Fertility Doc Promises Cloned Babies Within Two Years

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Fertility Doc Promises Cloned Babies Within Two Years

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A controversial fertility doctor has announced that he will be able to clone human infants within the next two years, offering hope for scatterbrained parents prone to misplacing their newborns.

Over the last few years, Dr. Panayiotis Zavos has been conducting experiments into human cloning in a secret lab believed to be located in a Middle Eastern country. So far Dr. Zavos claims to have cloned 14 human embryos, 11 of which have been transferred into the wombs of female patients, reports Sky Online.

"We are not interested in cloning the Michael Jordans and the Michael Jacksons of this world," the doctor stated, adding "The rich and the famous don't participate in this ... My ambition is to help people."

The doctor's promise -- that of cloning an actual, living human baby within two years -- is the result of his having supposedly witnessed "vigorous growth in 30 cell embryos" prior to their being implanted in a living womb.

Assuming Dr. Zavos' claims are legit, his research still faces a number of legal hurdles. Not only is cloning humans illegal in most first world countries, the religious factions ruling the vast majority of second and third world countries have expressed objections based on their respective holy texts.

Even forgetting that however, Zavos' research raises an endless number of ethical and moral questions, not the least of which is whether a human clone is actually a human.

Do clones have souls? Do clones deserve the same rights offered to humans created through more traditional genital-based methods?

And, most importantly, if you found out you had a clone, would you make out with yourself?

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Gotta be this song (c) Isaac Asimov

Oh, give me a clone
Of my own flesh and bone
With its Y-chromosome changed to X
And when it is grown
Then my own little clone
Will be of the opposite sex.

Clone, clone of my own,
With your Y-Chromosome changed to X
And when I'm alone
With my own little clone
We will both think of nothing but sex.

I thank yew.

i would so make out with myself, i'm just THAT sexy

Earnest Cavalli:

Even forgetting that however, Zavos' research raises an endless number of ethical and moral questions, not the least of which is whether a human clone is actually a human.

Do clones have souls? Do clones deserve the same rights offered to humans created through more traditional genital-based methods?

If souls exist, Yes they do. And yes, they have rights too - just because they were created unethnically doesn't mean they should be treated as less than other embryos.

Earnest Cavalli:

And, most importantly, if you found out you had a clone, would you make out with yourself?

No, no I wouldn't.

Anywho, the biggest ethnical problem to all this is "ITS NOT SAFE YOU QUACK!" Remember Dolly, the cloned sheep? Well, the clone had a very unhappy live of chronic disease and defects and died very early on. Why? Because the process of cloning is very new and very sensitive, and hence big errors are easy to make. This 'doctor' should be strung up for inflicting who knows how much misery on his victims.

Isn't a clone basically the same thing as a twin, only with the whole man-made thing?

Also, eww.

Doug:

Earnest Cavalli:

Even forgetting that however, Zavos' research raises an endless number of ethical and moral questions, not the least of which is whether a human clone is actually a human.

Do clones have souls? Do clones deserve the same rights offered to humans created through more traditional genital-based methods?

If souls exist, Yes they do. And yes, they have rights too - just because they were created unethnically doesn't mean they should be treated as less than other embryos.

Earnest Cavalli:

And, most importantly, if you found out you had a clone, would you make out with yourself?

No, no I wouldn't.

Anywho, the biggest ethnical problem to all this is "ITS NOT SAFE YOU QUACK!" Remember Dolly, the cloned sheep? Well, the clone had a very unhappy live of chronic disease and defects and died very early on. Why? Because the process of cloning is very new and very sensitive, and hence big errors are easy to make. This 'doctor' should be strung up for inflicting who knows how much misery on his victims.

every great advancement in science has had its risks

and its only a puny human, who cares.

Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

Soon the worlds current armies will be replaced by mass produced clone ones. I can't wait!
Oh and whether they have souls is none of my concern, and I would clone armies so I don't care about the rights part.

The_root_of_all_evil:
Gotta be this song (c) Isaac Asimov

Oh, give me a clone
Of my own flesh and bone
With its Y-chromosome changed to X
And when it is grown
Then my own little clone
Will be of the opposite sex.

Clone, clone of my own,
With your Y-Chromosome changed to X
And when I'm alone
With my own little clone
We will both think of nothing but sex.

I thank yew.

This reminds me of "All You Zombies", by Robert Heinlein.
In short, it's about a time traveler who, through the paradoxes of time and space, becomes his own father and mother.

Why the hell would you want to clone Michael Jackson? Actually i would like to see what his career would be like if he didn't go insane.

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

Just cloning a smart person isn't a guarantee that you're going to end up with a genius. I mean...I know we'd all like to think a clone of Einstein or Gandhi is going to be just like them, but, more realistically how they are raised is going to be a large factor. Not least of all, imagine how they will feel with that kind of expectation put upon them from birth? Hell, I could tomorrow find out I'm Jesus Christ re-incarnate, doesn't mean I'm going to try and continue his work, nor feel pressured to do so.

I see nothing wrong with cloning... but cloning people? Really? As if there weren't enough of them already?

Apart from harvesting organs (which doesn't seem ethical) and for the hell of it, what is the point of cloning someone when the world is already overpopulated?

Nimbus:
Isn't a clone basically the same thing as a twin, only with the whole man-made thing?

Also, eww.

Actually, I think technically, twins are clones.
Or something along those lines...

If there is no cloning of any Michaels whatsoever, then I just simply don't want it.

I dont think clones would be that brilliant, unnecessary. Maybe cloning an organ for an implant but not a whole person, there's simply no need to do it.

But why would you make out with yourself? why did you even think to ask that?!?

Glerken:

Nimbus:
Isn't a clone basically the same thing as a twin, only with the whole man-made thing?

Also, eww.

Actually, I think technically, twins are clones.
Or something along those lines...

That's either pedantic or insightful.

1) several groups/people have claimed to have cloned Humans before, and all have been frauds
2) to everyone in this thread that has or will claim that Human Beings have a soul; prove it. Don't just stubbornly say it's because "god" says so, or you "just know", PROVE TO US Humans have a "soul", and if you cannot, STOP USING "SOULS" AS ARGUMENT POINTS.
3) we shouldn't be arguing whether or not clones have rights, of course they do, they're humans, saying they don't reminds me of a certain 20th century dictator who said the Jews don't have rights...

GothmogII:

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

Just cloning a smart person isn't a guarantee that you're going to end up with a genius. I mean...I know we'd all like to think a clone of Einstein or Gandhi is going to be just like them, but, more realistically how they are raised is going to be a large factor. Not least of all, imagine how they will feel with that kind of expectation put upon them from birth? Hell, I could tomorrow find out I'm Jesus Christ re-incarnate, doesn't mean I'm going to try and continue his work, nor feel pressured to do so.

That is true, but I figure if you clone highly intelligent people, you, at the very least, have all of the component parts required for them to do something good for the world.

If you clone an athlete or whatever, and they're raised with a love for sports or whatever, well...

Though, there's always the chance the clone will rebel for no reason other than the fact that it's a cliche to do so.

olicon:
Apart from harvesting organs (which doesn't seem ethical) and for the hell of it, what is the point of cloning someone when the world is already overpopulated?

Fuck ethics. If I'm dying of an acute case of "bullet in lung" syndrome, I would want organs harvested to keep me alive.

Hell, that's probably the best use for them.

olicon:
Apart from harvesting organs (which doesn't seem ethical) and for the hell of it, what is the point of cloning someone when the world is already overpopulated?

Actually, I think there is the possibility of cloning and growing just the organs themselves rather than resorting to cloning whole persons...though, the most I saw of that was the human ear they grew on the back of a rat...so, not so useful so far unless you've lost an ear.

I refer you all to the film The Sixth Day, starring Arnold Schwarzenegger in a later role (hear me out, this isn't like his turn as Mr Freeze, he was actually good in this role!)

Basically, he plays a pilot working for an extreme sports company in the near future. Technology is mostly the same as now but cloning has reached new levels of sophistication to the point that embryos and cloned humans can be genetically sped up, as it were, to reach adulthood in just a few days, before a trigger stops the rapid growth and normal growth continues. Human cloning is strictly illegal, but animal cloning is now commercial to the point that companies offer clones to replace dead animals, something Arnie's character does early on when his daughter's dog dies. Despite this, Arnie is extremely skeptical of cloning, and his fears are founded when he returns home one day to find an illegal clone of him has taken over his lif, and the clone thinks he is the real deal. With his family unknowing of the clone, and assassins after him, Arnie tries to find out what's going on and basically bust open this conspiracy. The film has some humour in it when the assassins are killed off in various odd ways, yet return as they are all pre-made clones of different actual assassins (also dead).

The plot sounds silly, but it was shown to us in a Religous Studies class a few years ago, and raises some very interesting questions about cloning and the ideas of whether or not a cloned human would have a soul or spirit, or any moral rights. I advise you all see that film, it's worth a look and is actually very interesting. Incidentally, it was named after the Sixth Day of the Bible, when God created mankind after creating the universe, for anyone interested.

Nimbus:

Glerken:

Nimbus:
Isn't a clone basically the same thing as a twin, only with the whole man-made thing?

Also, eww.

Actually, I think technically, twins are clones.
Or something along those lines...

That's either pedantic or insightful.

Aye, it's when the zygote (egg) splits into two separate embryos. Though you can get non-identical twins too.

MaxTheReaper:

GothmogII:

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

Just cloning a smart person isn't a guarantee that you're going to end up with a genius. I mean...I know we'd all like to think a clone of Einstein or Gandhi is going to be just like them, but, more realistically how they are raised is going to be a large factor. Not least of all, imagine how they will feel with that kind of expectation put upon them from birth? Hell, I could tomorrow find out I'm Jesus Christ re-incarnate, doesn't mean I'm going to try and continue his work, nor feel pressured to do so.

That is true, but I figure if you clone highly intelligent people, you, at the very least, have all of the component parts required for them to do something good for the world.

If you clone an athlete or whatever, and they're raised with a love for sports or whatever, well...

Though, there's always the chance the clone will rebel for no reason other than the fact that it's a cliche to do so.

olicon:
Apart from harvesting organs (which doesn't seem ethical) and for the hell of it, what is the point of cloning someone when the world is already overpopulated?

Fuck ethics. If I'm dying of an acute case of "bullet in lung" syndrome, I would want organs harvested to keep me alive.

Hell, that's probably the best use for them.

Agreed. At the end of the day, harvested organs enables more possibilites. Whether it be searching for cures for diseases/cancers, or as Max mentioned, injuries or worse.
Ehtics to me in this situation aren't important. I'd rather our chances of curing disease and life threatening illnesses went much higher. Do you think patients with heart or liver failure on their death bed give a shit about the ethics of the harvested organ they may be given in the future? I highly doubt it, because if I was in that situation I'd bite the Doctor's hand off if I was offered it.

This is only happening so fast because Dr. Panayiotis Zavos and clone Dr. Panayiotis Zavos are using both their huge brains to speed the cloning progress.

It's interesting that the location of this project is underneath some middle east place. makes you wonder what experiments happen we don't know about.

Earnest Cavalli:

And, most importantly, if you found out you had a clone, would you make out with yourself?

My girl would adore that... Too much...

G1eet:

The_root_of_all_evil:
Gotta be this song (c) Isaac Asimov

Oh, give me a clone
Of my own flesh and bone
With its Y-chromosome changed to X
And when it is grown
Then my own little clone
Will be of the opposite sex.

Clone, clone of my own,
With your Y-Chromosome changed to X
And when I'm alone
With my own little clone
We will both think of nothing but sex.

I thank yew.

This reminds me of "All You Zombies", by Robert Heinlein.
In short, it's about a time traveler who, through the paradoxes of time and space, becomes his own father and mother.

I remember that one. Pretty funny. There was another I remember where I guy set out to use time travel to stop an evil tyrant, only to find out that the evil tyrant was a time travel'd version of himself.

I'm against cloning. People shouldn't be treated like commodities, valuables, test subjects or animals. Seems like "Brave Newer World" had a lot to say on the subject, not to mention Gattaca.

Trivun:
I refer you all to the film The Sixth Day, starring Arnold Schwarzenegger in a later role (hear me out, this isn't like his turn as Mr Freeze, he was actually good in this role!)

Basically, he plays a pilot working for an extreme sports company in the near future. Technology is mostly the same as now but cloning has reached new levels of sophistication to the point that embryos and cloned humans can be genetically sped up, as it were, to reach adulthood in just a few days, before a trigger stops the rapid growth and normal growth continues. Human cloning is strictly illegal, but animal cloning is now commercial to the point that companies offer clones to replace dead animals, something Arnie's character does early on when his daughter's dog dies. Despite this, Arnie is extremely skeptical of cloning, and his fears are founded when he returns home one day to find an illegal clone of him has taken over his lif, and the clone thinks he is the real deal. With his family unknowing of the clone, and assassins after him, Arnie tries to find out what's going on and basically bust open this conspiracy. The film has some humour in it when the assassins are killed off in various odd ways, yet return as they are all pre-made clones of different actual assassins (also dead).

The plot sounds silly, but it was shown to us in a Religous Studies class a few years ago, and raises some very interesting questions about cloning and the ideas of whether or not a cloned human would have a soul or spirit, or any moral rights. I advise you all see that film, it's worth a look and is actually very interesting. Incidentally, it was named after the Sixth Day of the Bible, when God created mankind after creating the universe, for anyone interested.

I did actually see that movie, and although it was unlikely scientifically, who knows?

Anyway, I don't see what all this woo-hah is about souls anyway. Unless you can prove they don't have souls and regular people do, you should act as if they do. Its just gene sequences for gods sake, its not stealing the essence of someone.

TerribleTerryTate:

MaxTheReaper:

GothmogII:

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

Just cloning a smart person isn't a guarantee that you're going to end up with a genius. I mean...I know we'd all like to think a clone of Einstein or Gandhi is going to be just like them, but, more realistically how they are raised is going to be a large factor. Not least of all, imagine how they will feel with that kind of expectation put upon them from birth? Hell, I could tomorrow find out I'm Jesus Christ re-incarnate, doesn't mean I'm going to try and continue his work, nor feel pressured to do so.

That is true, but I figure if you clone highly intelligent people, you, at the very least, have all of the component parts required for them to do something good for the world.

If you clone an athlete or whatever, and they're raised with a love for sports or whatever, well...

Though, there's always the chance the clone will rebel for no reason other than the fact that it's a cliche to do so.

olicon:
Apart from harvesting organs (which doesn't seem ethical) and for the hell of it, what is the point of cloning someone when the world is already overpopulated?

Fuck ethics. If I'm dying of an acute case of "bullet in lung" syndrome, I would want organs harvested to keep me alive.

Hell, that's probably the best use for them.

Agreed. At the end of the day, harvested organs enables more possibilites. Whether it be searching for cures for diseases/cancers, or as Max mentioned, injuries or worse.
Ehtics to me in this situation aren't important. I'd rather our chances of curing disease and life threatening illnesses went much higher. Do you think patients with heart or liver failure on their death bed give a shit about the ethics of the harvested organ they may be given in the future? I highly doubt it, because if I was in that situation I'd bite the Doctor's hand off if I was offered it.

I'm loving this, really. I really hope when you genuinely need an organ transplant you get it. From someone who gave up their own organs, free to go the many heartless bastards out there who really don't deserve it.

Oh deary, there I go ranting. Feeling generally sorry for the cloned people who may come into this world the same way we do, only to get mercilessly butchered because 'they aren't like us', considered little more than sub-human meat bags. Ahh, but where's the harm right? We can always make more eh?

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

But without souls, Nightmare has nothing to do...

And seconded. No more people are required.

scotth266:

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

But without souls, Nightmare has nothing to do...

And seconded. No more people are required.

Depends. If there's say, a great explosion in space exploration at some point in the future it could become something to look into a little deeper. Though, maybe I've just been playing too much EVE online o_O.

GothmogII:

Aye, it's when the zygote (egg) splits into two separate embryos. Though you can get non-identical twins too.

That is just basically two unconnected pregnancies happening at the same time. It, if I am right about this, just happens when two unfertilized eggs get fertilized at the same time. Could be caused by anything from fertillity treatments to atificial insemination gone wrong.

GothmogII:

I'm loving this, really. I really hope when you genuinely need an organ transplant you get it. From someone who gave up their own organs, free to go the many heartless bastards out there who really don't deserve it.

Oh deary, there I go ranting. Feeling generally sorry for the cloned people who may come into this world the same way we do, only to get mercilessly butchered because 'they aren't like us', considered little more than sub-human meat bags. Ahh, but where's the harm right? We can always make more eh?

To be fair, I would take organs from another human being as well.
It's not a matter of "They are lesser beings," it's a matter of "Even if they're the same as us, they're not as important to me as I am."

scotth266:

MaxTheReaper:
Clones do not have souls, no.
Or at least, I do not think so, but then again, I don't believe in souls.

The thing is this, though: We don't need more people.
We need less.
Unless you're going to be cloning scientists, in which case, go for it. We need more geniuses.

But without souls, Nightmare has nothing to do...

And seconded. No more people are required.

Nor do I, come to think of it..
Okay, we'll just hunt down those who "sin."

Doug:
Its just gene sequences for gods sake, its not stealing the essence of someone.

Well that's the crux of the argument: Until someone actually starts cloning people and proves otherwise incontrovertibly, many would argue that it just might be "stealing the essence of someone."

Then again, people still believe cameras snatch souls on taking your picture.

Me personally, I just wanna tongue kiss my clone in front of the Pope. Short of murdering the sun or punching Jesus in the nose, I don't know how I could instantly become any more controversial.

Earnest Cavalli:

Doug:
Its just gene sequences for gods sake, its not stealing the essence of someone.

Well that's the crux of the argument: Until someone actually starts cloning people and proves otherwise incontrovertibly, many would argue that it just might be "stealing the essence of someone."

Then again, people still believe cameras snatch souls on taking your picture.

Me personally, I just wanna tongue kiss my clone in front of the Pope. Short of murdering the sun or punching Jesus in the nose, I don't know how I could instantly become any more controversial.

Ok, have a lookie at your keyboard... I'll wait ;)

See the hair, dust and grease? Simply typing out these words leaves billions apon billions of pieces of your skin on the keyboard, each with a copy of your DNA. And yet you don't 'lose' anything, because its the pattern and the reading of it thats important, not the copying of it.

And seriously, why is everyone making out with their clones even when they aren't gay/lesban/bi/bicurious/etc?

I still don't see much point with cloning, especially since we're starting to become somewhat overpopulated.

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