US Government Shutdown

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Lil devils x:
Yea, really have to get a load of these guys who do not understand why the poorly paid people are forced to live pay check to pay check and then have the gall to blame them for not having 3 months worth of bills saved because they are underpaid to begin with. Are people seriously that dense that they have no idea that the poor didn't "choose to be poor" and that being poor means you don't actually have any money to survive? If those who cannot afford to save money took the jobs from those who do, guess who would not be able to afford to save money then? Geeze these people do not even seem to understand this can happen to anyone.

Sounds like all those poor people need to collectively pull themselves up by their bootstraps. They would if they were not lazy. There are jobs for those out there with the drive to get it, just have to hit the pavement with a fresh suit, a firm handshake, and a can-do attitude!

But seriously this entire mess would be considered criminal in any other developed nation. The moment you don't get paid is the day you walk off the job - especially if your bosses are still getting paid while NOT working.

Abomination:

Lil devils x:
Yea, really have to get a load of these guys who do not understand why the poorly paid people are forced to live pay check to pay check and then have the gall to blame them for not having 3 months worth of bills saved because they are underpaid to begin with. Are people seriously that dense that they have no idea that the poor didn't "choose to be poor" and that being poor means you don't actually have any money to survive? If those who cannot afford to save money took the jobs from those who do, guess who would not be able to afford to save money then? Geeze these people do not even seem to understand this can happen to anyone.

Sounds like all those poor people need to collectively pull themselves up by their bootstraps. They would if they were not lazy. There are jobs for those out there with the drive to get it, just have to hit the pavement with a fresh suit, a firm handshake, and a can-do attitude!

But seriously this entire mess would be considered criminal in any other developed nation. The moment you don't get paid is the day you walk off the job - especially if your bosses are still getting paid while NOT working.

It should be illegal, The problem is of course you would have to get rid of all the republicans in congress to make it illegal to do so since they are the ones who seem to love keeping the government shut down repeatedly. They have done this so many times now it seems to be their " go to" move at this point. They have proven without a doubt they care nothing for these people who are harmed by their actions, even worse, not only do they prevent them from being paid, they work hard to eliminate the welfare programs to save their lives when they cannot afford food due to their actions. They basically block all the exits and set the place on fire and sit back and think this is a great thing while everyone else perishes.

Lil devils x:
It should be illegal, The problem is of course you would have to get rid of all the republicans in congress to make it illegal to do so since they are the ones who seem to love keeping the government shut down repeatedly.

Of course they do. Republicans don't believe in the government - having it shut down is a natural inclination.

It's there for them to maintain an army, ban abortions, arrest and suppress black people, and very little else.

Lil devils x:

But seriously this entire mess would be considered criminal in any other developed nation. The moment you don't get paid is the day you walk off the job - especially if your bosses are still getting paid while NOT working. It should be illegal, The problem is of course you would have to get rid of all the republicans in congress to make it illegal to do so since they are the ones who seem to love keeping the government shut down repeatedly. They have done this so many times now it seems to be their " go to" move at this point. They have proven without a doubt they care nothing for these people who are harmed by their actions, even worse, not only do they prevent them from being paid, they work hard to eliminate the welfare programs to save their lives when they cannot afford food due to their actions. They basically block all the exits and set the place on fire and sit back and think this is a great thing while everyone else perishes.

You left out 'blame the other guy for it'.

I read all the shutdown stories and can't get them out of my mind now. Wish I could pitch in enough to get them through the next month, but even then it might go on longer at this rate.

Oh, lets not pay the Coast Guard to ensure border security is tight. This is a thing that will work.

Unfortunately, of course, it might, at least for the real, if not the stated, goal.

Holding worker's and their families' livelihoods to ransom just to force others into fulfilling a petulant racist fantasy is yet another despicable low, deserving of a new word as past words' familiarity lose effect after so much shittery by this point. Maybe yukuntibolox. I retract the laughing owls, was not aware this action denied struggling people their needed income, sorry there.

Lil devils x:

Abomination:

Lil devils x:
Yea, really have to get a load of these guys who do not understand why the poorly paid people are forced to live pay check to pay check and then have the gall to blame them for not having 3 months worth of bills saved because they are underpaid to begin with. Are people seriously that dense that they have no idea that the poor didn't "choose to be poor" and that being poor means you don't actually have any money to survive? If those who cannot afford to save money took the jobs from those who do, guess who would not be able to afford to save money then? Geeze these people do not even seem to understand this can happen to anyone.

Sounds like all those poor people need to collectively pull themselves up by their bootstraps. They would if they were not lazy. There are jobs for those out there with the drive to get it, just have to hit the pavement with a fresh suit, a firm handshake, and a can-do attitude!

But seriously this entire mess would be considered criminal in any other developed nation. The moment you don't get paid is the day you walk off the job - especially if your bosses are still getting paid while NOT working.

It should be illegal, The problem is of course you would have to get rid of all the republicans in congress to make it illegal to do so since they are the ones who seem to love keeping the government shut down repeatedly. They have done this so many times now it seems to be their " go to" move at this point. They have proven without a doubt they care nothing for these people who are harmed by their actions, even worse, not only do they prevent them from being paid, they work hard to eliminate the welfare programs to save their lives when they cannot afford food due to their actions. They basically block all the exits and set the place on fire and sit back and think this is a great thing while everyone else perishes.

QFT.

This is a big part why even though I believe in the idea of classical "conservatism" in terms of supporting states rights, I cannot support the GOP the way it has been acting for the past 20 years.

They have become the party of NO. They are not interested in supporting the interests of the common people, they're opposed to everything just out of spite. The republican party badly needs new Teddy Roosevelts.

Another Day of Shutdown and more despair. Every single day this goes on, more fall into poverty and become more desperate.

A few More #shutdownstories Trump will never concern himself with:

@chefjoseandres at @beefsteak with my 9 month old son who is enjoying his JV bowl and I?m thankful for the free sandwich, means a lot and even a lunch saves so much for a family with a new baby after unpaid Federal maternity leave! #ShutdownStories thank you Chef!

I'm scheduled for surgery next week but trying to decide if I should postpone it since I dont know when I'm getting paid again

Spending the start of 2019 making a list of all the companies I need to call and make arrangements for our uncertain future with no paycheck. So far no one is willing to trade labor for their payment

Just tried to update my password on the FTC ID theft site and got this: "Due to the government shutdown, we are unable to offer this website service at this time. We will resume normal operations when the government is funded."

@realDonaldTrump Stop using us as a pawn in your pathetic chess game to get your stupid wall.
YOU swore Mexico would pay & now you expect us to pay?
SHAME ON YOU!
We are NOT a bargaining chip! We're human beings!

Went to put gas in my car & realized I had no money.

You can imagine how I felt knowing I need groceries for my son... need to pay PP Tax, buy dog food, etc.

Almost 11 years I've dedicated to my job and this is how I am thanked?

get my allergy shots every few weeks at the @NASA_Johnson clinic. I just realized my next one is due next week. I have to make an appointment but I have no idea how to handle this, as we?re not allowed to use government email, phones, etc.

I went to Walmart w my last paycheck. I kept asking the cashier what the total was. She stopped what she was doing, looked at me, and said, ?you a govt worker?? Yep, just moved here, just bought a house (haven?t made the 1st payment yet), & started chemo today.

Furlough Day 4-Civil Servants will spend today wondering which bills won?t be paid this first month of 2019. I know I?m thinking about whether they?ll repo my car for missing a payment or maybe I don?t need heart meds?

Have 3 kids with autism. Husband an essential government employee who is working without pay. Youngest child is severe & is on winter break. He cant take leave & we are shut-ins. We need his pay to survive. Do I pay my mortgage (1 whole check), pay utilities?

I met a woman named Debbie in Wal Mart checkout line today who couldn't afford her groceries. She was having to choose between food for her dog or her kids because of #trumpshutdown. I made sure she didn't have to make that choice today.

Thousands of scientists are barred from their #research while the #TrumpShutdown is in effect. Untold numbers of delicate experiments are ruined, with countless others set back significantly. This idiotic action is actively hurting US innovation.

At least The American Federation of Government Employees (AFGE) union is suing Trump's administration due to it being illegal for them to work without being paid. I hope they win. More should sue Him for the mess he has caused.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/423359-federal-workers-union-sues-trump-admin-over-government-shutdown

This is how violent revolutions happen.

Saelune:
This is how violent revolutions happen.

Yes, in a nation that claims to not negotiate with terrorists, Trump is holding these Americans lives hostage for something he swore Americans would not have to pay for. Of course this harms so many more than that and the lands, water, air, future. Of course Trump does not care about any of that either, I honestly do not think he is intelligent enough to understand how this works, let alone care about it.

Lil devils x:

Saelune:
This is how violent revolutions happen.

Yes, in a nation that claims to not negotiate with terrorists, Trump is holding these Americans lives hostage for something he swore Americans would not have to pay for. Of course this harms so many more than that and the lands, water, air, future. Of course Trump does not care about any of that either, I honestly do not think he is intelligent enough to understand how this works, let alone care about it.

Ya know, Trump said he would make Mexico pay for the wall, and Trump never lies, so therefor everyone who donated to pay for the wall MUST be Mexicans and thus need to be deported.

Lil devils x:
Another Day of Shutdown and more despair. Every single day this goes on, more fall into poverty and become more desperate.

A few More #shutdownstories Trump will never concern himself with:

@chefjoseandres at @beefsteak with my 9 month old son who is enjoying his JV bowl and I?m thankful for the free sandwich, means a lot and even a lunch saves so much for a family with a new baby after unpaid Federal maternity leave! #ShutdownStories thank you Chef!

I'm scheduled for surgery next week but trying to decide if I should postpone it since I dont know when I'm getting paid again

Spending the start of 2019 making a list of all the companies I need to call and make arrangements for our uncertain future with no paycheck. So far no one is willing to trade labor for their payment

Just tried to update my password on the FTC ID theft site and got this: "Due to the government shutdown, we are unable to offer this website service at this time. We will resume normal operations when the government is funded."

@realDonaldTrump Stop using us as a pawn in your pathetic chess game to get your stupid wall.
YOU swore Mexico would pay & now you expect us to pay?
SHAME ON YOU!
We are NOT a bargaining chip! We're human beings!

Went to put gas in my car & realized I had no money.

You can imagine how I felt knowing I need groceries for my son... need to pay PP Tax, buy dog food, etc.

Almost 11 years I've dedicated to my job and this is how I am thanked?

get my allergy shots every few weeks at the @NASA_Johnson clinic. I just realized my next one is due next week. I have to make an appointment but I have no idea how to handle this, as we?re not allowed to use government email, phones, etc.

I went to Walmart w my last paycheck. I kept asking the cashier what the total was. She stopped what she was doing, looked at me, and said, ?you a govt worker?? Yep, just moved here, just bought a house (haven?t made the 1st payment yet), & started chemo today.

Furlough Day 4-Civil Servants will spend today wondering which bills won?t be paid this first month of 2019. I know I?m thinking about whether they?ll repo my car for missing a payment or maybe I don?t need heart meds?

Have 3 kids with autism. Husband an essential government employee who is working without pay. Youngest child is severe & is on winter break. He cant take leave & we are shut-ins. We need his pay to survive. Do I pay my mortgage (1 whole check), pay utilities?

I met a woman named Debbie in Wal Mart checkout line today who couldn't afford her groceries. She was having to choose between food for her dog or her kids because of #trumpshutdown. I made sure she didn't have to make that choice today.

Thousands of scientists are barred from their #research while the #TrumpShutdown is in effect. Untold numbers of delicate experiments are ruined, with countless others set back significantly. This idiotic action is actively hurting US innovation.

At least The American Federation of Government Employees (AFGE) union is suing Trump's administration due to it being illegal for them to work without being paid. I hope they win. More should sue Him for the mess he has caused.

https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/423359-federal-workers-union-sues-trump-admin-over-government-shutdown

The news needs to air this 24/7 every time the government shuts down.

Saelune:
This is how violent revolutions happen.

Hell yeah

Bring in the guillotines

skywolfblue:

Lil devils x:

Abomination:
Sounds like all those poor people need to collectively pull themselves up by their bootstraps. They would if they were not lazy. There are jobs for those out there with the drive to get it, just have to hit the pavement with a fresh suit, a firm handshake, and a can-do attitude!

But seriously this entire mess would be considered criminal in any other developed nation. The moment you don't get paid is the day you walk off the job - especially if your bosses are still getting paid while NOT working.

It should be illegal, The problem is of course you would have to get rid of all the republicans in congress to make it illegal to do so since they are the ones who seem to love keeping the government shut down repeatedly. They have done this so many times now it seems to be their " go to" move at this point. They have proven without a doubt they care nothing for these people who are harmed by their actions, even worse, not only do they prevent them from being paid, they work hard to eliminate the welfare programs to save their lives when they cannot afford food due to their actions. They basically block all the exits and set the place on fire and sit back and think this is a great thing while everyone else perishes.

QFT.

This is a big part why even though I believe in the idea of classical "conservatism" in terms of supporting states rights, I cannot support the GOP the way it has been acting for the past 20 years.

They have become the party of NO. They are not interested in supporting the interests of the common people, they're opposed to everything just out of spite. The republican party badly needs new Teddy Roosevelts.

I was going to make some comment about not wanting Teddy's Imperialism and war mongering,.. But the US already has lots of that, so it's pointless.

Marik2:

Saelune:
This is how violent revolutions happen.

Hell yeah

Bring in the guillotines

Did someone say guillotines?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acT_PSAZ7BQ

Trump and the Republicans once again show their true colors by letting people suffer so they can extort the democrats, while blaming the democrats for not rolling over. It is kind of sad that this has been a thing since Obama's first years.

But we also shouldn't forget that this is just another example of how dysfunctional the US political system is. A functional national bureaucracy and public sector should never be temporarily suspended because the politicians are fighting over the public budget. I mean, even third world countries have figured out that you'll let the public sector run a deficit while the legislative organs work out a solution to their budgeting woes. The fact that the US instead shuts down all "non-essential" public works, instead of running a deficit or having some kind of emergency reserve for times when there's no approved budget, and then letting politicians use it as a bargaining chip in a game of political chicken is patently absurd.

Gethsemani:
But we also shouldn't forget that this is just another example of how dysfunctional the US political system is. A functional national bureaucracy and public sector should never be temporarily suspended because the politicians are fighting over the public budget. I mean, even third world countries have figured out that you'll let the public sector run a deficit while the legislative organs work out a solution to their budgeting woes. The fact that the US instead shuts down all "non-essential" public works, instead of running a deficit or having some kind of emergency reserve for times when there's no approved budget, and then letting politicians use it as a bargaining chip in a game of political chicken is patently absurd.

Pretty much. There have been countries getting by much better, while enduring larger political crises.

For example, here in Belgium after the 2010 general election. Essentially 589 days without a democratically elected government. The country was in political deadlock for over a year and half, but, part of the exiting ministers got assigned as a skeleton crew interim government to keep things going while the parties squabbled over which got the best jobs ... I mean, until government formation was concluded. Services continued, government employees got paid, taxes were collected. The country ran, for all intents and purposes.

It perhaps wasn't the best solution, nor equivalent to the current situation in the US, but the public sector kept on trucking, even if the country was more or less being held together with duct tape.

Gethsemani:
But we also shouldn't forget that this is just another example of how dysfunctional the US political system is. A functional national bureaucracy and public sector should never be temporarily suspended because the politicians are fighting over the public budget. I mean, even third world countries have figured out that you'll let the public sector run a deficit while the legislative organs work out a solution to their budgeting woes.

Under the US Constitution, only the legislature can agree government debt. This system has gone through many revisions - I believe originally they had to sign off every, single instance of borrowing individually.

I figure it's within the remit of the legislature to legislate no debt ceiling at all. However, I suspect this falls foul of the simple matter of power. It removes a huge ability to control the executive; and if removed, restoring it would potentially require a new bill which might be hard to pass (gridlock and presidential veto). I suppose they could pass a law where the debt ceiling automatically rolls up unless they specifically vote otherwise without the executive being able to interfere, but...

CM156, what do you think about all of this?

Marik2:
CM156, what do you think about all of this?

No-one can take his guns if the government's shut down.

Kwak:

Marik2:
CM156, what do you think about all of this?

No-one can take his guns if the government's shut down.

Nor is it about Israel

I'm beginning to think that these Republicans can't govern and that they're sociopathic. How strange.

TheRundownRabbit:
image

You sure like this guy.

Adam Jensen:
I'm beginning to think that these Republicans can't govern and that they're sociopathic. How strange.

You just realized that now?

Marik2:
You just realized that now?

What do you think?

trunkage:

Kwak:

Marik2:
CM156, what do you think about all of this?

No-one can take his guns if the government's shut down.

Nor is it about Israel

Speaking of which, I'm surprised Trumps Biggest Canadian Fan hasn't shown up to obnoxiously chuckle about Liberals getting dunked on like he always does regardless of conditions here in reality.

Actually, I haven't seen that guy in months, not since Election Day at least.

Breaking bullshit news update! Trump has brain-farted that he can build the wall, bypassing Congress, by declaring a national emergency.

No, I don't think that'll happen either.

On the other hand, if he really wants that wall, he should just fucking do it.

Agema:
Breaking bullshit news update! Trump has brain-farted that he can build the wall, bypassing Congress, by declaring a national emergency.

No, I don't think that'll happen either.

On the other hand, if he really wants that wall, he should just fucking do it.

Why not, China did it?

Samtemdo8:

Agema:
Breaking bullshit news update! Trump has brain-farted that he can build the wall, bypassing Congress, by declaring a national emergency.

No, I don't think that'll happen either.

On the other hand, if he really wants that wall, he should just fucking do it.

Why not, China did it?

Yeah but that was back during the Dark Age of Technology. The STC needed to build an actual wall was lost thousands of years ago.

Trump is going down like a bitch.

Agema:
Breaking bullshit news update! Trump has brain-farted that he can build the wall, bypassing Congress, by declaring a national emergency.

No, I don't think that'll happen either.

On the other hand, if he really wants that wall, he should just fucking do it.

So far, Trump has said:

-The Wall is already built(It isn't).

-Mexico is paying/will pay for it(Not happening).

-He can have the military do it(Possibility, but it'll still be fucking expensive. Those construction materials aren't free and neither is the money to support them being there doing the job. All you'd get out of it is labor that can't charge overtime).

-He can declare a national emergency(Maybe? I have no idea how that's gonna hold up).

I'm not even getting into the obvious question of why doesn't Trump just donate money from his ENORMOUS FORTUNE to show how much he cares about getting this done, or that he had 2 years of a compliant, boot-licking GOP controlled congress that didn't approve wall money and he let it slide, but suddenly only now is it super fucking important that he get his $5 Billion(which I'm sure will become $25 Billion if the Democrats were to offer him $5 Billion).

Of course, these shift from hour to hour, depending on what particular part of his brain happens to be misfiring at the time, but it all begs the question:

Why are we even having shutdown(sorry, it's a strike now, apparently)? None of his reasoning explains why any of this is required.

I mean, ignoring the obvious fact this is a big power trip for him, to prove he can dominate the newly seated Democratic house and damn be the consequences.

Of course, the irony that the border patrol, TSA, DHS and coast guard aren't getting another paycheck until this is resolved is probably lost on him. Oh, and the secret service isn't getting paid either. But they're still working, essentially for free.

I can only imagine how they'll be feeling about Trump in 2020, knowing they had to miss paychecks because he couldn't pull his head out of his ass.

Silentpony:

Samtemdo8:

Agema:
Breaking bullshit news update! Trump has brain-farted that he can build the wall, bypassing Congress, by declaring a national emergency.

No, I don't think that'll happen either.

On the other hand, if he really wants that wall, he should just fucking do it.

Why not, China did it?

Yeah but that was back during the Dark Age of Technology. The STC needed to build an actual wall was lost thousands of years ago.

The 40k universe is so silly that I could believe that they would need a STC to build a wall.

I do wonder if Trump is going to treat the builders like his other business transactions... make them take pay cut and then just not pay them.

trunkage:
I do wonder if Trump is going to treat the builders like his other business transactions... make them take pay cut and then just not pay them.

And given his habit of using minority workers to do his construction and the location the wall will be in, he will of course end up bringing a load of Mexican immigrants into the country to come work. Which is almost hilariously ironic

Saelune:
Ya know, Trump said he would make Mexico pay for the wall, and Trump never lies, so therefor everyone who donated to pay for the wall MUST be Mexicans and thus need to be deported.

I believe the argument is that the NAFTA renegotiation gets a "better deal" for the USA with respect to Mexico and thus can should count as making Mexico pay.

It's godawful bullshit, obviously.

Dalisclock:

I'm not even getting into the obvious question of why doesn't Trump just donate money from his ENORMOUS FORTUNE to show how much he cares about getting this done, or that he had 2 years of a compliant, boot-licking GOP controlled congress that didn't approve wall money and he let it slide, but suddenly only now is it super fucking important that he get his $5 Billion(which I'm sure will become $25 Billion if the Democrats were to offer him $5 Billion).

One of the reasons many rich people are so rich is their ability and propensity to not pay for things wherever possible. For instance, in the UK, there has been a recent scandal of unsafe cladding on tower blocks being a fire risk that needs replacing. The property tycoons who own the buildings long ago rigged the contracts to define much of the work on buildings as an "upgrade" rather than basic maintenance such that their tenants have to pay for it, not them. Except the tenants of such tower blocks are ususally very low income so they can't pay for such expensive work. The alternative therefore - due to the fire risk - is to get the government to pay. This also extends to a lot of personal expenditure. Be famous, get free clothing and accessories, etc. from people wanting to advertise. Certainly, as you say, he's dillied and dallied over the wall losing his advantage in the legislature. Which just makes him an idiot.

To some extent, I think he just thrives on causing chaos, because other people's chaos is a means to better control them. This is catastrophic in the running of complex organisations such as government, and he just doesn't much care about the little people not getting paid.

Agema:

One of the reasons many rich people are so rich is their ability and propensity to not pay for things wherever possible.

Another pretty relevant example would be Donald Trump's refusal to pay his contractors after work had come to an end.

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