Let's Look at the New Blood Angels Codex

Let's Look at the New Blood Angels Codex

Is the new Codex: Blood Angels a real change in direction for Warhammer 40k, or just more of the same?

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I suppose the real question is this: will it be able to deal with a Tau Fire Warrior/Crisis Suit line or will it fall flat on its face like every other assault army? My guess would be no, since the Tau gun line is 101% broken if you don't play a vehicle army.

It seems to me that this is just not the edition for close combat. Armies like Tau and Eldar, that either shoot farther than everyone else or that can move and shoot, seem to get the natural advantage. Plus, with the 7th edition close combat challenge rules, you can't even save your Sanguinary Priest/Power Fist Sergeant from having to deal with all the wounds back.

On the other hand, that +1 to initiative is awesome because now the Blood Angels have the same initiative on the charge as Eldar/Dark Eldar/Slanesshi Chaos Marines. But, to be fair, it you've gotten close enough to an Eldar unit for that to matter, you're probably winning already.

Ironman126:
I suppose the real question is this: will it be able to deal with a Tau Fire Warrior/Crisis Suit line or will it fall flat on its face like every other assault army? My guess would be no, since the Tau gun line is 101% broken if you don't play a vehicle army.

It seems to me that this is just not the edition for close combat. Armies like Tau and Eldar, that either shoot farther than everyone else or that can move and shoot, seem to get the natural advantage. Plus, with the 7th edition close combat challenge rules, you can't even save your Sanguinary Priest/Power Fist Sergeant from having to deal with all the wounds back.

On the other hand, that +1 to initiative is awesome because now the Blood Angels have the same initiative on the charge as Eldar/Dark Eldar/Slanesshi Chaos Marines. But, to be fair, it you've gotten close enough to an Eldar unit for that to matter, you're probably winning already.

Based on what you're saying I'm glad to hear close combat still seems pretty broken. Makes me all the more glad that I ditched the game completely in 6th edition. Not that GW has ever been good at game balance, but jesus christ they fucked up with the new close combat rules.

So... why does their armor have pecs?

Vivi22:

Ironman126:
snip

Based on what you're saying I'm glad to hear close combat still seems pretty broken. Makes me all the more glad that I ditched the game completely in 6th edition. Not that GW has ever been good at game balance, but jesus christ they fucked up with the new close combat rules.

It is beyond broken. Th Orks and Tyranids are almost completely unplayable. The Orks actually are unplayable, but that's the fault of their latest codex more than anything. Between 7th edition's "Flying/Jump monstrous creatures can't do shit" rule and the "smash attacks now only hit once, not half the number of normal attacks" change, close combat is pretty much dead. If you are lucky enough to get into melee with an enemy, you get to roll hundreds of dice that do effectively nothing. Only specialized CQB units can do anything of value and even then it's dodgy. I was playing a game against Necrons and my 5-man Space Marine tactical squad and Captain beat a Lord and his 5 Lychguard retinue.

Plus, Tau/Eldar armies are basically impossible to beat. Between the Tau's range and the Eldar's trickery and psykers, good fucking luck, mate.

Ironman126:

Vivi22:

Ironman126:
snip

Based on what you're saying I'm glad to hear close combat still seems pretty broken. Makes me all the more glad that I ditched the game completely in 6th edition. Not that GW has ever been good at game balance, but jesus christ they fucked up with the new close combat rules.

It is beyond broken. Th Orks and Tyranids are almost completely unplayable. The Orks actually are unplayable, but that's the fault of their latest codex more than anything. Between 7th edition's "Flying/Jump monstrous creatures can't do shit" rule and the "smash attacks now only hit once, not half the number of normal attacks" change, close combat is pretty much dead. If you are lucky enough to get into melee with an enemy, you get to roll hundreds of dice that do effectively nothing. Only specialized CQB units can do anything of value and even then it's dodgy. I was playing a game against Necrons and my 5-man Space Marine tactical squad and Captain beat a Lord and his 5 Lychguard retinue.

Plus, Tau/Eldar armies are basically impossible to beat. Between the Tau's range and the Eldar's trickery and psykers, good fucking luck, mate.

I don't know, as Dark Eldar, my games seem to be determined on if I get to choose who goes first. Then again, I'm Dark Eldar, that's my army in a nutshell. Hit Hard, Hit Fast, Die When Someone looks at me funny.

But yeah, Close Combat is just useless now. It's very rare when you will use a assault unit nowdays. Unless you're me and like trolling everyone with 4+ invul saves or I6 AP2 weaponry.

But Blood Angels in general lost a lot for assault. Assault Marines are no longer troops and the loss of Decent of Angels really hurt them. Pretty much Dreadnaughts and Paal Predators are the Blood Angels claim to fame now.

It sounds to me like you heretics are not putting enough faith in the God-Emperor.

Only tactical squads and scouts as troops?

While, yes, the BA were supposed to follow the codex (mostly) back in the day...I liked having jump pack infantry as troops, could have a whole jump pack army.

Boo.

xaszatm:

Ironman126:

Vivi22:
snip

snip

I don't know, as Dark Eldar, my games seem to be determined on if I get to choose who goes first. Then again, I'm Dark Eldar, that's my army in a nutshell. Hit Hard, Hit Fast, Die When Someone looks at me funny.

But yeah, Close Combat is just useless now. It's very rare when you will use a assault unit nowdays. Unless you're me and like trolling everyone with 4+ invul saves or I6 AP2 weaponry.

But Blood Angels in general lost a lot for assault. Assault Marines are no longer troops and the loss of Decent of Angels really hurt them. Pretty much Dreadnaughts and Paal Predators are the Blood Angels claim to fame now.

I can't imagine all those open-top vehicles help. Sounds like Imperial Guard, too. A good friend of mine plays IG and we have play A LOT of 40k, it seems like the winner is determined by who goes first. If my marines are first, it's GG. If he's first, I watch as no less than 4 large blasts wipe out my marines.

Kind of a shame really, the Blood Angels were always so cool. Furioso Dreadnoughts and Baal Predators can only get you so far, especially if you're fighting Eldar with their lances or Tau with their... Everything.

Sometimes I wonder if GW even bothers to play test the shit they come up with.

Ironman126:

xaszatm:

Ironman126:
snip

I don't know, as Dark Eldar, my games seem to be determined on if I get to choose who goes first. Then again, I'm Dark Eldar, that's my army in a nutshell. Hit Hard, Hit Fast, Die When Someone looks at me funny.

But yeah, Close Combat is just useless now. It's very rare when you will use a assault unit nowdays. Unless you're me and like trolling everyone with 4+ invul saves or I6 AP2 weaponry.

But Blood Angels in general lost a lot for assault. Assault Marines are no longer troops and the loss of Decent of Angels really hurt them. Pretty much Dreadnaughts and Paal Predators are the Blood Angels claim to fame now.

I can't imagine all those open-top vehicles help. Sounds like Imperial Guard, too. A good friend of mine plays IG and we have play A LOT of 40k, it seems like the winner is determined by who goes first. If my marines are first, it's GG. If he's first, I watch as no less than 4 large blasts wipe out my marines.

Kind of a shame really, the Blood Angels were always so cool. Furioso Dreadnoughts and Baal Predators can only get you so far, especially if you're fighting Eldar with their lances or Tau with their... Everything.

Sometimes I wonder if GW even bothers to play test the shit they come up with.

Yikes, sounds like I got out at a good time then (early-mid 5th). Are they still doing horrible things to the fluff or is it half-way decent now? (fuck the 'tomb-kings in space' backstory that new 'necrons' got).

Ironman126:
Sometimes I wonder if GW even bothers to play test the shit they come up with.

Ward did, it's how the Grey Knights ended up being untouchable.

Now I think they just don't playtest so they have an excuse to roll out new rules, and books, every couple of years.

After reading all the other posts, it makes me wonder where Games Workshop gets off chafing the prices they charge for a broken game?

I use to play before they came out with the Necron and Tau and Dark Eldar. I vaguely remember the Squats. But now everything cost so much before you even field an army. Ugh.

Did I read that correctly? Thirty bucks for ONE 28mm figure?

MinionJoe:
Did I read that correctly? Thirty bucks for ONE 28mm figure?

Sadly yes. Seeing as you can get 10 Imperial Guard for the same price I can only conclude that this figure is made from highly compacted cocaine, rather than the normal plastic or resin.

From the complaints from some of the HILARIOUSLY entitled Blood Angel players, this is a much more reasonable codex that doesn't completely dominate most armies by stomping them flat in turn two with a horde of FNP jumppacking marines and deepstriking murder-dreads. Frankly, it actually sounds almost balanced against marines, guard and the second tier xeno stuff (Necrons and Tyranids I suppose with all their new beasties and the drop-pod . .. thing). I tend to agree that the Tau-dar are still freakin' horrible to go up against, but if you ignore the panzies and the blue anime cows, the rest of the pack starts to look more balanced. Though Orks and Dark Eldar still get to suck it.

Has this new codex had the Matt Ward silliness scrubbed from it, or are the deep striking Land Raiders etc still present?

stringtheory:

Ironman126:

xaszatm:
snip

snip

Yikes, sounds like I got out at a good time then (early-mid 5th). Are they still doing horrible things to the fluff or is it half-way decent now? (fuck the 'tomb-kings in space' backstory that new 'necrons' got).

Decent lore? Hahahaha! No. The lore is still fucking horrendous. Matt Ward left GW, finally, after about 40,000 death threats, so maybe it'll improve in time, but right now, Necrons are space Pharaohs. At least they aren't battle brothers with the Blood Angels anymore. The Grey Knights sit atop a very tall pedestal, but Matt has stopped sucking them off. Oh! And Eldar and Dark Eldar are all friends again, but they won't let each other come over to their houses. Actually, that last bit is the only newish bit of lore that isn't pants-on-head retarded.

In other news, the Sisters of Battle ruined all the Imperial friendship options (there's an actual name, like Ally Matrix or something) and now everyone hates the Imperium with a passion again, except the Eldar, who are "Allies of Convenience;" which basically means if you want to recreate the events of Dawn of War: Winter Assault, you can.

And the Nids have "Norn Queens," but that might have been around before 6th Ed. I don't know anymore. All I know is that my Eldar army is too small, but Aspect Warriors are too damn expensive.

...quietly submitting from the sidelines that the whole IP is irretrievably damaged from a rules perspective and should be torpedoed. Celebrate what it was, but start afresh with something new.

008Zulu:

Ironman126:
Sometimes I wonder if GW even bothers to play test the shit they come up with.

Ward did, it's how the Grey Knights ended up being untouchable.

Now I think they just don't playtest so they have an excuse to roll out new rules, and books, every couple of years.

I'd almost forgotten about the Grey Knights... I think I tried to block the memory out. I played a game against them once. Once. The only redeeming quality was that the models were illicit, 3D-printed models my friend designed with CAD software. My marines didn't stand a chance. Except the Chaplain. That 4+ invul save can be hilarious.

Ironman126:

Vivi22:

Ironman126:
snip

Based on what you're saying I'm glad to hear close combat still seems pretty broken. Makes me all the more glad that I ditched the game completely in 6th edition. Not that GW has ever been good at game balance, but jesus christ they fucked up with the new close combat rules.

It is beyond broken. Th Orks and Tyranids are almost completely unplayable. The Orks actually are unplayable, but that's the fault of their latest codex more than anything. Between 7th edition's "Flying/Jump monstrous creatures can't do shit" rule and the "smash attacks now only hit once, not half the number of normal attacks" change, close combat is pretty much dead. If you are lucky enough to get into melee with an enemy, you get to roll hundreds of dice that do effectively nothing. Only specialized CQB units can do anything of value and even then it's dodgy. I was playing a game against Necrons and my 5-man Space Marine tactical squad and Captain beat a Lord and his 5 Lychguard retinue.

Plus, Tau/Eldar armies are basically impossible to beat. Between the Tau's range and the Eldar's trickery and psykers, good fucking luck, mate.

Yeah, my main army when I played were Tyranids. Then 6th came and while flying Monstrous Creatures actually being pretty good in that was cool, assault became useless and classic models like Genestealers went from a genuine threat to utterly useless aside from the Ymgarl ones. And then they released a new Codex after I quit that got rid of pretty much every character unit/model including those so all Genestealers were useless. And now you're saying flying Monstrous Creatures can't do shit? Definitely glad I sold my stuff then. Even if I do miss the days before the Tau update when I could charge a single Dark Eldar Wych or a Genestealer into a unit of Fire Warriors and be pretty much guaranteed to send them running off the table. It was always quite amusing.

Ironman126:

xaszatm:

Ironman126:
snip

I don't know, as Dark Eldar, my games seem to be determined on if I get to choose who goes first. Then again, I'm Dark Eldar, that's my army in a nutshell. Hit Hard, Hit Fast, Die When Someone looks at me funny.

But yeah, Close Combat is just useless now. It's very rare when you will use a assault unit nowdays. Unless you're me and like trolling everyone with 4+ invul saves or I6 AP2 weaponry.

But Blood Angels in general lost a lot for assault. Assault Marines are no longer troops and the loss of Decent of Angels really hurt them. Pretty much Dreadnaughts and Paal Predators are the Blood Angels claim to fame now.

I can't imagine all those open-top vehicles help. Sounds like Imperial Guard, too. A good friend of mine plays IG and we have play A LOT of 40k, it seems like the winner is determined by who goes first. If my marines are first, it's GG. If he's first, I watch as no less than 4 large blasts wipe out my marines.

Kind of a shame really, the Blood Angels were always so cool. Furioso Dreadnoughts and Baal Predators can only get you so far, especially if you're fighting Eldar with their lances or Tau with their... Everything.

Sometimes I wonder if GW even bothers to play test the shit they come up with.

Oh, my vehicles die to bolter fire but surprisingly, the Dark Eldar has a lot more survive capability on the first turn. Our new detachment gives us 6 Fast Attack slots and a +2 to Cover Saves on the first turn. Combine that with the +1 Night Shields give you and those vehicles stay through most things. After the first turn I'm already where my Dark Eldar want to be so I don't care if they blow up. You see, 7th edition turned every army into my playstyle Hit hard and fast otherwise kiss your units goodbye. The problem is that it shouldn't be the tactic for every army. Plus the sporadic nerfing and buffing where it makes no sense doesn't help.

Ironman126:

stringtheory:

Ironman126:
snip

Yikes, sounds like I got out at a good time then (early-mid 5th). Are they still doing horrible things to the fluff or is it half-way decent now? (fuck the 'tomb-kings in space' backstory that new 'necrons' got).

Decent lore? Hahahaha! No. The lore is still fucking horrendous. Matt Ward left GW, finally, after about 40,000 death threats, so maybe it'll improve in time, but right now, Necrons are space Pharaohs. At least they aren't battle brothers with the Blood Angels anymore. The Grey Knights sit atop a very tall pedestal, but Matt has stopped sucking them off. Oh! And Eldar and Dark Eldar are all friends again, but they won't let each other come over to their houses. Actually, that last bit is the only newish bit of lore that isn't pants-on-head retarded.

In other news, the Sisters of Battle ruined all the Imperial friendship options (there's an actual name, like Ally Matrix or something) and now everyone hates the Imperium with a passion again, except the Eldar, who are "Allies of Convenience;" which basically means if you want to recreate the events of Dawn of War: Winter Assault, you can.

And the Nids have "Norn Queens," but that might have been around before 6th Ed. I don't know anymore. All I know is that my Eldar army is too small, but Aspect Warriors are too damn expensive.

Meh, the lore isn't horrible, though I tend to read the smaller stuff and avoid the "big" events in the lore. Still say Ciaphas Cain is the best part about the lore, though. Still, I have some issues on what you think the lore is.

Grey Knights have always been the best of the best. I'm still upset they tired to codex the army, but the new codex did enlarge the how many soldiers are under each Grand Master. Books outside the codex also did a lot to redeem Grand Master Mary Sue...I mean Draigo in my eyes as well. Then again, him punching Azreal in the face for thinking that no one knew about the Fallen is always a plus in my book.

The Matt Ward codex did mention that the old Necrons still existed, though. Also, I think you're mistaking the Ally chart for actual friendships. It's a familiarity in tactics over actual standing. The Eldar and Dark Eldar would be more familiar with each others tactics than the Tau despite both having (or had in the Dark Eldars case) better relationships with the Tau than each other. Like, no where in the Dark Eldar Codex nor the Eldar Codex do they ever treat each other like "Battle Brothers" They have innate familiarity over each other's tactics so can work together if forced to but they aren't friends. Same with every Imperial Army, unless you think Space Wolves and Inquisitors would be friends. And how did Sisters of Battle ruin Imperial Friendships? I do think the new Ally chart is much better lore wise, though if I see what more unit of Bloodletters on a Chaos Storm Eagle I'm going to shove said Storm Eagle down that guy's throat.

Tyranid Norm Queens were arround since Rogue Trader. It's just that, since Norn Queens only exist on the Bioships (this is why feeder tubes and bio-pools exist), they only ever really showed up in Battlefleet Gothic.

The last Codex was insane. I refused to use Mephiston, deep-striking Land Raiders and flying Dreadnoughts, because I have some self-respect.

But on the other hand, by giving us Assault Squads as troops and a lethal Death Company, it also made the BA's unique.

This new Codex basically neuters the Blood Angels and makes them, well... red Ultramarines. Scratch that, red Salamanders, considering we can take an insane amount of flame weapons.

I've been playing BA's since 1994, and this codex is quite a return to what Blood Angels players are used to: crap lists.

xaszatm:
Meh, the lore isn't horrible, though I tend to read the smaller stuff and avoid the "big" events in the lore. Still say Ciaphas Cain is the best part about the lore, though. Still, I have some issues on what you think the lore is.

Grey Knights have always been the best of the best. I'm still upset they tired to codex the army, but the new codex did enlarge the how many soldiers are under each Grand Master. Books outside the codex also did a lot to redeem Grand Master Mary Sue...I mean Draigo in my eyes as well. Then again, him punching Azreal in the face for thinking that no one knew about the Fallen is always a plus in my book.

The Matt Ward codex did mention that the old Necrons still existed, though. Also, I think you're mistaking the Ally chart for actual friendships. It's a familiarity in tactics over actual standing. The Eldar and Dark Eldar would be more familiar with each others tactics than the Tau despite both having (or had in the Dark Eldars case) better relationships with the Tau than each other. Like, no where in the Dark Eldar Codex nor the Eldar Codex do they ever treat each other like "Battle Brothers" They have innate familiarity over each other's tactics so can work together if forced to but they aren't friends. Same with every Imperial Army, unless you think Space Wolves and Inquisitors would be friends. And how did Sisters of Battle ruin Imperial Friendships? I do think the new Ally chart is much better lore wise, though if I see what more unit of Bloodletters on a Chaos Storm Eagle I'm going to shove said Storm Eagle down that guy's throat.

Tyranid Norm Queens were arround since Rogue Trader. It's just that, since Norn Queens only exist on the Bioships (this is why feeder tubes and bio-pools exist), they only ever really showed up in Battlefleet Gothic.

Grey Knights being the best of the best is fine, in theory, but when you apply lore-based thinking to a game, you get a broken army and that's no fun for people to play against. It's more a question of balance and fun than whether the fluff says it's OK.

When I say "friendship" I don't mean actual friendship. I was referring to the ally chart. My primary grievance with the latest Ally Matrix is how they lumped all the Imperials together. Imperial Guard and, to a lesser extent, Space Marines have a long and colorful history of siding with the least awful xeno if it means putting the boot in on Chaos or a more horrible xeno. Lumping the Sisters and Inquisition with the IG and Marines effectively killed all that. Where my Marines used to be able to ally with Tau, Eldar, and Necrons, I can only ally with Eldar now, at least without penalties. But that's a minor grievance.

As for your Dark Eldar, I'd forgotten about the cover save bonuses. I admit, I've never actually seen Dark Eldar in person, mostly cuz all my friends are like "Eww, they're soooo weird." All I know is they are cooler than the goddamn Marines and they have so many open-topped vehicles. *Sigh* I regret buying the Dark Vengeance set every time I see my Farseer and her two lonely Dire Avenger squads next to my boring, boring Marines.

Vivi22:
Yeah, my main army when I played were Tyranids. Then 6th came and while flying Monstrous Creatures actually being pretty good in that was cool, assault became useless and classic models like Genestealers went from a genuine threat to utterly useless aside from the Ymgarl ones. And then they released a new Codex after I quit that got rid of pretty much every character unit/model including those so all Genestealers were useless. And now you're saying flying Monstrous Creatures can't do shit? Definitely glad I sold my stuff then. Even if I do miss the days before the Tau update when I could charge a single Dark Eldar Wych or a Genestealer into a unit of Fire Warriors and be pretty much guaranteed to send them running off the table. It was always quite amusing.

Oh, Tau still die in droves to assault units. Actually, they die in droves to anything that gets into melee with them. The problem is, as the meme goes, you will never get there. Tau get what I refer to as the "Fuck you, I'm Tau" rule. Any unit with that rule can fire overwatch against any charging enemy that's in weapon range. So that line of three Fire Warrior squads? All three get to shoot if you charge just one unit. Plus, they have a commander (Farsight, I think, but don't quote me on that) that lets them Go To Ground then get up and fire at full ballistic skill the next turn.

Also, Flying Monstrous Creatures actually got buffed. Not much, but they are a bit better. Vector Strikes only hit once now, but they resolve at AP2. Flying-Jump Monstrous Creatures, like Flying Hive Tyrants or Daemon Princes, however, are basically useless. They are harder to ground, but do significantly less damage in close combat, which, unless you're playing against IG or Tau, pretty much screws you. And if you're playing against IG, you're still screwed because one tank unit can consist of up to four tanks. Bam! Four Hydra AAA tanks, skyfire, twin-linked, bye-bye flyers. Regular Monstrous creatures are pretty terrible too.

Ironman126:

Oh, Tau still die in droves to assault units. Actually, they die in droves to anything that gets into melee with them. The problem is, as the meme goes, you will never get there. Tau get what I refer to as the "Fuck you, I'm Tau" rule. Any unit with that rule can fire overwatch against any charging enemy that's in weapon range. So that line of three Fire Warrior squads? All three get to shoot if you charge just one unit. Plus, they have a commander (Farsight, I think, but don't quote me on that) that lets them Go To Ground then get up and fire at full ballistic skill the next turn.

Also, Flying Monstrous Creatures actually got buffed. Not much, but they are a bit better. Vector Strikes only hit once now, but they resolve at AP2. Flying-Jump Monstrous Creatures, like Flying Hive Tyrants or Daemon Princes, however, are basically useless. They are harder to ground, but do significantly less damage in close combat, which, unless you're playing against IG or Tau, pretty much screws you. And if you're playing against IG, you're still screwed because one tank unit can consist of up to four tanks. Bam! Four Hydra AAA tanks, skyfire, twin-linked, bye-bye flyers. Regular Monstrous creatures are pretty terrible too.

The thing about that rule though is that you still can only overwatch once a turn. I have seen orks, tyranids, and other assault heavy armies out assault that friendly overwatch simply because they had THAT many bodies to throw at them. Granted, if you only have one dedicated assault unit, then that rule screws you over. Also, none of the Commanders (Generic Unit, Farsight, Shadowsun, O'rylai, and Longknife) have that ability. What you're thinking of is the Tau Warlord Trait "Exemplar of the Selfless Cause" which is automatic on the Tau Pope Aun'Va. Plus, that rule can only be activated once the entire game. It's just that, when combined with the Popestick's other army-wide buffing abilities to the Fire Warriors and Pathfinders, it can really bring on pain. It's not unbeatable though.

Also, Daemon Princes, worthless? Who the hell have you been playing against? Daemon Princes are universally reviled at my store as being such a pain in the ass to remove. Either they end up killing everything on sight (especially with that damn MURDER SWORD) or they end up distracting the army from the real threat. Additionally, Hydras can only be taken to a max of three, not four.

xaszatm:

Ironman126:

snip

The thing about that rule though is that you still can only overwatch once a turn. I have seen orks, tyranids, and other assault heavy armies out assault that friendly overwatch simply because they had THAT many bodies to throw at them. Granted, if you only have one dedicated assault unit, then that rule screws you over. Also, none of the Commanders (Generic Unit, Farsight, Shadowsun, O'rylai, and Longknife) have that ability. What you're thinking of is the Tau Warlord Trait "Exemplar of the Selfless Cause" which is automatic on the Tau Pope Aun'Va. Plus, that rule can only be activated once the entire game. It's just that, when combined with the Popestick's other army-wide buffing abilities to the Fire Warriors and Pathfinders, it can really bring on pain. It's not unbeatable though.

Also, Daemon Princes, worthless? Who the hell have you been playing against? Daemon Princes are universally reviled at my store as being such a pain in the ass to remove. Either they end up killing everything on sight (especially with that damn MURDER SWORD) or they end up distracting the army from the real threat. Additionally, Hydras can only be taken to a max of three, not four.

I'll grant that the friendly overwatch isn't unbeatable. It's when you combine it with a turn (or two) of shooting that things get hairy for the other guy.

A Spacepope Warlord Trait? I don't play Tau, so you'll have to forgive some of my ignorance. Still, it's pretty hardcore, even if it is only once per game. It beats the hell out of the Ultramarines "chapter tactics" for once per game actions.

As a whole, the Tau are pretty broken in my book. That said, I don't think there is a single rule that makes them that way. It's when you combine the 30" basic gun range, the friendly overwatch, and the Crisis Battlesuits that I start to lose it a bit.

Three Hyrdas to a squadron. Good to know. I've yet to see an IG player spend the points for more than two, so I kind of assumed they worked like the Leman Russ squadrons from hell.

But, you're right, the Daemon Prince was an awful example. Thinking back on it, I distinctly remember the carnage that the Black Mace can dish out. But, he's more the exception than the rule. Flyrants, the only other Flying Jump Monstrous Creature I can think of, are just too hit and miss to be useful, in my opinion.

 

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