Marvel's Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. Review - Episode 12: Seeds

 Pages PREV 1 2
 

Mr. Q:

One more guess for Skye: Jessica Drew, Spider-Woman. She has one of the most absurdly convoluted, over-retconned backstories in all of Marvel (at one point, she believed that she was actually a common spider evolved-up into a humanoid-looking form by The High Evolutionary) but it usually involves receiving powers at a young age somewhere remote. She's been both a S.H.I.E.L.D and HYDRA agent, and also has connections to The Skrulls ("Chitauri" in the movieverse.)

Wait, can Marvel Studios do Spider-Woman? I kinda figured that, with her namesake, it would tie into the Spider-Man franchise bundle now being held by Sony (for now). Or is she one of those characters, like Namor, is in a gray area on who owns the rights? Either way, good theory.

And now I'm curious to see you cover Spider-Woman in a future Big Picture episode. If only to see you try to make sense of a character with an origin way more confusing that Supergirl's.

Spider-Woman, unlike most "female version of male hero", actually has zero connections to Spider-Man. Her origins are independent of him and her stories are more associated with SHIELD and SWORD(organisation like SHIELD but deals with aliens).

image

Oh and one or two Easter Eggs that I think Bob was too numb to realize with this episode. Which actually seemed kind of clever.

"Bucky Barnes", Skye didn't just pluck that name from the list of dead SHIELD people at random to plug Winter Soldier. I think we were meant to realize that Bucky was the first name on the list. Captain America's anti Hydra team from the second half of Captain America, First Avenger? That was the beginnings of SHIELD. Cap, Bucky, Dugan and the Commando's were the original "operations" section. Howard Stark was "science", Peggy Carter was "Intelligence". Bucky was the first SHIELD casualty. Steve Rogers was the second. At least that is sort of the implication from CA1 and Nick Fury's scenes in Iron Man 2.

Ian Quinn, he is starting to feel more and more a bit like a blending of the comic versions of Justin Hammer and (out of costume) Norman Osborne. Which makes one wonder where Victoria Hands loyalties lie, and whether we might see SHIELD become HAMMER?

Agents of Shield is a decent enough show, hurt largely I think by not being as large scale as the cinematic counterpart.
It's a fun show and worth watching, but I'm not going to pretend it's the next "must watch" anything.

That being said, they need to start wrapping up some loose threads PDQ. Shows like X-Files and Lost soured a lot of folks on the never ending mystery and I think Agents of Shield would do well to put a few more of it's cards on the table.

As for Skye's identity. I'm not familiar enough with Marvel minutiae to know if there's anyone that fits the bill but I'm going to assume that her powers will end up being some sort of Technomancy...Technokinesis...Technopathy?
She can "speak" to or control computers.

She has a throw away line pretty early on in the series where she says that computer science comes naturally to her, and that she never really "learned" any of it. Maybe it's nothing.

There's also been some speculation that "The Clairvoyant" is going to end up being The Mandarin. Or more specifically the leader of the 10 rings taking up the name after having AIM and Slattery make a mockery of his organization.

Lizardon:

Mr. Q:

One more guess for Skye: Jessica Drew, Spider-Woman. She has one of the most absurdly convoluted, over-retconned backstories in all of Marvel (at one point, she believed that she was actually a common spider evolved-up into a humanoid-looking form by The High Evolutionary) but it usually involves receiving powers at a young age somewhere remote. She's been both a S.H.I.E.L.D and HYDRA agent, and also has connections to The Skrulls ("Chitauri" in the movieverse.)

Wait, can Marvel Studios do Spider-Woman? I kinda figured that, with her namesake, it would tie into the Spider-Man franchise bundle now being held by Sony (for now). Or is she one of those characters, like Namor, is in a gray area on who owns the rights? Either way, good theory.

And now I'm curious to see you cover Spider-Woman in a future Big Picture episode. If only to see you try to make sense of a character with an origin way more confusing that Supergirl's.

Spider-Woman, unlike most "female version of male hero", actually has zero connections to Spider-Man. Her origins are independent of him and her stories are more associated with SHIELD and SWORD(organisation like SHIELD but deals with aliens).

image

It gets even weirder. Spider Woman was specifically created to NOT be associated with the Spider-Man property. The same with SHE HULK. In the 70's Marvel had several TV licenses in production. Most well known was the Bill Bixby Incredible Hulk show (queue sad slow walking away music). But there was also a short lived Spider-Man show and an even shorter lived Captain America one. Marvel got wind that the Hulk producers were going to create a female hulk character, which could have given them rights to a female version of one of Marvels flagship characters. (This pre dating the modern practice of Marvel getting the rights to all derivative characters from the licensed movies and TV shows) . So Marvel being the geniuses that they are quickly Ms. pacman'd a good chuck of their line up. Just to be safe, get the characters in print, and block anyone outside from getting a claim. Hence the sudden surge of female themed new characters within a matter of a month or two. Spider Woman, She Hulk, Ms. Marvel (fearing some exposure from the old Shazzam Captain Marvel properties) . Dazzler also came out of that surge, but I think that was just a weird disco thing. Spider Woman and She Hulk were specifically designed to be distinct and separate licenses from their male counterparts. To insure that the TV shows would need to pay to use them as well. When Sony got the Spider-man movie rights. Spider Woman was specifically not part of it.

Johnny Novgorod:

Makabriel:

Johnny Novgorod:
So the answer to Coulson's mysterious resurrection is... he got resurrected? That's it? How underwhelming.
And no I don't think there's any reason for it other than "audiences like the guy".

Yeah, it's actually a lot more complicated than that.

Surgeons revived him and planted false memories. How's that a complicated explanation?

How about " It's more complicated than the rest of the Fanboy theories"? LMD? Clone? Pretty much all one dimensional. This idea has much more to it. We don't know why he was brought back. How he was brought back. The lasting implications of his revival. And surgeons didn't just revive him. He'd been dead for days. Something more brought him back.

Kumagawa Misogi:

Final ratings out and AoS sees another drop to the new second lowest viewership of 6.37 million. If after a 2 week break it sees another drop I wonder if it could drop below 5 million by series end?

episode/viewers in millions
01 - 12.12 ( pilot )
02 - 8.66
03 - 7.87
04 - 7.85
05 - 7.39
06 - 7.15
07 - 6.67
08 - 6.89
09 - 9.69 ( advertised as set after Thor: The Dark World )
10 - 6.11 ( fall season cliff hanger )
11 - 6.63 ( new year start )
12 - 6.37

12 episodes in and it hasn't stabilised yet.

It's cute how people are duped into thinking that those are still valid numbers. The reason for the numbers being where they are is the target demographic happens to be tech aware youth. When you look at the Live +7 Days to include DVR, and Hulu viewing it shoots up to the top in the ratings. The performance of Shield is the reason why they're trying out a Netflix Only series, but I get it. Live gives an immediately reportable number. No reporter wants to wait a week just to get the actual final number to report. The Stability of "live" is in question, but who cares when the number are stable in the Live+7. By then it's old news, and they want the viewership of the next episode, and no one cares that the Live only are about 70% off from the Live+7 a week after the fact. Except Disney who doesn't care when you watched it just that you watched it.

medv4380:

Kumagawa Misogi:

Final ratings out and AoS sees another drop to the new second lowest viewership of 6.37 million. If after a 2 week break it sees another drop I wonder if it could drop below 5 million by series end?

episode/viewers in millions
01 - 12.12 ( pilot )
02 - 8.66
03 - 7.87
04 - 7.85
05 - 7.39
06 - 7.15
07 - 6.67
08 - 6.89
09 - 9.69 ( advertised as set after Thor: The Dark World )
10 - 6.11 ( fall season cliff hanger )
11 - 6.63 ( new year start )
12 - 6.37

12 episodes in and it hasn't stabilised yet.

It's cute how people are duped into thinking that those are still valid numbers. The reason for the numbers being where they are is the target demographic happens to be tech aware youth. When you look at the Live +7 Days to include DVR, and Hulu viewing it shoots up to the top in the ratings. The performance of Shield is the reason why they're trying out a Netflix Only series, but I get it. Live gives an immediately reportable number. No reporter wants to wait a week just to get the actual final number to report. The Stability of "live" is in question, but who cares when the number are stable in the Live+7. By then it's old news, and they want the viewership of the next episode, and no one cares that the Live only are about 70% off from the Live+7 a week after the fact. Except Disney who doesn't care when you watched it just that you watched it.

ABC only cares about the live showing as those who pay ABC to place their adverts only care about live showing since DVR equal's skipped adverts.

Also the DVR ratings are dropping as episode 10 ( the most recent DVR available )has seen a 30% decrease from episode 2 ( I ignored the overinflated pilot to make it not look quite so extreme 46% if you want to know ).

Diddy_Mao:
Agents of Shield is a decent enough show, hurt largely I think by not being as large scale as the cinematic counterpart.
It's a fun show and worth watching, but I'm not going to pretend it's the next "must watch" anything.

That being said, they need to start wrapping up some loose threads PDQ. Shows like X-Files and Lost soured a lot of folks on the never ending mystery and I think Agents of Shield would do well to put a few more of it's cards on the table.

I think the show could learn a thing or two from Chuck, one of the last shows on syndicated TV I really enjoyed. Each season needs an arc, something you build up towards, you have a climactic couple episodes to work it out, then a denouement for the season along with a stinger for the arc of the next season. Also, Chuck was very good at changing the structure of the characters enough that from season to season, the interaction would never be the same. In fact if they play it right, Skye could very easily be the Chuck of AoS, going from the geeky hacker trying to fit in to the pseudo-leader with the most power to wield.

Just my take on it... I see a lot of similarities between the two shows, and how well it works depends greatly on how they end the season.

Kumagawa Misogi:

ABC only cares about the live showing as those who pay ABC to place their adverts only care about live showing since DVR equal's skipped adverts.

Also the DVR ratings are dropping as episode 10 ( the most recent DVR available )has seen a 30% decrease from episode 2 ( I ignored the overinflated pilot to make it not look quite so extreme 46% if you want to know ).

AoS is up against NCIS, and it will never overtake that show. As long as AoS is in a comfortable second place, I doubt ABC will look into killing off the show. Currently it's beating any other show in the timeslot, including The Biggest Loser. Nowadays it means something when your regular program is beating the reality show.

Kumagawa Misogi:

ABC only cares about the live showing as those who pay ABC to place their adverts only care about live showing since DVR equal's skipped adverts.

Also the DVR ratings are dropping as episode 10 ( the most recent DVR available )has seen a 30% decrease from episode 2 ( I ignored the overinflated pilot to make it not look quite so extreme 46% if you want to know ).

Only the local advertisers that ignore hulu care about that. ABC gets paid for the Hulu views, and even shares a portion with the local station. ABC even brands the local station logo onto every episode of shield to the best of the ability of Hulu to determine which station is your local station.

As for your logic of episode 10 has a significant ratings drop I counter with every series, even NCIS which is winning the time slot, had a bit of a drop because it's considered a normal seasonal drop. Why do you think they go on winter break? If you bothered to look at the increase between Live and Live+7 you'd see that your "drop" is most likely erased for Episode 11 and 12. But that would require accepting that Live+7 is about 66.3%(median) larger than live.

E1 - 17.01
E2 - 13.17
E3 - 12.01
E4 - 11.6
E5 - 11.16
E6 - 10.93
E7 - 10.13
E8 - 10.31
E9 - 12.75
E10 - 9.2

E11 Live 6.63 Estimate Live+7 11.0
E12 Live 6.37 Estimate Live+7 10.6

Using the Formula of
Live * 66.3% + Live = 'Live+7'
you get a fairly good estimate for all but 1,and 9. It even works for episode 10 which you are so bend out of shape about so I have no doubt that the's stable at around 10 - 11 million regular viewers.

Johnny Novgorod:

Makabriel:

Johnny Novgorod:
So the answer to Coulson's mysterious resurrection is... he got resurrected? That's it? How underwhelming.
And no I don't think there's any reason for it other than "audiences like the guy".

Yeah, it's actually a lot more complicated than that.

Surgeons revived him and planted false memories. How's that a complicated explanation?

Did...did you miss the part where he was dead for days and a strange machine was patching him up? Or how they constantly say that Nick Fury ordered it himself? Sounds not only mysterious but also complicated as hell...

Though maybe you meant to use another word like "lame" or "unimaginative"? I mean, that would make more sense since it sounds more opinion-based I suppose

EcnoTheNeato:

Johnny Novgorod:

Makabriel:

Yeah, it's actually a lot more complicated than that.

Surgeons revived him and planted false memories. How's that a complicated explanation?

Did...did you miss the part where he was dead for days and a strange machine was patching him up? Or how they constantly say that Nick Fury ordered it himself? Sounds not only mysterious but also complicated as hell...

It doesn't matter what technical mumbo jumbo they come up with, it's still surgery. They might as well just say SCIENCE from the get-go. And I maintain they resurrected him because it'd be easier to get an audience with this guy than someone new. No matter if they retcon him to be the savior of the universe.

Spaceman Spiff:

I started following it to keep up on all the happenings in the MCU, but was quickly dissatisfied with it after 3 episodes.

You might do well to give the show another chance, episode 4 is the first good one.

Kittyhawk:
Go and see Netflix and do something totally new, Whedon. Who knows, you might get to a third season.

That's an odd thing to say. Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Angel both ran well over 3 seasons (7 and 5 respectively) and no Netflix original series has 3 seasons yet.

EcnoTheNeato:

Johnny Novgorod:

Makabriel:

Yeah, it's actually a lot more complicated than that.

Surgeons revived him and planted false memories. How's that a complicated explanation?

Did...did you miss the part where he was dead for days and a strange machine was patching him up? Or how they constantly say that Nick Fury ordered it himself? Sounds not only mysterious but also complicated as hell...

Though maybe you meant to use another word like "lame" or "unimaginative"? I mean, that would make more sense since it sounds more opinion-based I suppose

Given how incredibly dull the explanation for how he was revived was, I kinda doubt the explanation for why is any more intriguing. If the show was better I'd be a bit more optimistic, but its...well...not.

You can't play up somethin as this gigantic mystery for half a season then lowball it that badly and expect people to get hyped for the next big mystery.

I don't know about specific characters, but based on Whedon's past works, I'd imagine that Skye's abilities will likely include strength and ass-kicking. I'm also guessing that she'll end up having to face off with Mike Peterson from the pilot ep as well as other centipede soldiers.

Johnny Novgorod:

EcnoTheNeato:

Johnny Novgorod:

Surgeons revived him and planted false memories. How's that a complicated explanation?

Did...did you miss the part where he was dead for days and a strange machine was patching him up? Or how they constantly say that Nick Fury ordered it himself? Sounds not only mysterious but also complicated as hell...

It doesn't matter what technical mumbo jumbo they come up with, it's still surgery. They might as well just say SCIENCE from the get-go. And I maintain they resurrected him because it'd be easier to get an audience with this guy than someone new. No matter if they retcon him to be the savior of the universe.

Is 'sciencing his brain back from the dead' by surgery, really that different from 'sciencing his brain into an artificial body' by surgery? According to your logic, anyway. No matter what they did, it was always going to boil down to 'SCIENCE' or 'MAGIC', and most of the audience knew that. What we didn't know was just how, and much more importantly, why, it was done.

Well whoever Skye turns out to be it will probably be the most disappointing person possible.

To determine what Skye actually is, we need to first determine what she can't be.

A mutant.
Mutants are owned by 20th Century Fox, and I don't think they will allow Marvel to run that part of the business too.
Since we haven't seen or heard mention of mutants I think they are still off-limits for Marvel.

An Alien.
She had a physical when she came on board. You'd think they would notice. Unless she is the type of alien that is COMPLETELY identical to humans.
Or is Simmons is also part of the "protect Skye" movement, which would be idiotic.

Anything related to Spider-man.
Because you know, Sony owns that.

So, with mutant and alien out, what are we left with?
Time traveller? Something similar to X-23, but without the mutant connection? Genetic experiment?

No idea, to be honest.
The most interesting idea would be the X-23 treatment. A female clone of a powerful hero. Maybe a female Tony Stark or something, seeing her mechanical and computer abilities.
Taskmaster seems also to not be a stretch, she seems to pick up skills and abilities quickly.
Taskmaster is also one of the more notable and interesting Avengers enemy, and with a next few movies in the works, it seems to not be a bad idea to name-drop him.

EDIT:
Well, nevermind all that, figured it out.
What we should remind ourselves of is that this show is a commercial for the other Marvel franchises.
Skye is the female "companion" of a major villain that was already hinted at in the movies.
Probably on the run and in hiding on Earth. Erased her own mind probably to not give herself away.
She is also one of the major themes of the show, and we should remember the line that was said about her:
"Wherever she goes death follows."
She is Lady Death. Companion of Thanos.
We saw Thanos at the end of The Avengers.
He would also need a reason to go to earth. Besides the artefacts, that are in Thor's hands, who is also a protector of Earth.
Also, he smiled when they said "To challenge them is to court death", something that people who are familiar with Thanos know he does. They even have a "child" together, known as Rot.

Seriously doubt Skye is going to end up being anything we'll recognize from the Marvel U up front.
Certainly nothing mainstream in its familiarity. I wouldn't be shocked if they re-write the origins of someone like Scorpion (Carmilla Black, aka Thasanee Rappaccini, daughter of AIM Scientist Supreme Monica Rappaccini,) to tie in to her character, but I doubt there will be ANY direct match to any character "as we know them."

(Although with all the emphasis on there being "no such thing" as telepathy, I would not be surprised if we find out THAT is her power set.)

Regarding Donnie Gill... his origins in the Marvel Universe have nothing to do with the Inhumans outside of very recent events where he was conveniently affected by terrigenesis to have the same powers his powersuit gave him.
Whether or not that makes him "technically Inhuman" is debatable.
I do love the creative re-imagining of Blizzard for AoS though.
I could be mistaken, but aren't filming rights to all things directly Inhuman tied up with the Fantastic Four license?

Who is the dude now being controlled by the clairvoyant? He was the first character with superpowers from episode one, and everything for him revolves around his son...why no mention of him in this review?
I hope I'm not getting my episodes mixed up...

 Pages PREV 1 2

Reply to Thread

Posting on this forum is disabled.