Jimquisition: Stupid Sexy Bayonetta

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MarsAtlas:

Kuro Serpentina:
While I agree with Jim about the points he was making, the reasons he were making the points seems a bit off
From what I've heard about the Polygon review thing centres around a certain level of hypocrisy from the reviewer, who is known to often visit a smut site where women in various arrays of undress post up for viewer enjoyment, which reach and even surpass the levels of "Fanservice" Bayonetta has become partly known for; which has let many, quite rightly in my opinion, to call foul on the reviewer for condemning it while indulging in an extremely similar thing in his own time.

Have you ever considered that some people find it uncomfortable when people try tp inject sex into a beat-em-up videogame?

Absolutely. I review movies and TV shows and I've said a few times, "Never try to out-porn porn." Whenever you inject porn where it doesn't below, like a video game, you tend to get a shitty video game and weak porn.

There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

Rellik San:

Muspelheim:
I feel that the root problem is that people have attached far too much of their identity and feeling of self-worth into certain games, or gaming as a whole.

I get what you're saying here, that attaching a defining opinion to yourself as one thing only serves to cheapen the human interactive experience. BUT as someone who's primary hobbies and interests (Computer games, Warhammer, DnD, board games etc) are all games related, I would say safely when asked about my hobbies "I'm a gamer mostly" is an excellent short hand for describing that without making myself sound like some kind of salesman pitching myself and my interests to other people, from that the conversation can drift to "cool, what kinda games do you like?" or to "Cool, what else do you do?" depending on the persons level of interest.

And as someone who does these things and they feel good, yeah I put a lot of my self worth into it (mainly into warhammer) because "Bro that model looks awesome" is an awesome and affirming thing to hear. :)

But I also like to add something to the first quote which is hoping that people with the same hobby, that is GAMING as whole, isn't an idiot who will put negativity in everything in his or her life. In this case, making internet controversy that holds a very small reason to care but with enough influence, can cause a massive influx to the whole gaming society until it become a thing.

It maybe funny to read people's unrelenting reaction before, but now it's getting really old and getting tiresome on how people turned a hobby into something so baffling. Things like female developer quitting her job shouldn't be a thing if people aren't such an a-holes all the time. Can't we just enjoy gaming as it is? Because the only answer we often see is simply "No".

Uriel_Hayabusa:
I've never understood the ''Bayonetta has agencry over her sexiness!'' argument. At the end of the day Bayonetta is still a fictional character, thought of and created to be that way.

Because like all fictional characters, it's the way she's presented and portrayed as sexy without specifically being sexually active, she is never presented as doing it for the approval of a male character, she is never presented as trying to win the affections of anyone and most of all she's presented as having fun doing so. Comparatively females in media are usually only presented as being sexy for their object of affections desires (see almost any Molly Ringwald film of the 80's). There is a difference between the too, a character written as having sexual agency is a wholly differing beast to a character presented without it.

If you would care for another example: Angua from the Discworld series, just replace "sexuality" with "Werewolf" and you basically have the same result (only with a lot less absurdism and hyperactivity and a more realised human approach).

VoidOfOne:
Another statement to add to that would be "With all due respect..." which is followed by saying something rather disrespectful, most of the time. Then again, perhaps the subject intended is due little or no respect.

Eh, there are legitimate reasons to say "With all due respect", though. "You're more important than me, but I think you are wrong", for example.

Silentpony:

Bayonetta dresses are her characters choose. Great. Except bullshit. Bayonetta is not a person. She is not real. Someone, most likely a man, WROTE her. They wrote 'Bayonetta kills bosses by ripping her clothes off and sucking on lolipops' ...and that's just cool, because...why?

This, basically.

I guess Bayonetta being written as strong and independent is still better than the alternative of being explicitly written as a reluctant victim of sexualization. But in the present atmosphere of gender portrayals, it's not exactly someting revolutionary or praiseworthy either, It's just the result of someone remembering not to be TOO creepy and at least writing a character who happens to be all right with being sexualized.

I remember reasing these old Jules Verne novels, where one of the characters was the protagonist's freed slave, who kept tagging along with him out of devotion. I'm pretty sure that Verne thought he was being super-progressive for having freed black characters, but in retrospect, they were pretty crude archetypes that were written in a way that their agency-dilled life choice just happened to involve serving a Great White Dude as a slave in all but name.

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

Very interesting, and a cause for concern that should be addressed.

What site is this happening on? I haven't noticed myself.

Good video. Bayonetta has always been an interesting character for me, (even though I haven't played the games yet) because of how she's so over the top. So much so that really, it feels like she's mocking the kinds of people who wanna use her for fapping material. It's like she's going "Oh, you think this is hot, do you? Well, guess what, you wouldn't stand a chance with me, kiddo. I'll make you insecure that you wouldn't stand a ghost of a chance with any woman as badass as me."

In any case, I'm here mostly for the comments that totally miss the point.

Coreless:
Love the progressive mentality when it comes to twisting narratives, now you aren't even aloud to speak your mind anymore because now you have to frame any conversation in a way they demand or they won't even listen to you lol. So much for freedom of speech and due process because if they can cut you off before you speak or are even get a chance to defend yourself then they win by default.

Eh? Didn't Jim actually say discussion of Bayonetta was GOOD and we should be having it? Or did you watch a totally different video than me?

Or are you referring to that he said at the beginning of the video?

If so, in WHAT scenario is it appropriate to say "I wholeheartedly condemn death threats against group X, However 'Argument'"? I mean, aside from "I wholeheartedly condemn death threats, however if you're a fascist dictator committing genocide and having kids send to the firing squad for your amusement, you really have to expect that kind of thing because you are an irredeemable monster"?

Seriously. In WHAT situation is it appropriate and productive to threaten to kill someone who isn't outright threatening to literally kill YOU?

There's a difference between the "must speak in exactly progressive tone and not have contrary opinion or be considered idiot beep boop" thing you're suggesting and the "Yeah, I'll use common sense and not be a massive douche" reality of arguments. Appending a "however" argument to just about any instance of "I condemn death threats" is a violation of the second one, not the first.

Captcha: "Have an Inkling" Yes, you really should.

Coreless:
Love the progressive mentality when it comes to twisting narratives, now you aren't even aloud to speak your mind anymore because now you have to frame any conversation in a way they demand or they won't even listen to you lol. So much for freedom of speech and due process because if they can cut you off before you speak or are even get a chance to defend yourself then they win by default.

That's not what "freedom of speech" or "due process" mean, but far be it from me to "censor" your narrative.

Safe. Boring.

Jim has learned the important value of freedom of speech, but then he only uses it to promote the safe and neutral position. I much prefer the more controversial Jimquisition vids.

Thank fucking god for you, Jim. This video should be required viewing for participation in any online discussion anywhere.

VanQ:
Also, the first 50 seconds of that video was the most condescending assery I've experienced in a long time. People were dicks to you on twitter, that's awful. Don't take it out on your audience.

If that statement pissed you off that much... I think a bit more introspection might be in order on exactly why you found that offensive...

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

And this is why you need to support your claim with evidence.

Kindly demonstrate where someone said "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

Cliff Notes:People have different opinions, stop being chodes to each other over said opinions.

Edit to expand on my thoughts of this:
This concept is a given, why do you need a video to make a "rally cry" around this? You could honestly say this about any discussion about anything where people don't agree on a subject. I don't agree with Yahtzee about Hyrule Warriors after finally playing it and think he went on a more Nintendo is just on a holding pattern (Yep let's ignore the HD remake of a old game and call the "new" style of game for the franchise a holding pattern), but I won't scream and rant and rave about it. Have a discussion yes, but I'm not going to shoot down his opinion over the game and say he is wrong. This video just seems like another person saying "Hey be nice on the internet".

And sanctimonious condescending nonsense at the beginning. Okay. You wanna know why people call you an SJW Jim? Well, the first 40 seconds of your video is the answer. Just to clear that up, since I've been seeing in your tweets that you're a bit confused on the matter.(btw, how do you like my condescension. Feels good dun'it?)

Wanna know why people have to denounce harassment as an opening statement? Because nowadays there is a narrative driven that anyone who's pro GG or who disagrees with, let's say Anita, is supporting harassment. It is used to explain to self-righteous holier than thou individuals, that you can disagree with someone and not be bigoted towards their particular characteristics. See, complex thoughts and all that.

Bayonetta's unbelievable camp nature is such a joy, but it seems that sexualisation is always bad regardless of the character's presentation in the story (sigh).

Guffe:
Snip

OMG Bayonetta is the best game ever. Woo! Woo! Though I'm not sure if the Wii U pad is better for it than the 360 pad, maybe I just need to play the demo for B2 six more times.

Uriel_Hayabusa:
I've never understood the ''Bayonetta has agencry over her sexiness!'' argument. At the end of the day Bayonetta is still a fictional character, thought of and created to be that way.

The point Sterling is trying to make is that: If it makes sense for a character to act/dress sexual in universe, it's ok. Same goes for "male gaze" shots too. If the camera is trying to communicate the in universe attraction of one character to another, it's ok.
Any questions?

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

Reviews aren't journalism, they are the reviewers personal opinions. 100% objective criticism is boring and impossible. If a reviewer has a problem with the depiction of a character in a piece of media then they should be able to include it in the review without fear of ridicule.

Kuro Serpentina:
While I agree with Jim about the points he was making, the reasons he were making the points seems a bit off
From what I've heard about the Polygon review thing centres around a certain level of hypocrisy from the reviewer, who is known to often visit a smut site where women in various arrays of undress post up for viewer enjoyment, which reach and even surpass the levels of "Fanservice" Bayonetta has become partly known for; which has let many, quite rightly in my opinion, to call foul on the reviewer for condemning it while indulging in an extremely similar thing in his own time.
Makes the whole thing sound a tad disingenuous.
As for the whole discussing of these sorts of things, yeah that would be awesome... however the whole mess that the community at large is currently embroiled in is in no small part due to a lack to out right refusal to discus things

I don't see how it's that far off or even hypocritical. Now, I haven't read the review myself, but there's a context for everything, and so while the reviewer might enjoy watching porn, that doesn't mean he feels comfortable with it being outside of the context of which he establishes when viewing said porn. As an example, I like both peanut butter and ketchup, but not together. So it's hardly a stretch for a reviewer to say "hey, I like porn and video games, but I'm not a fan of them together." It's not hypocritical, it's simply thinking two things don't mix well, like water and oil.

Don Incognito:

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

And this is why you need to support your claim with evidence.

Kindly demonstrate where someone said "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

Ahm, off the top of my head, that Macintosh fella, the producer of Feminist Frequency. The first part at least, not the reviewing part. But it is also kind of clear at this point that when someone denounces something as sexist or racist or any isms, that bars no dissent. If you disagree, then you are a sexist/racist/-isist.

danielcofour:

Don Incognito:

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

And this is why you need to support your claim with evidence.

Kindly demonstrate where someone said "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

Ahm, off the top of my head, that Macintosh fella, the producer of Feminist Frequency. The first part at least, not the reviewing part. But it is also kind of clear at this point that when someone denounces something as sexist or racist or any isms, that bars no dissent. If you disagree, then you are a sexist/racist/-isist.

So, that's a NO, then.

Moreover, please provide citation for your claim regarding dissent.

If we're going to have an open and honest discussion about these topics, we need to avoid hyperbole and demonization of those on the other side.

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

If I find a reviewer obnoxious, I just don't use his reviews as source of information when picking my games. There must be a gazillion different voices out there when it comes to game reviews.

danielcofour:
And sanctimonious condescending nonsense at the beginning. Okay. You wanna know why people call you an SJW Jim? Well, the first 40 seconds of your video is the answer. Just to clear that up, since I've been seeing in your tweets that you're a bit confused on the matter.(btw, how do you like my condescension. Feels good dun'it?)

Wanna know why people have to denounce harassment as an opening statement? Because nowadays there is a narrative driven that anyone who's pro GG or who disagrees with, let's say Anita, is supporting harassment. It is used to explain to self-righteous holier than thou individuals, that you can disagree with someone and not be bigoted towards their particular characteristics. See, complex thoughts and all that.

I think it's more the WORDING there, buddy.

Saying "First off, I disagree with death threats blah blah, yadda yadda. *line break* Now, personally I have problems with person X, because reasons Y, Z, P, and Q. But again, death threats are awful and I don't wish any on X, and anyone who does should have no part in the discussion." has a totally different from "I disagree with death threats yadda yadda HOWEVER, I have problems with Person X because...".

In the first one you condemn the harassment and then make your point in a way that's not connected to harassment, whereas the wording in the second one seems to imply justification for it.

Is it kind of arbitrary and stupid? Yes. But that's how language is, man. Different wording can make all the difference in the world.

Death Threats against Jim Stearling are deplorable and can not be condon't however, if he was comically struck with a wet fish as a result of his smart-arse attempts at being cute about Social Media sites I would look the other way.

Uriel_Hayabusa:
I've never understood the ''Bayonetta has agencry over her sexiness!'' argument. At the end of the day Bayonetta is still a fictional character, thought of and created to be that way.

Willing suspension of disbelief. It's the same reason people[1] would be pissed off if the upcoming JLA movie had Batman dual-wielding machine guns and sexually harassing Wonder Woman. Sure, Batman's not real, so that's no more "out of character" than anything else he does, but it'd feel more dissonant. Fictional characters can, and usually do, have their own personalities. One test (stolen shamelessly from the Plinkett Phantom Menace reviews) goes like this:
Describe the character in as much detail as possible without mentioning their name, job, appearance or role in the story. The more you can say about them, the better.
Let's try a few characters off the top of my head (note: I haven't played Bayonetta, so I'm going off an LP I saw a few years ago on that one):

Even though none of the above are real people, the last one definitely comes across as having less agency than the others.

[1] well, except Frank Miller...

VoidOfOne:

Kuro Serpentina:
While I agree with Jim about the points he was making, the reasons he were making the points seems a bit off
From what I've heard about the Polygon review thing centres around a certain level of hypocrisy from the reviewer, who is known to often visit a smut site where women in various arrays of undress post up for viewer enjoyment, which reach and even surpass the levels of "Fanservice" Bayonetta has become partly known for; which has let many, quite rightly in my opinion, to call foul on the reviewer for condemning it while indulging in an extremely similar thing in his own time.
Makes the whole thing sound a tad disingenuous.
As for the whole discussing of these sorts of things, yeah that would be awesome... however the whole mess that the community at large is currently embroiled in is in no small part due to a lack to out right refusal to discus things

It's one thing to question the reviewer, quite another to tell Nintendo to change its business practices with a gaming website due to the review. Call foul if you want, but you change the whole argument when you call for Nintendo to "cut Polygon out of Nintendo Press Material." It's no longer about simply disagreeing with the review or reviewer (which is everyone's right to do), but now the call is to hinder Polygon for simply doing what they have been allowed to do. And the latter helps no one except for the egos of the people who took "offense" to the points made in the review they disagreed with.

I do agree that this alone does seem a tad too far and silly an action to take
That said, from what I hear this isn't the only thing that Polygon has been called out on, so I could see this being a camel straw incident for some

aegix drakan:
Good video. Bayonetta has always been an interesting character for me, (even though I haven't played the games yet) because of how she's so over the top. So much so that really, it feels like she's mocking the kinds of people who wanna use her for fapping material. It's like she's going "Oh, you think this is hot, do you? Well, guess what, you wouldn't stand a chance with me, kiddo. I'll make you insecure that you wouldn't stand a ghost of a chance with any woman as badass as me."

In any case, I'm here mostly for the comments that totally miss the point.

Coreless:
Love the progressive mentality when it comes to twisting narratives, now you aren't even aloud to speak your mind anymore because now you have to frame any conversation in a way they demand or they won't even listen to you lol. So much for freedom of speech and due process because if they can cut you off before you speak or are even get a chance to defend yourself then they win by default.

Eh? Didn't Jim actually say discussion of Bayonetta was GOOD and we should be having it? Or did you watch a totally different video than me?

Or are you referring to that he said at the beginning of the video?

If so, in WHAT scenario is it appropriate to say "I wholeheartedly condemn death threats against group X, However 'Argument'"? I mean, aside from "I wholeheartedly condemn death threats, however if you're a fascist dictator committing genocide and having kids send to the firing squad for your amusement, you really have to expect that kind of thing because you are an irredeemable monster"?

Seriously. In WHAT situation is it appropriate and productive to threaten to kill someone who isn't outright threatening to literally kill YOU?

There's a difference between the "must speak in exactly progressive tone and not have contrary opinion or be considered idiot beep boop" thing you're suggesting and the "Yeah, I'll use common sense and not be a massive douche" reality of arguments. Appending a "however" argument to just about any instance of "I condemn death threats" is a violation of the second one, not the first.

Captcha: "Have an Inkling" Yes, you really should.

People can say "lets have a discussion" all they want but if a person has to frame their speech in such a way that if they don't, they won't even get listened to then quite frankly that isn't a discussion, that is one side controlling the narrative. Appending a "however" doesn't take away from the fact that the person was harassed and doesn't make your non consent disappear in a puff of smoke, if a situation happened that requires investigation then you need to pursue it no matter what happened or what was said. You don't get immunity from investigation because something horrific did or might have happened to you, I'm sorry if that comes off as insensitive but facts will always trump feelings when it comes to serious issues like these.

Captcha: "if you want to be condescending just do it, no need to make up catchas", yes I concur [/quote]

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

I feel like this depends on what a game "review" actually is, and what kind of content the website in and of it self produces.

Is a review just an article saying this game is good because x but bad because y?

Or is it the author's experience with the game and what they enjoyed and disliked?

When I look at reviews, I want to see what a certain reviewer thinks of a game. I trust the reviewers on this website, and so I want to see what they thought of a game I have interest in. But other people may just want to know if a game is good or not, which is difficult because what makes a game 'good' to one person may not make it so to another.

It sounds like the Polygon reviewer was writing the second kind of article.

Because there aren't any rules about what kind of article a gaming journalist has to write (in fact someone doesn't even have to be a journalist, they could just be a blogger) this means that the kind of review one is going to see varies from website to website, and even varies between individual publishers on the SAME website.

MarsAtlas:

Kuro Serpentina:
While I agree with Jim about the points he was making, the reasons he were making the points seems a bit off
From what I've heard about the Polygon review thing centres around a certain level of hypocrisy from the reviewer, who is known to often visit a smut site where women in various arrays of undress post up for viewer enjoyment, which reach and even surpass the levels of "Fanservice" Bayonetta has become partly known for; which has let many, quite rightly in my opinion, to call foul on the reviewer for condemning it while indulging in an extremely similar thing in his own time.

Have you ever considered that some people find it uncomfortable when people try tp inject sex into a beat-em-up videogame? That maybe some people like to keep their sexual fantasies in one realm and videogames in another? That maybe many people don't play games for masturbation material but for a difference experience? It doesn't necessarily make you a prude because you don't like sex in videogames, and in my experience, most people don't like it because they don't want sexual fantasies in the same realm as gaming. I can only speak for myself, but if I wanted porn, I'd go watch porn. If I wanted a lap dance, I'd go get a lap dance, not experience a lap dance between shooting galleries in Duke Nukem. Its the same reason that when people generally want some excitement in their life and do something, like, say, skydiving, they don't bring sex workers skydiving with them.

I feel I must stress that I personally hold no stakes in this matter. In the end of the day, I see this whole thing as just a couple of parasites called man fighting on another over ethics and viewpoints.
I am simply relaying other sides of the story.
Kindly do not shoot the messenger, least he be forced to shoot back

Don Incognito:

Thanatos2k:
There is a difference between saying "I have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character" and "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

And this is why game journalism needs to be reformed.

And this is why you need to support your claim with evidence.

Kindly demonstrate where someone said "Everyone should have personal problems with Bayonetta as a character, I'm docking the score to show this to you and to punish the developers, and if you think otherwise I'm deleting your comments."

Well you could just look at the Polygon review for one example

http://www.polygon.com/2014/10/13/6957677/bayonetta-2-review-wii-u

For opinions presented as facts, personal issues on the level of the reviewer detracting from the score, etc. Whether or not Polygon's been deleting disagreeing comments i couldn't say 'cause there's no way to confirm that without talking to people whose comments have been deleted.

OT: Well it's a character action game from Platinum. Of course i'm gonna buy it. Whether it's Raiden jumping around and doing ridiculous poses or Bayonetta the game's gonna be amazing.

EDIT: Jumping around doing ridiculous poses in high heels.

I cant be the only one thinking that lowering game score for something that is quite obvious and subjective is stupid.

Thats like someone saying that gta v is a bad game, because it has theft in it, and that someone doesnt feel comfortable with theft. 7/10.

Unless of course, that is the shtick of your entire website/magazine/youtube channel.
For example, i would be fine if this was on "Game reviews for people who hate crime!" - then you can assume that your audience follows your ideals on crime.

But doing it on a fairly generic and "appeal to everyone" website?

Quite stupid.

Uriel_Hayabusa:
snip

You went full McIntosh

Never go full McIntosh

Reviews are personal opinions. Neither you, the developers or the world at large are under any obligation to care what someone at Polygon thinks, if you don't align yourself with their views.

To suggest that someone shouldn't be allowed to post a review because you disagree with their reasoning is the most thoughtless, backwards nonsense imaginable. Even if people are put off by the game, they are people who take that reviewer's opinions into account when making a purchasing decision. It's their choice to buy or not to buy. If you want that sort of influence, write reviews yourself and maybe someone will pay you for them one day. If not, fuck off.

neonit:
But doing it on a fairly generic and "appeal to everyone" website?

This isn't a thing that exists. No reviewer (and by reviewer I mean person, not publication) sets out to create a blanket view for everyone to follow. That's ludicrous.

Hey Jim, since you have a problem with harassment, could you come out and say attacking gamers because they hold a different opinion then you is wrong? Since, you know, it's happening on a similar (or arguably greater) level then what you spend the first 40 seconds of the video complaining about.

On the main topic, it's hard to have a discussion on these issues since the largest part of those both in the industry and outside of it who are publicizing the issue are ones who do not debate, only state. No criticism, no counters to their argument, is ever responded to or permitted. It's impossible to have a discussion on an issue when one side isn't willing to talk about it outside of stating how they feel about it then ignoring everything else.

klaynexas3:

Kuro Serpentina:
While I agree with Jim about the points he was making, the reasons he were making the points seems a bit off
From what I've heard about the Polygon review thing centres around a certain level of hypocrisy from the reviewer, who is known to often visit a smut site where women in various arrays of undress post up for viewer enjoyment, which reach and even surpass the levels of "Fanservice" Bayonetta has become partly known for; which has let many, quite rightly in my opinion, to call foul on the reviewer for condemning it while indulging in an extremely similar thing in his own time.
Makes the whole thing sound a tad disingenuous.
As for the whole discussing of these sorts of things, yeah that would be awesome... however the whole mess that the community at large is currently embroiled in is in no small part due to a lack to out right refusal to discus things

I don't see how it's that far off or even hypocritical. Now, I haven't read the review myself, but there's a context for everything, and so while the reviewer might enjoy watching porn, that doesn't mean he feels comfortable with it being outside of the context of which he establishes when viewing said porn. As an example, I like both peanut butter and ketchup, but not together. So it's hardly a stretch for a reviewer to say "hey, I like porn and video games, but I'm not a fan of them together." It's not hypocritical, it's simply thinking two things don't mix well, like water and oil.

It seems you misunderstood the nature of the site
From what I hear its not actually porn site. I believe its official stance is that its a site solely used to allow people to show off tattoos in a similar manner to the said moments of fanservice in the game (Somewhat like a peepshow I have been told)
As for the whole keeping video games and porn separate angel you and a few others seem to be pushing... I find that adorable~ The subject that has been crossed long long ago~ In fact without the union of video games and porn, we wouldn't have JRPGs or even our modern day video game story telling methods
It would take me an age and a half to explain, so I advise you look into it yourself, as its a very interesting subject

i love the series it just is a very small bit annoying the second is on a system i really don't have any interest in

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