The Brutal Hypocrisy of Twitch - Alynitys Privileged Immunity

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CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Thus the problem with Amoranth and Alinity just dropping them without any sort of repercussions.

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Damn straight. I was always neutral towards PewDiePie, until that moment. I remember some people trying to excuse it as stress, but that is bullshit. He knew what he said, yet thought he could just get away with it because he's top dog. Or was.

CritialGaming:

McElroy:
With a little bit of benefit of the doubt, she isn't calling anybody a nigger rather saying "nick your next prime's in the channel", even if it sounds like 'nigg-yer'.

Really? You gonna try to play that off. Watch the video she definitely says "Ni**er Nick" Then she grins like a guilty kid at the camera. She knows what she said.

This is every conversation about this topic. This guy said "kill these idiots", but Twitch heard it as "kill these niggas". Another guy says "fucking yikers". Trust me when I say I know how this goes. In accordance with the script you should next call me a Tier-3 subscriber for Alinity. ;-)

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Why not both? PewDiePie damn well knows he streams for a global audience and thus should watch his language, but the thing is, it was still fine to call black people "negroes" (the Swedish word for it) when Mr. Kjellberg was a kid just like it was in Finland when I was a kid. It only became universally a slur later on with the Internet and immigration. On a funnier note because word privileges don't exist here we can actually sing along to hip hop. inb4 defending racism

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Yes. Because people have 100% control of every emotional outburst they will ever have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freudian_slip

Shadowstar38:

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Yes. Because people have 100% control of every emotional outburst they will ever have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freudian_slip

...I feel like saying it was a Freudian slip maybe isn't best thing to do while trying to defend someone who said the n-word.

McElroy:
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Shadowstar38:
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Nedoras:
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I think you all are getting off the point of the thread which is not about how or why someone uses the N-Word, but the fact that there is a clear bias on the part of Twitch which comes down heavy handed on any and all male streamers (regardless of size), while at the same time letting the queens of the "thotts" run free doing whatever they want.

Let's get something straight. Alinity might not have yeeted her cat for the sake of views, or to be part of headlines. But I am pretty sure that Amoranth saw the headlines and let the n-word slip in her stream just to get her own headline. Alinity only followed suit two days later, like it just seems to be a game with these girls. Trying to see just how much they can get away with without so much as a warning let alone any kind of punishment from Twitch staff.

Watch the Gundam video i linked. Watch L of the Day's videos on this. They catalog examples of all the shit these chicks get away with, and then show examples of other streamers doing far less and getting shit on. It's stupid.

CoCage:

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Damn straight. I was always neutral towards PewDiePie, until that moment. I remember some people trying to excuse it as stress but that is bullshit. He knew what he said he thought he could just get away with it because he's top dog. Or was.

He said it to sell himself. Because there are a bunch of people who think that Free of Speech means you can say what you want without consequences. When those consequences come, he can say how bad those people are and turn himself into a martyr. It was a calculated move to drive subs. It was virtue signalling

trunkage:
He said it to sell himself. Because there are a bunch of people who think that Free of Speech means you can say what you want without consequences. When those consequences come, he can say how bad those people are and turn himself into a martyr. It was a calculated move to drive subs. It was virtue signalling

That's conspiracy theory levels of calculated planning on his part. What on earth about his past behavior makes you think he would go through all these hoops?

Nedoras:

...I feel like saying it was a Freudian slip maybe isn't best thing to do while trying to defend someone who said the n-word.

The word itself can be used in a neutral and non-racial context, which may be the first thing is brain associates it with.

CritialGaming:

I think you all are getting off the point of the thread which is not about how or why someone uses the N-Word, but the fact that there is a clear bias on the part of Twitch which comes down heavy handed on any and all male streamers (regardless of size), while at the same time letting the queens of the "thotts" run free doing whatever they want.

Let's get something straight. Alinity might not have yeeted her cat for the sake of views, or to be part of headlines. But I am pretty sure that Amoranth saw the headlines and let the n-word slip in her stream just to get her own headline. Alinity only followed suit two days later, like it just seems to be a game with these girls. Trying to see just how much they can get away with without so much as a warning let alone any kind of punishment from Twitch staff.

Watch the Gundam video i linked. Watch L of the Day's videos on this. They catalog examples of all the shit these chicks get away with, and then show examples of other streamers doing far less and getting shit on. It's stupid.

I'm already subscribed Gundam actually. Funny guy.

CritialGaming:

McElroy:
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Shadowstar38:
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Nedoras:
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\

I think you all are getting off the point of the thread which is not about how or why someone uses the N-Word, but the fact that there is a clear bias on the part of Twitch which comes down heavy handed on any and all male streamers (regardless of size), while at the same time letting the queens of the "thotts" run free doing whatever they want.

Let's get something straight. Alinity might not have yeeted her cat for the sake of views, or to be part of headlines. But I am pretty sure that Amoranth saw the headlines and let the n-word slip in her stream just to get her own headline. Alinity only followed suit two days later, like it just seems to be a game with these girls. Trying to see just how much they can get away with without so much as a warning let alone any kind of punishment from Twitch staff.

Watch the Gundam video i linked. Watch L of the Day's videos on this. They catalog examples of all the shit these chicks get away with, and then show examples of other streamers doing far less and getting shit on. It's stupid.

Sigh, but this is all so fucking stupid though. They're a soulless tech company owned by Amazon. Twitch has a bias towards making money, and that's it. The only reason people are losing their minds and making videos over this, and creating conspiracies about how Twitch hates men or whatever, is because people like Alinity and Amoranth or whoever are the archetypal enemy of their viewerbase. They eat this shit up. It's a big, hateful, circle of making money off of drama and cynicism. Also, Twitch will honestly only ever step in if things get too out of hand...which they haven't really. Otherwise, this is all very profitable for them. Terms and service mean fuck all if there's money to be made. Also, Twitch has banned a stupid amount of people over false reports and tiny things, but I doubt a real person was ever behind a vast majority of those bans. They only give a shit if you make a lot of money, and even then, only if it becomes too much to handle. Otherwise, everyone rides the money train, including the people who are so "outraged" about this and fanning the flames.

Nedoras:

Sigh, but this is all so fucking stupid though. They're a soulless tech company owned by Amazon. Twitch has a bias towards making money, and that's it. The only reason people are losing their minds and making videos over this, and creating conspiracies about how Twitch hates men or whatever, is because people like Alinity and Amoranth or whoever are the archetypal enemy of their viewerbase. They eat this shit up. It's a big, hateful, circle of making money off of drama and cynicism. Also, Twitch will honestly only ever step in if things get too out of hand...which they haven't really. Otherwise, this is all very profitable for them. Terms and service mean fuck all if there's money to be made. Also, Twitch has banned a stupid amount of people over false reports and tiny things, but I doubt a real person was ever behind a vast majority of those bans. They only give a shit if you make a lot of money, and even then, only if it becomes too much to handle. Otherwise, everyone rides the money train, including the people who are so "outraged" about this and fanning the flames.

They banned Pewdiepie, though temporary. Dr. Disrepect has been banned a couple of times, though obviously outright breaking the law by filming the bathroom was deserved he did receive a ban for some other shit he did.

That's the point that we are trying to point out in this thread. You say it's fine so long as they make money, but they've punished some of the biggest male stars that exist on the platform. So it can't be about that, as they obviously are more than happy to enforce the terms of service with violated by male streamers.

Even in this very thread McElroy tried to play with the words that came out of Alinity's mouth that it wasn't the n-word. When there are videos of it very clearly being the n-word.

The problem is that people's first instinct is to defend the pretty girl, while at the same time the first instinct in the crucify the men. Fuck that.

CritialGaming:

Nedoras:

Sigh, but this is all so fucking stupid though. They're a soulless tech company owned by Amazon. Twitch has a bias towards making money, and that's it. The only reason people are losing their minds and making videos over this, and creating conspiracies about how Twitch hates men or whatever, is because people like Alinity and Amoranth or whoever are the archetypal enemy of their viewerbase. They eat this shit up. It's a big, hateful, circle of making money off of drama and cynicism. Also, Twitch will honestly only ever step in if things get too out of hand...which they haven't really. Otherwise, this is all very profitable for them. Terms and service mean fuck all if there's money to be made. Also, Twitch has banned a stupid amount of people over false reports and tiny things, but I doubt a real person was ever behind a vast majority of those bans. They only give a shit if you make a lot of money, and even then, only if it becomes too much to handle. Otherwise, everyone rides the money train, including the people who are so "outraged" about this and fanning the flames.

They banned Pewdiepie, though temporary. Dr. Disrepect has been banned a couple of times, though obviously outright breaking the law by filming the bathroom was deserved he did receive a ban for some other shit he did.

That's the point that we are trying to point out in this thread. You say it's fine so long as they make money, but they've punished some of the biggest male stars that exist on the platform. So it can't be about that, as they obviously are more than happy to enforce the terms of service with violated by male streamers.

Even in this very thread McElroy tried to play with the words that came out of Alinity's mouth that it wasn't the n-word. When there are videos of it very clearly being the n-word.

The problem is that people's first instinct is to defend the pretty girl, while at the same time the first instinct in the crucify the men. Fuck that.

Pewdiepie is massive and very much in the mainstream spotlight because of it. Dr. Disrespect is a top ten streamer. These people will never be truly banned, and the only reason they get slaps on the wrist is due to them being so massive. It's not like either of them had a ton of defenders for what they did either. The public image of the person and the people who are upset also matter. It's not "defend the pretty girl" which is the problem. The problem is multi-faceted.

For one, they're not big enough. Sure they're "big" and make a lot of money for themselves and Twitch, but no one knows who the fuck these people are other than their fans and their "haters" or whatever. The first response to this thread was very apt. For two, the people who are most against them, come from that same line of people who hated them simply because they were women showing cleavage on stream while playing video games. I remember plenty of threads on this very site arguing that these women are destroying the platform n' whatnot. It allows them to easily do controversial shit, as they know the people who will get most upset are people that have been crying wolf about them for the stupidest shit for ages. And because they're not known outside of these inner circles, they suffer no consequences. Twitch won't do shit, because they make money and it won't ever blow up beyond the typical crowd who's always been upset with them.

And you can see this kind of favoritism on other platforms as well for even more controversial shit. Because it's favoritism towards money, as long as things don't get out of control. For example there was a big lifestreamer on Youtube who was literally streaming people being physically and mentally abused. Even streamed himself trespassing and breaking the law numerous times. He got away with it because he wasn't big enough, but was big enough to where he made a fair bit of cash for himself and them. People always cry about social media sites, streaming sites, video sites, the lot of them all favoring one group of people over another. But the only thing they give a fuck about is money. As long as things don't blow up too much, they're not going to lift a damn finger. They will let automated systems handle all the small stuff though, which is a whole other problem.

Also I never said it's fine as long as they make money. I personally would ban all of these fucking people. Hell, plenty of these online spaces need to be broken up at this point. Fuck these companies. I am in no way defending them, I just think people are missing the forest for the trees.

Shadowstar38:

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:
Remember PewDiePie got a ban for letting the N-word slip.

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Yes. Because people have 100% control of every emotional outburst they will ever have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freudian_slip

And there we go defending someone doing something shitty. Don't be like that kid in the video below making excuses for bad actions.

Martin said it best at 20:11.

trunkage:

CoCage:

CaitSeith:

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Damn straight. I was always neutral towards PewDiePie, until that moment. I remember some people trying to excuse it as stress but that is bullshit. He knew what he said he thought he could just get away with it because he's top dog. Or was.

He said it to sell himself. Because there are a bunch of people who think that Free of Speech means you can say what you want without consequences. When those consequences come, he can say how bad those people are and turn himself into a martyr. It was a calculated move to drive subs. It was virtue signalling

Yeah, the dumb twat ain't that smart or calculated.

CoCage:

And there we go defending someone doing something shitty. Don't be like that kid in the video below making excuses for bad actions.

Martin said it best at 20:11.

You can offense to what he did all you want, as is your right. I detected no malice in it and believe the reaction was overblown.

Also, "Defending". I'm getting tired of the misuse of that word. Telling people we shouldn't durn shoplifters at the stake...isn't defending the act of shoplifting. You're being a little silly with your word choice here.

Shadowstar38:

CoCage:

And there we go defending someone doing something shitty. Don't be like that kid in the video below making excuses for bad actions.

Martin said it best at 20:11.

You can offense to what he did all you want, as is your right. I detected no malice in it and believe the reaction was overblown.

Also, "Defending". I'm getting tired of the misuse of that word. Telling people we shouldn't durn shoplifters at the stake...isn't defending the act of shoplifting. You're being a little silly with your word choice here.

You're analogy fails hard. For one, I am black so I get the right to complain or be offended. I don't know about you, if you're are black, then check yourself before you wreck yourself. Two, I took the a vow to never say the N-Word; neither the ending with an "a", nor the hard "er". It's bad manners, and it's called having standards for fucks sake. People, are the reason people like Logan Paul and Pewds continue to do shit like this. The guys at the top know they make money, and will barely do anything or nothing to punish them, and irgnorant people or blind fans will continue to swat off legit criticism or downplay bad actions. You seem to forget the guys like them don't give a 1000 shits about us. I can tell when something is intentional or not.

Here is my shortest rebuttal:

CoCage:

You're analogy fails hard. For one, I am black so I get the right to complain or be offended. I don't know about you, if you're are black, then check yourself before you wreck yourself. Two, I took the a vow to never say the N-Word; neither the ending with an "a", nor the hard "er". It's bad manners, and it's called having standards for fucks sake. People, are the reason people like Logan Paul and Pewds continue to do shit like this. The guys at the top know they make money, and will barely do anything or nothing to punish them, and irgnorant people or blind fans will continue to swat off legit criticism or downplay bad actions. You seem to forget the guys like them don't give a 1000 shits about us. I can tell when something is intentional or not.

Here is my shortest rebuttal:

Yeah. You get the right to complain. I said as much.

Yeah, I'm black. I still say the N word outside the internet because the context of that word has changed over time depending on the context. It's perfectly fine for you to personally decide to not use it. But that's still a personal decision and not a universal rule people should feel obliged to follow.

As for being able to tell if something's intentional or not, well, so can I so not sure what light that sheds on the situation expect for maybe you not liking the guy to begin with. Although, I'm still not sure why that would be the case for you or anyone else.

Shadowstar38:

CoCage:

You're analogy fails hard. For one, I am black so I get the right to complain or be offended. I don't know about you, if you're are black, then check yourself before you wreck yourself. Two, I took the a vow to never say the N-Word; neither the ending with an "a", nor the hard "er". It's bad manners, and it's called having standards for fucks sake. People, are the reason people like Logan Paul and Pewds continue to do shit like this. The guys at the top know they make money, and will barely do anything or nothing to punish them, and irgnorant people or blind fans will continue to swat off legit criticism or downplay bad actions. You seem to forget the guys like them don't give a 1000 shits about us. I can tell when something is intentional or not.

Here is my shortest rebuttal:

Yeah. You get the right to complain. I said as much.

Yeah, I'm black. I still say the N word outside the internet because the context of that word has changed over time depending on the context. It's perfectly fine for you to personally decide to not use it. But that's still a personal decision and not a universal rule people should feel obliged to follow.

As for being able to tell if something's intentional or not, well, so can I so not sure what light that sheds on the situation expect for maybe you not liking the guy to begin with. Although, I'm still not sure why that would be the case for you or anyone else.

I said I was neutral about the guy to begin with in an earlier it post. It was some of Pewds big idiocy and the n-word situation that made me step back, look, and see that guy has problems. If you can't or won't tell the difference that is on you. If you like guy, more power to you, but I never cared for his videos, and I obviously don't like him now. My frustration once again, lies in the fact people are either downplaying (which is what you are doing), defending, or encourage YouTube "stars" that do dumb shit like this. Remember Logan Paul and the suicide. The dumb fuck more or less got away with and did not learn a damn thing, causing an international incident. At the end of the day is another attention whore going back causing problems, just get some extra views and click, and his fan base (who is very large) are stupid or blind to see past this. It's hero/celebrity worshiping at its worst. The same problem with Hollywood and entertainment industry.

Look, I know you're probably an okay guy, but don't turn a blind eye to something that is off or makes you feel uncomfortable. I call it like I see it. Bullshit is bullshit. Yes, context has changed in certain places, but not all. Don't think it excuses his actions or other that try and pull crap like that. Try explaining context to people like my parents (especially from my dad, who is from Alabama), other people in my family, or friends young and old. Let's just say they'll have some choice words for you.

Shadowstar38:

trunkage:
He said it to sell himself. Because there are a bunch of people who think that Free of Speech means you can say what you want without consequences. When those consequences come, he can say how bad those people are and turn himself into a martyr. It was a calculated move to drive subs. It was virtue signalling

That's conspiracy theory levels of calculated planning on his part. What on earth about his past behavior makes you think he would go through all these hoops?.

Hoops. He said the N-word to generate controversy for his new thing. Just like Alinity, he knows controversy drives views. (And yes, I think Alimity did this deliberately. Everytime she does something controversial, her views go up.)

Then a bunch of people defended his words and he was smart enough to realise what a gold mine that would be. I seem to remember him talking about how mean all those people were. He talked about how we need to have Freedom of Speech, but for some reason, implied that it should cover everyone not the government.

He is an opportunity after manufacturing a controversy and took it.

CoCage:

I said I was neutral about the guy to begin with in an earlier it post. It was some of Pewds big idiocy and the n-word situation that made me step back, look, and see that guy has problems. If you can't or won't tell the difference that is on you. If you like guy, more power to you, but I never cared for his videos, and I obviously don't like him now. My frustration once again, lies in the fact people are either downplaying (which is what you are doing), defending, or encourage YouTube "stars" that do dumb shit like this. Remember Logan Paul and the suicide. The dumb fuck more or less got away with and did not learn a damn thing, causing an international incident. At the end of the day is another attention whore going back causing problems, just get some extra views and click, and his fan base (who is very large) are stupid or blind to see past this. It's hero/celebrity worshiping at its worst. The same problem with Hollywood and entertainment industry.

The Aokigahara incident completely lacked cultural tact and plain common sense. The people who defended it were in an entirely different tier of stupid. Celebrity worship as a whole is unhealthy. None of this has much effect on the thing I was originally pointing out was bullshit. I view each celebrity fuck up on its own case by case basis. The incident I was referring to, taken on its own, was way overblown. If Pewds is someone that makes a habit of doing dumb shit because he knows he can get away with it, show me a pattern of behavior that points to that being the case. If someone doesn't, I'm left to assume they're just personally triggered and not much else.

Try explaining context to people like my parents (especially from my dad, who is from Alabama), other people in my family, or friends young and old. Let's just say they'll have some choice words for you.

These don't sound like people I'd be having a casual conversation with and I wouldn't be using my normal terminology. That just ties into knowing your audience.

Shadowstar38:

CoCage:

Try explaining context to people like my parents (especially from my dad, who is from Alabama), other people in my family, or friends young and old. Let's just say they'll have some choice words for you.

These don't sound like people I'd be having a casual conversation with and I wouldn't be using my normal terminology. That just ties into knowing your audience.

That avoiding a statement and giving me a non-answer. That proves my point.

[quote="Shadowstar38" post="18.1057266.24315374"]
The Aokigahara incident completely lacked cultural tact and plain common sense. The people who defended it were in an entirely different tier of stupid. Celebrity worship as a whole is unhealthy. None of this has much effect on the thing I was originally pointing out was bullshit. I view each celebrity fuck up on its own case by case basis. The incident I was referring to, taken on its own, was way overblown. If Pewds is someone that makes a habit of doing dumb shit because he knows he can get away with it, show me a pattern of behavior that points to that being the case. If someone doesn't, I'm left to assume they're just personally triggered and not much else.

That is the only thing we can agree on as far as Logan Paul and celebrity worship. As far as Pewds idiocy, find it yourself. I'm not wasting time on him looking for stuff, and this is not about easily being "triggered" (another crappy argument or weak counterpoint that has been used). There is a YouTube search page. You know what to do from here. If you or anyone want to criticize about this specific response; I do not give rats ass.

CoCage:

That avoiding a statement and giving me a non-answer. That proves my point.

I have no idea what was meant by this Q_Q Typo?

Shadowstar38:

CoCage:

That avoiding a statement and giving me a non-answer. That proves my point.

I have no idea what was meant by this Q_Q Typo?

My mistake. I meant to say you're avoiding my statement by giving me a non-answer. That proves my point. It doesn't matter if you're having a casual conversation or not. Explain the "context" of Pewds use of the n-word to my parents. They'll understand, just not in the way you are hoping or thinking. Good night, I am going to bed.

CritialGaming:

McElroy:
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Shadowstar38:
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Nedoras:
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Watch the Gundam video i linked. Watch L of the Day's videos on this. They catalog examples of all the shit these chicks get away with, and then show examples of other streamers doing far less and getting shit on. It's stupid.

I did, yes, but I've seen these clips already because I follow the subreddit that catalogs them (r/LiveStreamFails). A running joke is that some of the female streamers have dug up dirt from the Twitch staff (or regularly send nudes to them) so they won't run into trouble while streaming. We agree on Twitch being biased towards some streamers because the snap decisions that affect everyone else never seem to hit a bunch of them.

However, I don't believe it's a Game of N-Words. The conversation devolves into "but did they REALLY say it?" every time. It's dumb.

CoCage:

Shadowstar38:

CoCage:

That avoiding a statement and giving me a non-answer. That proves my point.

I have no idea what was meant by this Q_Q Typo?

My mistake. I meant to say you're avoiding my mistake by giving me a non-answer. That proves my point. It doesn't matter if you're having a casual conversation or not. Explain the "context" of Pewds use of the n-word to my parents. They'll understand, just not in the way you are hoping or thinking. Good night, I am going to bed.

Would be glad to. But given the way you've worded this, it sounds like the won't personally care.

Goodnight

Nedoras:
They're a soulless tech company owned by Amazon...everyone rides the money train, including the people who are so "outraged" about this and fanning the flames.

Oh, don't pretend the root cause of the problem isn't Twitch's toxic business model, and that there are women who abuse this status quo for personal gain. I'm sex-pos and sex work-pos, and women like Alinity and Amouranth are toxic to the cause of adult content and sex work acceptance thanks to their shitty behavior. Even if they were full-on camgirls, could you imagine their behavior being acceptable on those platforms like Chaturbate or MFC in the current climate of extreme scrutiny towards adult content providers?

Likewise, don't pretend there isn't an entire cottage industry built around apologia for women like them. Damn near every time one of these streamers says or does something horrible on stream, there's an article blast of "misogynists and trolls online blow minor incident completely out of proportion to harass innocent young performance artist, and this is what really happened and this totally exonerates anything the streamer might have said or did in any way". Just never mind it's the same handful of streamers, and it's part and parcel of an often long-running trend.

Shadowstar38:

CoCage:

Shadowstar38:

I have no idea what was meant by this Q_Q Typo?

My mistake. I meant to say you're avoiding my mistake by giving me a non-answer. That proves my point. It doesn't matter if you're having a casual conversation or not. Explain the "context" of Pewds use of the n-word to my parents. They'll understand, just not in the way you are hoping or thinking. Good night, I am going to bed.

Would be glad to. But given the way you've worded this, it sounds like the won't personally care.

Goodnight

You're wrong. They would care to listen, but they will call Pewds a dumb motherfucker, if you or I would have shown that clip in it's entire context. They can tell he's not racist, but he still shouldn't have done that thinking there won't be any consequences or backlash. Cuz he sure as hell wasn't using it in a neutral context.

Edit: I meant to say you're avoiding my statement by giving me a non-answer. That proves my point. That is what I meant to say a couple of post ago. Stupid Google speak.

Eacaraxe:
snip

But does the success of girl pretend-friend streamers tell more about the platform, the girls, or the customers (viewers)?

Eacaraxe:

Nedoras:
They're a soulless tech company owned by Amazon...everyone rides the money train, including the people who are so "outraged" about this and fanning the flames.

Oh, don't pretend the root cause of the problem isn't Twitch's toxic business model, and that there are women who abuse this status quo for personal gain. I'm sex-pos and sex work-pos, and women like Alinity and Amouranth are toxic to the cause of adult content and sex work acceptance thanks to their shitty behavior. Even if they were full-on camgirls, could you imagine their behavior being acceptable on those platforms like Chaturbate or MFC in the current climate of extreme scrutiny towards adult content providers?

Likewise, don't pretend there isn't an entire cottage industry built around apologia for women like them. Damn near every time one of these streamers says or does something horrible on stream, there's an article blast of "misogynists and trolls online blow minor incident completely out of proportion to harass innocent young performance artist, and this is what really happened and this totally exonerates anything the streamer might have said or did in any way". Just never mind it's the same handful of streamers, and it's part and parcel of an often long-running trend.

Well yes, they do abuse it. I didn't say they didn't deserve to be banned, they're garbage people and they should be. I'm aware of how twisted these individuals can be and how much they can take advantage of their audience. My point was that Twitch won't ever give a shit unless it becomes pushed too much into the public spotlight. But yes, they will fully take advantage of the status quo and the image that everyone who is opposing them are neckbeard gamers who hate women or whatever.

I'm not pretending that. As I said, a lot of people benefit and make money off of this. This whole cycle of people taking advantage of a shitty platform that doesn't care to stir controversy, and a bunch of people cynically then defend/attack them who also benefit from the controversy in the first place, is very stupid. This entire online sphere is basically one giant reality TV show and everyone is trying to cash in on it. Only it's much more powerful than something like reality TV, as the viewers get to interact with the "characters" and form pretty strong parasocial relationships. They get to feel like they're truly a part of the show and get unhealthily invested in it. It's a bit of a different topic, but discussion about Twitch culture and parasocial relationships is something that needs more public eye and scrutiny. I personally think Twitch needs to be cracked down on very hard because of it.

I'm also now realizing that you responded to a different post than the one I thought. I did a follow up to that one better explaining myself.

Nedoras:
My point was that Twitch won't ever give a shit unless it becomes pushed too much into the public spotlight. But yes, they will fully take advantage of the status quo and the image that everyone who is opposing them are neckbeard gamers who hate women or whatever.

Absolutely. And, the one thing Twitch could do to resolve the issue is what they would never do voluntarily -- introduce and enforce mature content warnings and age-gating. It gives up the game of Twitch deriving a huge chunk, if not the majority, of its revenue from being Junior's First Cam Site. And it means Twitch would have to comply with the post-SESTA/FOSTA bullshit, which means less revenue for the platform overall, almost certainly less revenue to the women who produce the racier content, and place Twitch in a position where it must compete with actual cam sites for performers and viewers. Not to mention the PR hit from creating an 18+ streaming category.

Like I said, I'm sex-pos and sex work-pos. If women want to do topless streams or whatever, by all means. Just make them context- and age-appropriate. This "body painting as a wink-and-nod excuse to topless stream, then hiding behind feminism and accusations of misogyny and harassment when called out" shit is bananas and makes everyone involved look bad by association.

Nedoras:
They get to feel like they're truly a part of the show and get unhealthily invested in it. It's a bit of a different topic, but discussion about Twitch culture and parasocial relationships is something that needs more public eye and scrutiny. I personally think Twitch needs to be cracked down on very hard because of it.

Basically, it's Twitch's fault people watch streams instead of going outside.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Yru5-5qwV4

Here is another Twitch double standard. They advertised other streamers on Ninja's channel, basically to point people to other Twitch streamers because Ninja went to Mixer. They don't advertise other streamers on ANY other streamer's page, regardless of popularity or how long ago that person streamed.

Oh and one of the streams they promoted on Ninja's channel was broadcasting porn. Just....outright porn. Right there, on a kid friendly channel that had 14 Million subs. Porn. Yeah.

McElroy:

Nedoras:
They get to feel like they're truly a part of the show and get unhealthily invested in it. It's a bit of a different topic, but discussion about Twitch culture and parasocial relationships is something that needs more public eye and scrutiny. I personally think Twitch needs to be cracked down on very hard because of it.

Basically, it's Twitch's fault people watch streams instead of going outside.

No. But Twitch generally doesn't give a damn about what it's streamers do and that includes being emotionally manipulative and exploitative. Twitch holding no one accountable for anything feeds the machine. A slap on the wrist "ban" isn't a punishment. Streamers themsleves also need to take more responsibility for how they interact with their communities and what goes on within them.

As for why this "very online" generation is a thing, that's a very complicated subject that I don't exactly know a whole lot about. Although if I were to hazard a guess, it would be that social isolation is very easy to put a band-aid on with the internet. Especially with individuals that talk directly at you through a camera and you can easily interact with. Or forums filled with people who feel the same way as you, and you form a camaraderie with them based off of mutual grievances.

People also have been forming their identities online now and I'd love to see a study that shows how much of a difference that makes. After all, who you are online and to your online peers doesn't necessarily reflect who you may really be outside of the internet. I'm curious if that truly fuels social isolation in a large way. If it makes a lot people feel like their peers in real life don't understand them as well as strangers on Reddit or whatever. Clearly this happens to some extent, but I'm curious how widespread it truly is.

Nedoras:
No. But Twitch generally doesn't give a damn about what it's streamers do and that includes being emotionally manipulative and exploitative...

The issue is...define manipulation and exploitation.

The idiocy about Amouranth hiding her marital status and that idiot who donated thousands of dollars to her playing the "nice guy" act hoping to get up in there? Was that manipulative? At least in my opinion, that wasn't...little shady perhaps, but at the end of the day content producers create a brand and persona for themselves, they market that brand, and it's on people to realize what they see on the idiot box isn't necessarily reflective of reality.

What about Kaceytron's She-DSP persona? Is she exploitative? If you go back and watch her earlier content, it becomes obvious she's not nearly as poor a player as she presents herself; she deliberately cultivates a brand of incompetence and buffoonery, because it gets her more exposure and revenue than playing and behaving like a competent adult. Nevertheless, her brand is extremely toxic, and she can always rely upon media to white knight her rather than call her out for the impact her persona has on the perception of gamers, streamers, and particularly women in either.

And, last, what about the latest ZombiUnicorn stunt at E3 this year? One could well agree with her point about booth babes and performers at exhibits...as long as you discount the fact she didn't speak to any of the women involved, to hear or charitably represent their point of view, until the matter was publicly forced by one of the actual dancers. Or that she completely failed to recognize the men in the dance troupe, or the women's costumes were more conservative than typical house/scene/rave fashion. Or that, as typical, her first recourse for anyone that so much as kindly disagreed with her was to fling rather nasty insults, including towards other women who weren't in complete lockstep with her opinion. Or that she was pulling quite similar stunts the entire duration of E3 as an official spokesperson complete with media pass, and ignoring equal if not worse behavior by other Twitch partners, up to and including what I believe was a livestreamed twerking contest involving actual strippers "on the job" so to speak. Or that, given her Twitch partner status, her relationship with her platform is much the same as the dancers' she called out for all of the above reasons and more.

CritialGaming:

Oh and one of the streams they promoted on Ninja's channel was broadcasting porn. Just....outright porn. Right there, on a kid friendly channel that had 14 Million subs. Porn. Yeah.

Oh, you just didn't just pull the "think about the children" card, did you? That's hilarious!

Nedoras:

Shadowstar38:

CaitSeith:

One doesn't let N-words slip; one chooses to use N-words.

Yes. Because people have 100% control of every emotional outburst they will ever have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freudian_slip

...I feel like saying it was a Freudian slip maybe isn't best thing to do while trying to defend someone who said the n-word.

This. Also, pretty much the point is if you slip the n-word in an emotional outburst it's because that's your swear word of choice for outbursts.

CaitSeith:

CritialGaming:

Oh and one of the streams they promoted on Ninja's channel was broadcasting porn. Just....outright porn. Right there, on a kid friendly channel that had 14 Million subs. Porn. Yeah.

Oh, you just didn't just pull the "think about the children" card, did you? That's hilarious!

It was porn!

Nevermind the fact that Twitch has NEVER advertised other streamers on offline accounts. Yet they did it to Ninja, clearly doing so to try and retain his audience on Twitch itself for whomever might still visit his stream page.

And clearly they aren't paying that much attention to who they tried to push because they advertised porn. It isn't about kids, it's about showing how much Twitch doesn't enforce or appear to give a fuck about their own TOS.

The problem has always been that Twitch only enforces TOS when it is convenient for them to do so. and outright ignore it when it would hurt their "preferred" streamers, which ironically always seems to be Thotts.

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