Tireseas:
I kind of like the idea of Picard on the run...

Oh yeah, because "captain goes rogue/vigilante/fugitive" is something we've never seen in Trek before. Let alone being the entire plot of one of the TNG movies. Honestly, your post somehow made me less enthusiastic for the show due to reminding me of Insurrection and the Voyager finale, and I finally managed to memory hole those just like I have the Highlander sequels that definitely never happened. So thanks?

Its also the plot of STD season 2. They take it further and make the whole ship then Enterprise go rogue.

Eacaraxe:

Agema:
I wondered if the girl might have been Data's daughter (an android Data made in TNG): it could fit with the notion of restoring Data because she might have some sort of key or knowledge to make it feasible.

So much nerdsturbation going on about this new character, basically nobody's looked at the low-hanging fruit for the fact Hugh, Data/B4, and Seven are all in the trailer. The whole Borg angle is a bit too obvious, but at the same time misleading.

How were the Borg introduced to the Federation again?

Hue is my favorite character from TNG. As far as Im aware, the Borg episodes are some of the most popular. Also, the best TNG movie.

People forget how many episodes the Borg were in. They've blown it out of proportion

trunkage:
Its also the plot of STD season 2. They take it further and make the whole ship then Enterprise go rogue.

Meh.

Honestly, at this point I'd rather the series not try to do the high drama, high stakes nonsense, and actually be about Picard getting bored, and/or realizing he made a mistake retiring, and putting together a crew to fart around the galaxy doing Picard stuff without having a Starfleet command structure to weigh him down.

I do like the idea of a premiere focused around stuff to do with the Borg Cooperative, maybe Q setting Picard up as another one of his pranks/trials to see if he can overcome past trauma/experience to aid the Cooperative liberate drones or secure a cube for their own. It'd be a neat parallel to Encounter at Farpoint, bookend with All Good Things, and give tribute to the past while giving this new series a hell of a start. But that's just me and my take, mostly because I have a sneaking suspicion this new mystery character is actually (a) Q.

Eacaraxe:

trunkage:
Its also the plot of STD season 2. They take it further and make the whole ship then Enterprise go rogue.

Meh.

Honestly, at this point I'd rather the series not try to do the high drama, high stakes nonsense, and actually be about Picard getting bored, and/or realizing he made a mistake retiring, and putting together a crew to fart around the galaxy doing Picard stuff without having a Starfleet command structure to weigh him down.

I do like the idea of a premiere focused around stuff to do with the Borg Cooperative, maybe Q setting Picard up as another one of his pranks/trials to see if he can overcome past trauma/experience to aid the Cooperative liberate drones or secure a cube for their own. It'd be a neat parallel to Encounter at Farpoint, bookend with All Good Things, and give tribute to the past while giving this new series a hell of a start. But that's just me and my take, mostly because I have a sneaking suspicion this new mystery character is actually (a) Q.

As much as I love Q as a character and his relationship with Picard, I hope not. That relationship is over, it ran its course throughout the series and everything Q was there to help Picard understand was done by "All Good Things..."

Of course I'm not thrilled at the idea of another Borg story either. They were great for TNG and First Contact but Voyager just trashed their whole aura and overexposed them.

Then again, Picard's history with the borg is one of the most interesting things about his character... But stupid future Janeway killed the borg anyway... But I do want to know what happened to the collective after that...

I'll just wait and see how the show turns out.

Not sure how I feel about the Watchman trailer. On one hand, I appreciate they're not going to try to remake the film. OTOH, this feels like it's leaning really heavily on current political events more then trying to legitimately follow up on the themes and events of the comic.

True, the comic/film did talk about the rise of costumed vigilantes(the Minutemen) started with cops who put on masks to protect themselves, but I'm not how much we're going to get beyond that. And shouldn't Dr. Manhattan be in another galaxy by now, not still hanging around Mars? Because I'm sure that I remember him being sick of humanity's shit at the end of Watchmen and wanting to get the fuck as far away as he could so he could go study the cosmos.

Dalisclock:
True, the comic/film did talk about the rise of costumed vigilantes(the Minutemen) started with cops who put on masks to protect themselves, but I'm not how much we're going to get beyond that. And shouldn't Dr. Manhattan be in another galaxy by now, not still hanging around Mars? Because I'm sure that I remember him being sick of humanity's shit at the end of Watchmen and wanting to get the fuck as far away as he could so he could go study the cosmos.

So, this got squeezed out in the meantime. Let me get this straight.

Ozymandias concocts a Xanatos gambit to prevent World War III by giving the Soviet Union and the United States a fake enemy to fight together. To do this, he murders a hell of a lot of people by induced cancer to frame Dr. Manhattan as dangerous to everyone around him, and later commits genocide by giant psychic squid/quantum bombs/kaiju anime girl. His plot is discovered by Dr. Manhattan, Nite Owl, Silk Spectre II, and Rorschach, but they're powerless to stop him and Ozymandias kills a kitty. Everyone reluctantly agrees to go along with Ozymandias' plan, except for Rorschach who commits Suicide by Dr. Manhattan, but not before mailing his journal to a loony right-wing conspiracy newspaper.

Ostensibly, his journal gets published at some point, and this kickstarts a terror(?) group of Rorschach copycats who are apparently supposed to be the neo-Klan. Meanwhile, militarized cops in service to a highly authoritarian American government (remember, this was the status quo in the original material after decades of the Nixon presidency) put on masks to start hunting down the Rorschach copycats off the clock, and these are supposed to be the good guys.

I am looking forward to Picard's Star Trek. But I am sure everyone expected that already given I was one of the few here who wanted to be in Star Fleet instead of being a silly saber swinging Jedi. It looks like CBS figured out they could get subscribers from Star Trek Discovery, so they are now going to bank on every Star Trek they can get their hands on.

Eacaraxe:

Dalisclock:
True, the comic/film did talk about the rise of costumed vigilantes(the Minutemen) started with cops who put on masks to protect themselves, but I'm not how much we're going to get beyond that. And shouldn't Dr. Manhattan be in another galaxy by now, not still hanging around Mars? Because I'm sure that I remember him being sick of humanity's shit at the end of Watchmen and wanting to get the fuck as far away as he could so he could go study the cosmos.

So, this got squeezed out in the meantime. Let me get this straight.

Ozymandias concocts a Xanatos gambit to prevent World War III by giving the Soviet Union and the United States a fake enemy to fight together. To do this, he murders a hell of a lot of people by induced cancer to frame Dr. Manhattan as dangerous to everyone around him, and later commits genocide by giant psychic squid/quantum bombs/kaiju anime girl. His plot is discovered by Dr. Manhattan, Nite Owl, Silk Spectre II, and Rorschach, but they're powerless to stop him and Ozymandias kills a kitty. Everyone reluctantly agrees to go along with Ozymandias' plan, except for Rorschach who commits Suicide by Dr. Manhattan, but not before mailing his journal to a loony right-wing conspiracy newspaper.

Ostensibly, his journal gets published at some point, and this kickstarts a terror(?) group of Rorschach copycats who are apparently supposed to be the neo-Klan. Meanwhile, militarized cops in service to a highly authoritarian American government (remember, this was the status quo in the original material after decades of the Nixon presidency) put on masks to start hunting down the Rorschach copycats off the clock, and these are supposed to be the good guys.

I'm not sure who are supposed to be the good guys here, honestly, The Rorschach terrorist group and the masked cops both come across as total assholes, and of course, it's all supposed to be a commentary on antifa/alt-right/police brutality so maybe nobody is the good guy and it's just a bunch of assholes fighting each other.

But if people are taking the diary seriously, then wouldn't that undermine the whole gambit to prevent WW3 knowing it was a ruse(and wouldn't Veidt be in jail at the very least for orchestrating the whole thing)? And does this mean the space squid is canon considering Dr. Manhattan(presumably) isn't reviled as a genocidal monster?

Also, on a lighter note, am I the only one who thinks Regina King's costume looks kind of dumb? I mean, yeah, most superhero costumes look dumb in the real world, but she's wearing a giant hood with a painted on domino mask(and occasionally a balaclava over the mouth) which doesn't look like it does much.

Dalisclock:
I'm not sure who are supposed to be the good guys here, honestly, The Rorschach terrorist group and the masked cops both come across as total assholes, and of course, it's all supposed to be a commentary on antifa/alt-right/police brutality so maybe nobody is the good guy and it's just a bunch of assholes fighting each other.

I mean, I won't lie. It's a really cool idea for a sequel/follow-up show. I get the feeling it'll follow the film continuity so no giant psychic squid, but that's no great sawmill for me as I felt Veidt setting up Manhattan to be mankind's greatest fake enemy was more sensible storytelling than a giant psychic squid from nowhere. The idea Veidt would skate even if Rorschach's journal got published is off the reservation by no means -- who would you trust, comic book Bezos or a clearly psychopathic costumed murderer?

I just don't necessarily trust this particular project in the hands of the man who fucked up Lost, fucked up Star Trek Into Darkness, and then was hired by Ridley Scott for the express purpose of fucking up Prometheus. HBO could certainly do worse (imagine Watchmen in D&D's hands), but on the other hand, they could do a lot better.

 

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