R4 Cartridges Declared Illegal in the U.K.

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R4 Cartridges Declared Illegal in the U.K.

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The London High Court has ruled that the R4 cartridge for the Nintendo DS is illegal in the U.K.

The ruling against Playables Ltd. is another victory for Nintendo, which has moved aggressively against importers and sellers of the R4 cartridge. Despite the fact that the device enables the use of legal "homebrew" applications, the court sided with Nintendo because the cartridge must bypass the security measures built into the DS in order to work, which is against the law.

"In the UK alone, there have been over 100,000 game copying devices seized since 2009," Nintendo said in a statement. "Nintendo initiates these actions not only on its own behalf, but also on behalf of over 1,400 video game development companies that depend on legitimate sales of games for their survival."

If that last bit sounds familiar, it's because it's very close to a statement the company released following a similar victory against 11 retailers in the Netherlands who were convicted of selling R4 cartridges last week. Earlier in the year, the company won a lawsuit against an R4 seller in Australia and also claimed "20 successful prosecutions" of people selling circumvention devices in Germany.

But as MCV notes, Nintendo's string of victories against the R4 could run up against yesterday's decision by the U.S. government that removing restrictions on mobile devices in order to run unapproved software is not unlawful. That decision has been most commonly referenced in the context of "jailbreaking" iPhones but presumably could also be applied to mobile gaming devices like the DS.

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Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

ultimateownage:
Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

Uh huh.

Still, it doesn't really matter, they'll still make R4's and you'll still be able to buy them, just the same as something like Mephedrone being banned. It just moves underground.

I can see which position they're coming from, but like all prohibitions, I can't see this one working.

Oh no, I hope they don't find my ....friend's R4.... that definitely wasn't bought in Hong Kong

Well, if it makes Nintendo think they're going to make more money out of this, then good for them. Ignorance is bliss.

Furburt:

ultimateownage:
Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

Uh huh.

Still, it doesn't really matter, they'll still make R4's and you'll still be able to buy them, just the same as something like Mephedrone being banned. It just moves underground.

I can see which position they're coming from, but like all prohibitions, I can't see this one working.

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Arcane Azmadi:
So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

He's saying people still won't obey the law, not whether or not you're required to.

OT: I thought these were illegal here already, but fair enough.
Is it just R4s that are banned, what about Cyclo cards and what not?

Arcane Azmadi:

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Erm...No. Where'd you get that from?

What I'm saying is that on practical terms, outright banning said cartridges won't reduce their availability. They'll still be made illegally, and available as such. Same thing that happens when you ban pretty much anything, people find other ways to get it.

Arcane Azmadi:

Furburt:

ultimateownage:
Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

Uh huh.

Still, it doesn't really matter, they'll still make R4's and you'll still be able to buy them, just the same as something like Mephedrone being banned. It just moves underground.

I can see which position they're coming from, but like all prohibitions, I can't see this one working.

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Rather, you should break all unjust laws

I'm glad their banned, everyone I know uses them to be cheap bastards and i'm betting 99.9% of people are the same. Still, it's not like it's going to really change anything I don't think unless you actively add software to new DS games to fuck up R4 cards somehow.

Furburt:

ultimateownage:
Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

Uh huh.

Still, it doesn't really matter, they'll still make R4's and you'll still be able to buy them, just the same as something like Mephedrone being banned. It just moves underground.

I can see which position they're coming from, but like all prohibitions, I can't see this one working.

I agree, they'll always be available.

Still, it's really stupid that this is illegal. The reason R4's are so notoriously immune to the law is because having backups of games (roms) is legal if you own the game. I think it's stupid to make this cartridge illegal, why is that piece of plastic illegal? It's not physically dangerous, it has perfectly legal uses.

Oh well, guess I'll just pop in my Acekard 2i and forget about it (CHILL mods, I'm using it for perfectly legal uses...)

Furburt:

Arcane Azmadi:

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Erm...No. Where'd you get that from?

What I'm saying is that on practical terms, outright banning said cartridges won't reduce their availability. They'll still be made illegally, and available as such. Same thing that happens when you ban pretty much anything, people find other ways to get it.

It does serve a good practical purpose though, it supports the industry against the pirates and shows which side the Government stands on. It's important in the same way as the opposite ruling against Apple in the US earlier this week was, it may not affect what you can actually do but it affects what people will be able to do in the future by making it easier or harder to do from now on.

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

danpascooch:
I think it's stupid to make this cartridge illegal, why is that piece of plastic illegal? It's not physically dangerous, it has perfectly legal uses.

Guns have a perfectly legal use, they are still outlawed in England.
On the flip side, the people who pirate the games get them from the internet. They should make that illegal too.

Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

generic gamer:

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

- n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

eljawa:

Rather, you should break all unjust laws

Eh...can't say as that's a great idea.

Bear in mind laws are created to uphold social values, just because you think something's ok doesn't mean society does.

Case in point: Uninsured drivers do so to avoid paying huge insurance fees, people hit by uninsured drivers are shit out of luck. Cannabis use isn't necessarily bad in and of itself, but look at smuggling (I come from a country where it's not native and won't grow in the wild even if introduced, not for more than four months or so anyway) and there are definitely victims of cannabis smugglers!

Your definition of 'unjust' isn't necessarily the same as everyone else's.

night_chrono:
Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

This I bought my DS, my GF's DS and a load of games but I still use my Supercard DSTwo because I cannot be bothered to lug 25 cartridges around. Besides as said above R4s arent even the cutting edge any more. They have Snes emulators Homebrew games, cheats all kinds of stuff

R4 is old there are far more and other and better carts out there...so does this law apply to those carts or just r4 carts?

This just shows you that these companies will always be one step behind pirates. Some six years later, they're just now getting the R4 outlawed, when we all know that there have been a LOT of superior flash carts for some time now. iEdge, Acekard, CycloDS, whatever. Every time they ban one, ten more pop up in its place. The same applies for piracy websites.

I'm not saying they should stop trying to fight piracy, but everyone needs to realize that as long as there is demand for a certain product or service, there will always be plenty of sources willing to supply it.

Good, ban the R4 it sucks anyway, it is outdated and there are now much better cards on the market.

I suppose it was inevitable it was going to happen...but, uit will jsut send it underground now

ultimateownage:
Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

My main problem with it (apart from the fact that it was devised by Darth Mandelson) is that they'll get it wrong. It's been made up by people who likely have no clue that people are quite willing to sit outside someone's house in a car, connect to their wireless network and then download stuff through it without the owner knowing.

Not to mention that disabling someone's internet can cut off major ties in their social life and impact negatively on their work life.

*boots up DS emulator* Mmm? What's an R4?

Furburt:

Arcane Azmadi:

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Erm...No. Where'd you get that from?

What I'm saying is that on practical terms, outright banning said cartridges won't reduce their availability. They'll still be made illegally, and available as such. Same thing that happens when you ban pretty much anything, people find other ways to get it.

Oh wait, I get it now. You're saying that since laws are impotent and ineffective we shouldn't bother making them or attempting to enforce them.

You could be onto something here. Judging from the number of people robbed, raped or murdered every year worldwide, law does start to look like a failed experiment. If we can't even stop a man from dragging a woman into a dark alley, brutally anally raping her, slitting her throat and pocketing her purse, how can we expect to stop something as trivial as people using illegal piracy devices?

God, I just can't stop depressing myself every time I open my mouth.

night_chrono:
Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

generic gamer:

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

- n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

image

A handy guide.

Also, many people are bringing up a very good point: is the R4 the only banned flashcart?

generic gamer:

eljawa:

Rather, you should break all unjust laws

Eh...can't say as that's a great idea.

Bear in mind laws are created to uphold social values, just because you think something's ok doesn't mean society does.

Case in point: Uninsured drivers do so to avoid paying huge insurance fees, people hit by uninsured drivers are shit out of luck. Cannabis use isn't necessarily bad in and of itself, but look at smuggling (I come from a country where it's not native and won't grow in the wild even if introduced, not for more than four months or so anyway) and there are definitely victims of cannabis smugglers!

Your definition of 'unjust' isn't necessarily the same as everyone else's.

I'll be polite and just say you have no idea what you are talking about.

Since I'm an adult who actually pays for insurance I know about a little thing called "Uninsured Motorist Coverage". I pay a little extra every month and if someone without insurance is at fault in an accident my insurance company pays for my medical bills and repairs. In other words the existence of uninsured drivers only affects me in the amount I pay for my Uninsured Motorist rider.

Cannibis can be grown indoors anywhere you have electricity and climate control. I bet the the guys at Antarctic research stations have some really good shit, because what the hell else is there to do?

You talk about society this and society that but in reality society is nothing more than a thought construct, it doesn't exist any more than "intellectual property" exists. The "social values" you say laws uphold are really nothing more than conveniences for the few people with guns and power.

Take responsibility for your own opinions and stop trying to shift that responsibility to "society".

I don't give two squirts of piss what everyone else thinks is unjust. What really matters are my values and morals, not what some legislature decided is the "law" just to make themselves, their families, and their peer group richer.

night_chrono:
Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

generic gamer:

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

- n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

Fine, piracy is not in itself theft. It is however stealing the value of the product. By bootlegging software that is still available for sale you're taking away from the developers, the publishers, the distributors and, if you buy in bricks and mortar, the retailer.

So, once you've downloaded this item, you have then deprived these organizations, that employ real flesh and blood humans just like you and me, of their rightfully deserved money.

Now if we're talking about Abandonware than that's a different issue since no one stands to make money on something not commercially available.

ultimateownage:
Oh god, first this and then that law about removing your internet connection for piracy. I for one don't pirate, I hate piracy, but even I think they're getting a little too strict over it.

Well there was a law already there for this, it's just that they now decided this particular thing falls under that law.

rembrandtqeinstein:

I'll be polite and just say you have no idea what you are talking about.

Since I'm an adult who actually pays for insurance I know about a little thing called "Uninsured Motorist Coverage". I pay a little extra every month and if someone without insurance is at fault in an accident my insurance company pays for my medical bills and repairs. In other words the existence of uninsured drivers only affects me in the amount I pay for my Uninsured Motorist rider.

Cannibis can be grown indoors anywhere you have electricity and climate control. I bet the the guys at Antarctic research stations have some really good shit, because what the hell else is there to do?

You talk about society this and society that but in reality society is nothing more than a thought construct, it doesn't exist any more than "intellectual property" exists. The "social values" you say laws uphold are really nothing more than conveniences for the few people with guns and power.

Take responsibility for your own opinions and stop trying to shift that responsibility to "society".

I don't give two squirts of piss what everyone else thinks is unjust. What really matters are my values and morals, not what some legislature decided is the "law" just to make themselves, their families, and their peer group richer.

Good, politeness is the cornerstone of an engaging and enjoyable debate...you're actually still pretty rude but since you didn't swear we'll call that a win eh?

Congratulations adult, I too am an adult and I too pay for car insurance. I also know a lot of people who also drive, due to my adultiness you see. I also know none of us have cover against uninsured drivers hitting us because it's expensive for new drivers. I don't like the thought that I should have to pay out because someone else has decided that they don't need insurance.

I don't even know where you're going with the cannabis thing but how the hell do you think people grow cannabis in a non-native country without smuggling? How do they get the plants or seeds? Those need to be brought in illegally and the number of people who grow compared to the number who buy from dealers is tiny anyway, almost a statistical aberration.

When I talk about "society" I am talking about everyone who lives around you, the people with whom you share your living space. Laws are made to protect the opinion and morality of the majority, that's what a legal system is for, to ensure that people don't fuck each other over for personal gain. What you seem to be arguing against is "The Man". "The Man" is a fictional construct used in arguments when one party wants to justify an action that everyone else thinks is wrong. I am saying that you shouldn't necessarily be allowed to do what you want to, paedophiles want to rape kids, murderers want to kill people and burglars would like all of your stuff.

Your definition of what's right or wrong isn't a good basis for morality, you need to consider what everyone around you thinks too. Using just your opinion for deciding what's right or wrong is a flawed method as it doesn't work if you're insane, self justifying to avoid cognitive dissonance or just a cunt.

Arcane Azmadi:

Furburt:

Arcane Azmadi:

So what you're saying is... we are not required to obey the law if we don't feel like it?

Erm...No. Where'd you get that from?

What I'm saying is that on practical terms, outright banning said cartridges won't reduce their availability. They'll still be made illegally, and available as such. Same thing that happens when you ban pretty much anything, people find other ways to get it.

Oh wait, I get it now. You're saying that since laws are impotent and ineffective we shouldn't bother making them or attempting to enforce them.

You could be onto something here. Judging from the number of people robbed, raped or murdered every year worldwide, law does start to look like a failed experiment. If we can't even stop a man from dragging a woman into a dark alley, brutally anally raping her, slitting her throat and pocketing her purse, how can we expect to stop something as trivial as people using illegal piracy devices?

God, I just can't stop depressing myself every time I open my mouth.

I would be depressed as well if I talked about woman getting anally raped, seems like an unneccessarily graphic example

Moriarty70:

night_chrono:
Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

generic gamer:

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

- n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

Fine, piracy is not in itself theft. It is however stealing the value of the product. By bootlegging software that is still available for sale you're taking away from the developers, the publishers, the distributors and, if you buy in bricks and mortar, the retailer.

So, once you've downloaded this item, you have then deprived these organizations, that employ real flesh and blood humans just like you and me, of their rightfully deserved money.

Now if we're talking about Abandonware than that's a different issue since no one stands to make money on something not commercially available.

What if you downloaded a game you would never buy otherwise? That deprives no one of nothing

So then it was because it had a legal use it was legal regardless and today because it has a illegal use its illegal regardless....ya..... I smell lobby money and government corruption.....

IANAL, but...

The Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, as amended by the Copyright and Related Rights Regulations 2003, which implements the EU Copyright Directive in the UK:

§296 (1) This section applies where -
    (a) a technical device has been applied to a computer program; and
    (b) a person knowing or having reason to believe that it will be used to make infringing copies -
        (i) manufactures for sale or hire, imports, distributes, sells or lets for hire, offers or exposes for sale or hire, advertises for sale or hire or has in his possession for commercial purposes any means the sole intended purpose of which is to facilitate the unauthorised removal or circumvention of the technical device; or
        (ii) publishes information intended to enable or assist persons to remove or circumvent the technical device.

Possessing an R4 is not unlawful, provided you do not intend to use it for commercial purposes.

Personally importing an R4 as a private individual for personal use is not unlawful, provided you do not intend to use it for piracy.

Selling or gifting an R4 is not unlawful, provided it is to someone who you can reasonably trust not to use it for piracy, such as a trusted friend.

Stubee:

Moriarty70:

night_chrono:
Nintendo is to stupid to realize that no one has given a shit about the R4 in years. The original R4 team shut down over two years ago and every card on the market is a cheap knock off capitalizing on the name.

So go ahead and ban the shitty out dated carts with no features. I will keep my CycloDS.

generic gamer:

I hate draconian security and locked software but I hate piracy more. It's theft and the thief's usual response is to shrug and basically say "You shouldn't have made something I wanted then".

"theft (θɛft)

- n
1. criminal law the dishonest taking of property belonging to another person with the intention of depriving the owner permanently of its possession "

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/theft

Piracy is not theft, the original owner is not deprived of their product.

Fine, piracy is not in itself theft. It is however stealing the value of the product. By bootlegging software that is still available for sale you're taking away from the developers, the publishers, the distributors and, if you buy in bricks and mortar, the retailer.

So, once you've downloaded this item, you have then deprived these organizations, that employ real flesh and blood humans just like you and me, of their rightfully deserved money.

Now if we're talking about Abandonware than that's a different issue since no one stands to make money on something not commercially available.

What if you downloaded a game you would never buy otherwise? That deprives no one of nothing

That is the problem the pro IP/CP people can not figure out nor is the less rights and freedoms the public has the less money it has to spend on their frivolous crap the CP/IP shovel out....

Stubee:

What if you downloaded a game you would never buy otherwise? That deprives no one of nothing

Then you're forced to ask yourself a few questions.

Why were you never going to buy it?
If you're planing on playing it why wouldn't you buy it/rent it?
If you're getting anything out of it, even if that's just killing time, aren't the people behind the creation of it entitled to the money you refused to spend?
What makes you special that you get to enjoy something without paying for it unlike everyone else?

I'm not perfect, I've done it before when I was a broke high-schooler, but now that I make a living I make a choice between what to spend my excess cash on.

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