Escapist Podcast: 077: J.J. Abrams and The End of THQ

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And my point was that it's much less likely for a male character to be put in a rape-situation for fanservice. They said in the podcast that Nathan Drake goes through all the same stuff, after all, and this was not about rape in real life, but rape as presented in video-games.

I don't really understand why you quoted me anyway.
I'm not uncomfortable with women being put in a situation where they are hurt, I dislike rape being presented in a sexualised way and for fanservice, and I'm sceptical of the game's ability to handle the idea in a way that doesn't turn exploitative. But I haven't played the game yet, maybe it will turn out okay.

Who said anything about this being presented as fanservice? Does a movie/tv show/book/video game glorify or exploit child pornography simply by mentioning that it exists? What some of you people seem to be ignoring is that it's not the presence of a rape scene in an adult story that you should be worrying about, it's how it is presented that's the important thing. And the little bit I've seen of it seems to present it as the disgusting, horrifying experience that no one would ever want to go through. Or it would be if the whole point of the scene wasn't to PREVENT IT FROM HAPPENING. Seriously, I think you need to go back and listen to that part of the podcast again. You're honestly sounding like one of the people they were talking about where all you heard was "rape, rape, rape, rape, rape, rape, rape, rape, rape, rape, rape," and didn't even begin to take things like "context", "situation" and "possible outcome" into account. The fact that you've for the most part dismissed this as just some gimmick to titillate the perverted section of the fanbase simply because, "What other reason would it be in a video game?", and it now needs to be proven wrong just to be deemed "okay" in your mind really irks me.

I can't believe this. You've actually got me defending a game that, despite being a Tomb Raider fan, I have absolutely no intention or desire to buy.

And, to be honest, you're sounding like one of those people that get annoyed if someone dares to criticise how rape is presented...

If I hear a book/movie/video game/opera has rape in it, my first reaction is to be hesitant, because it's a weighty subject that is way too often put in just to get sex/nudity, or worse, played for laughs.

You don't have to show rape for it to be exploitative.

This is what the executive producer of the game said:

Discussing why it's difficult to develop a female lead, Rosenberg said: "When people play Lara, they don't really project themselves into the character.

"They're more like. 'I want to protect her'. There's this sort of dynamic of, 'I'm going to this adventure with her and trying to protect her'.

"She's definitely the hero but - you're kind of like her helper. When you see her have to face these challenges, you start to root for her in a way that you might not root for a male character."

Which was not only totally idiotic (and many people are mad about this statement, not just that there might be rape), but also highlight a big problem with rape and violence towards female characters. Often the bad things happening to them is not about how it affects them, it's how it affects the hero. In this case where the female character is the hero, we still can't identify with her?
Because obviously women don't play video-games and men can't identify with female characters.

I stand by what I said.

I'm going to judge the game and how this stuff is presented AFTER I've played it.
I am sceptical, (as I tend to be), but I wish it will turn out more than okay, that it will be great.

And you're defending a game that not only have you not played, you aren't even going to play.

Rape (or even sexual violence, or child pornography) is a weighty subject, and I'm of the opinion that unless you know how to handle it well, you should not put it in, because even if you condemn it, you still might end up representing it in a simplified way, or as a lazy shorthand for 'this guy is evil'.
Some of my favourite books have rape scenes in them, I'm not against handling the subject, I'm sceptical of the most writer's ability to handle it.

The new Escapist Podcat graphic is sweet.

A big problem with the new Tomb Raider is we have very little to go on thus far, and given what we've seen people have stomped their feet and shouted their beliefs, on both sides. Very little has been shown, yet the podcast is saying they're right, doing just what the nay-sayers are doing, looking at the released footage and basing opinion on it, and what they think might happen in the rest of the game. You say that it's about Lara over coming all these problems and set backs, and it may very well be so, but the footage is mostly her in pain, being beaten, falling down - and I cannot think of a male character who has been hurt or injured (in their whole game) as much as Lara was in just the released footage, never mind the whole of the game.

You bring up Drake, Drake laughs at everything, takes it all, laughs it off and keeps going, same with other Male characters, usually less laughing but still, ooops, got shot, moving on, which IS bullshit, but it's still what is some what expected of games, to then have a character in pain, and they look like they're in pain is a difference, and by all means could be a really good step (not that it hasn't been done before). But it's a change, and it's not a guy crying out for his mommy, and still maintaining an awesome aura about himself. The major character in question, being dragged through the mud and taking damage, is The Female Heroine Lara Croft - reboot teenage girl or not, it is Lara - who only knows how to kick ass.

IF it were a guy I think more people would be talking about how weak he would appear, which is what is being asked of female characters not to be, yes she's getting up (hopefully) from all these downfalls, but she's still being a punching bag, more so than many (most?) male characters. Nathan Drake falls out of an Airplane, lands in the desert, no water, starts tripping over his own feet, is fairly weak, and then minutes later is running around with a gun shootin' shit up, in a same situation this new Lara seems like she would die - it makes more sense, but Lara Croft is a damn hero.

I'm not trying to say the new Tomb Raider looks bad, or that Lara will be a broken shell, beaten, raped, humiliated, it's just these things take faith in the writers and devs, and can easily go wrong, and questions are only reasonable.

Love your new podca(s)t picture

Great new picture.
As for streamign services.... you know.... im yet to find one that provides service in eastern europe. i went though, like, 50 services and it all went "not available in your country". so if you want peopel to stop piratin, maybe actually do something to give the a choice, because when there is NO legal way to get a movie save for importing it via ebay for the price that you earn in a whole month, saying "dont pirate" doesnt really work. give us netflix and our piracy rate will drop in half, because thats the reason we pirate for anyway - no such service.

Oh, enough rambling.

Yep, i agree that its good idea that studios are sold separately, makes much more possibility for all of them to live on. Hopefully Saint rows continue, the rest i dont really care that much about.

@Lara Croft comment - awesome response. fully agree.

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