US Seeks Extradition For UK Student's Copyright Violation

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It's so easy for the US to do this. But when we try the same thing, it's a different story!

Tenmar:

However it is true as of late that congress has been passing due to lobbyists from AT&T

I'm surprised anyone from AT&T is even able to stay in contact with one another, especially between the company and the lobbyists, I didn't think there was a signal for AT&T there, much less the rest of the US.

But it seems like the US is stepping out of bounds, just because you can access the site from the US, doesn't mean we exactly have the right to prosecute him I believe. Hell, I could probably access plenty of Japanese sites from home (and have for some games), doesn't mean the US government should start harassing them for all of the crazy stuff they have online.

FogHornG36:
This is quite harsh, and its wrong that he is getting charged for having links to torrents.

But anyone that says that the US shouldn't waist its money protecting copy right has no understanding that THE US PRODUCES ALL, ALL! TV and Movies of value.

Thus they are trying to protect the income of a lot of its people, so they can continue to tax them.

edit: Home videos of you doesn't count. Seriously, you need to watch more than what free cable gets you, 24/7 news isn't special, and lifetime's movies are far from amazing.

Someone had better lock up everyone at Google for all of the illegal websites they link to as well. This happened before to a site call tv-links, it got shut down but obviously nothing came of suing the evil-doer responsible because it was back online soon after. It's still around now as a matter of fact.

If the US want to crack down on copyright infringement then go after the hosting websites for not being as strict in taking illegal content down.

Double post =(

Moderators, please strike down this abomination of duplication!

Anyone else think they wouldn't have even raised an eyebrow if he didn't get revenue?

Mackheath:
And the UK, being the arse-kissing little toady its become, will probably send the poor bastard off to a US prison to keep Bubba warm just in time for winter.

Nah, a half competent lawyer could tie an extradition hearing (or an injuction hearing against an extradition) up for years on this. Hell, get it up before the Law Lords and they'll tie it up themselves without prompting. A case involving jurisdictional sovereignty? They'll all want to have their incredibly lengthy say on something like that.

rees263:
I won't pretend to be an expert on the law, but I do have some questions about this, if anyone can answer them?

Obviously the US is trying to charge this guy with something, but is what he did illegal in the UK? What are the factors that could result in an extradition? And if it is illegal in the UK, wouldn't that mean he should be tried in the UK courts?

Okay, I'm not a lawyer but I do play one on the Internets.

Basically the UK Courts are not going to inclined towards granting extradition. There are going to be a lot of questions the US Govt (or the UK govt on the US govt's behalf) have to answer and they'll have to prove that not only did a crime occur within their jurisdiction but also, in regards to the crime in question, that their jurisdiction has primacy over UK jurisdiction.

First thing I'd do is apply for a court injunction against the govt taking executive action to do an end-run around the judicial process.

Worgen:
this is going to turn out to be one of those cases that makes or breaks more then a few weird kind of laws, assuming we get him

Indeed.

He did nothing illegal, or wrong. He just linked to them.

Plus, isn't archiving all of our cultural media and making it public the kind of shit we should be doing anyways?

Well for a start, what the hell America? Why should he have a trial in your country rather than the country he lives in and was caught in. This has nothing to do with America, or at least nothing more to do with America than any other country.

Secondly, I'm pretty sure linking to illegal sites isn't illegal, and if it is it shouldn't be. In fact, if his site linked to The Pirate Bay and other torrent sites, then all he was doing was linking with a site that has it's own links to illegal software. If that's illegal then where does it end?

Surely Google is just as guilty of this crime as the student is? Try searching "Pirate" in Google and look what the top result is.

Should we then punish the sites that link to TV Shack?

What about the sites that link to the sites that link to TV Shack?

This simply doesn't work, and the only reason these kind of stupid laws get allowed in the first place is because the companies who are hurt by this have all the money, and therefore all the power. Obtaining copies of things you don't own should be illegal, that's fair enough, but I think this is just ridiculous.

I'm confused. Why can't England handle this? Does England not have the legal authority to prosecute or something?

No way in hell will he get extradited, it just isn't going to happen.

fix-the-spade:
Interesting, but I can't see UK courts granting extradition for a case that could be brought in the UK as a civil charge. The owners of the copyright should be suing him, since copyright infringement is a civil matter in the UK (until you ignore a court order...). I hope to God I'm right.

The idea of Americaland gaining the legal right to enforce it's laws on British soil remotely is, frankly, terrifying.

/This

It has been said before, but this is just another effort by the American court/legal system to try and police the entierty of the internet as it spans the world.

I... but.. what?

OK look I've got nothing against the average American on the street, but by all that's holy do you guys have one fucked up govornment. Is linking to illegal torrents wrong? Sure. Is it illegal? Maybe, possibly (we all know it isn't in Sweeden, wink wink). Is it so illegal that you need to ship the poor guy halfway across the world? Fuck off.

He commited a crime, he'll get punished. Whether or not America punishes him is beside the point. In fact it's so beside the point that it's going to need plane tickets and a damn passport to see the bloody point!

America does not police the internet, I know that all of the main routing servers are currently on US soil but honestly, it's acts like this that enforce the stuck up, arrogant, blindly-patriotic American sterotype that I've spent most of this post attempting not to referance.

Okay, if we're going to do this we need to get focused. Going after some random kid that put some links to movies and TV shows is a complete waste of time; if we want to stop this pirating, we need to stop the pirates. The people uploading the stuff. Doing anything else is just a waste of time and effort.

That said, I think we need to really rethink the copyright laws we have in place right now. There are some ethical issues at play here that simply aren't accounted for in our archaic system; it hasn't changed a bit since the internet, the single greatest communication breakthrough in the history of our species. That's just not okay. Right now, there are some things that are simply asinine (we can record television onto a VHS tape, but distributing an episode over the internet is wrong?), and we need to take a step back and rebuild these laws from the ground up with modern technology in mind.

Why is my country wasting it's time and our money on this?

I mean, US, I'm trying to defend you. I really am. But shit like this makes that extremely tough.

He should be sued or punished in the uK. Our government needs to keep its nose, its laws, troops, and greedy hands in its own borders. I don't care that some shitty move studio didn't get the 3 bucks fro netflix they would have otherwise; our government has no right to enforce its laws across from its borders.

He should get off scot free. 1: He's not actually doing anything illegal. He's not hosting any of it, he's not transmitting it. He's doing nothing Google doesn't do when you search for torrents. 2: Not in America's jurisdiction, if anyone is to prosecute him it should be Britian.

FogHornG36:
This is quite harsh, and its wrong that he is getting charged for having links to torrents.

But anyone that says that the US shouldn't waist its money protecting copy right has no understanding that THE US PRODUCES ALL, ALL! TV and Movies of value.

Thus they are trying to protect the income of a lot of its people, so they can continue to tax them.

...Top Gear. Formula 1. WRC. WTCC. BTCC. DTM. Paris-Dakar. 24 Hours of Le Mans.

There's a few programs worth watching that aren't made here. The best we've got is a half-baked spinoff of TG that sucks, Mythbusters, Koni Challenge(Think BTCC but with Mustangs and M3s), and ALMS. Blah.

Oh, and House is okay, but that's because Hugh Laurie is British, therefore, he's not a talentless Joisey douchebag with good looks and a few connections.

Spartan448:
The United States has stepped out of its bounds for far too long. This is an international tiral, and he was found in England, so there's no reason for him to be tried in the States. The world at large needs to start taking a stand and saying that America can't always make itself the center of every single thing. World resistance to the United States will start when England refuses to extradite a criminal to another country without any legal basis.

I'm from America and I'm 100% behind this. I'm not a bully, I'm fucking tired of people from other countries thinking I am because the douchebag motherfuckers in the white house have their wallets stuffed with media corp money. This guy should get off scot free on that basis alone, nevermind that all he did was the same thing Google does when you search for torrents...nobody's bringing Google up on charges.

You know, I'm not really for piracy and all that jazz, but I really don't think he broke a copyright law here. He just had links, which as far as I know (which is, admittedly, not very far), isn't illegal. if it is then that seems a bit dodgy to me because it could be pretty easily exaggerated. Hopefully he'll be saved by one of the few good things about our current government, that they're not quite as cosy with the US as we have been.

Oh come on! Really? Really? Extradition because of something that doesn't even hurt anyone and usually is not even causing companies to lose money(because most people just wouldn't watch it if it weren't online)?

The US never extradited murders and terroists back to the UK from the IRA so they can bugger off for this

rees263:
I won't pretend to be an expert on the law, but I do have some questions about this, if anyone can answer them?

Obviously the US is trying to charge this guy with something, but is what he did illegal in the UK? What are the factors that could result in an extradition? And if it is illegal in the UK, wouldn't that mean he should be tried in the UK courts?

Seems like an odd Precedent :p.

Just start making things we don't like illegal and demanding folks be extradited here.

Outlaw Torn:
Someone had better lock up everyone at Google for all of the illegal websites they link to as well. This happened before to a site call tv-links, it got shut down but obviously nothing came of suing the evil-doer responsible because it was back online soon after. It's still around now as a matter of fact.

If the US want to crack down on copyright infringement then go after the hosting websites for not being as strict in taking illegal content down.

I lulz'd at this. But you make a good point :). I think >_>.

teebeeohh:
really? the next thing we know people are getting extradited to the US for speeding.

if the guy committed a crime in the UK prosecute him there but you don't extradite people for piracy.
Also give us European people a good(payed) online streaming service like you nice american people have and and we will pay for that stuff.

I would totally pay for that
not that i dont already pay for my movies ofc

A slightly more in-depth take on the case can be found here:

http://torrentfreak.com/tvshack-admin-fights-extradition-to-u-s-on-movie-piracy-charges-110615/

The reasoning behind the defense seems very sound, ill be surprised if the UK budges under this.

thethingthatlurks:
I am so glad our government has its priorities set straight. After all, wasting time, money, and other resources on persecuting an international student via extradition is just what we need when we are almost bankrupt.

Go-go-gadget irony.

America's primary export is intellectual property. The rest of the world, especially Asia, regularly steals that IP. I'm not saying this is the reason why we're broke, but it's not unrelated. Our government's recent, severe crack-down on piracy is an attempt to repair our most important revenue stream.

You could certainly debate the wisdom of an economy that relies on IP, but that's another thread.

This is completely bogus, if he committed a crime, he committed it in the UK from what I understand. We have no jurisdiction or justification for extradition. Its not like he murdered someone here then went back to the UK.

I'm still pissed about the Gary Mckinley thing, where a guy from the UK with Asperger's hacked the Pentagon looking for information about aliens, and they're trying to get him on an extradition order as a terrorist.

This is exactly I keep thinking 'fuck you' every time I hear a new law crushing freedoms, they keep saying 'oh we need these powers or the terrorists win, we'll only use them against threats to our national safety, and then a week later they're using them on threats to EMI's bottom line.

Of course, the big isue underlying all of it, is that people are shocked, of course he's being hunted internationally, rapists, child molesters and murderers don't cost corporations money, in the end, they're bad news for a few minor individuals, but they're not affecting the important people who make decisions.

I really don't want to be that crazy guy on the street corner yelling about the 'govment' but damn, in the UK there's a law being pushed thru that if you're accused of copyright infringement 3 times, your internet gets cut off. You've got kids, or other family or you house share? fuck you, we don't care, this is about big business that pay for our political campaigns, we can't afford to consider personal rights, freedom, or basic legal justice, like proof of guilt.

On top of that, it has a clause in it that's all new, which if passed, for the first time ever, means that they can go back, and rewrite the law, putting ANYTHING in, without having to pass it by the representatives of the country.

I'm really NOT pro piracy, but I am anti the witchhunting going on. It's entirely correct that he should be punished for what he did, profiting from the illegal downloading of movies, but it should be dealt with here, as is legally right, by a 98 year old judge who needs the concept of electricity explained to him before they can move onto movies, the internet, downloads and the like.

Let me ask you this, if he'd broken into HMV overnight, and stolen a thousand actual DVDs and CDs, would he be looking at the US hunting him down? Why on earth is piracy seen as so much worse than actual stealing? At least there's a clear and obvious, accountable loss assigned to theft. (not at all saying piracy doesn't lose people sales money, I'm just saying it's not as clear cut to define amounts.) Again, I'm not pro piracy, I just think there's too many rights being torn up to nail a few bedroom pirates. (I accept he was a pro and needed to be caught, just not treated like a damn terror suspect).

I know I make long posts,but if I summed it all up in one word, I'd get a warning for low content, despite 'C***s' pretty much covering it.

theultimateend:
Just start making things we don't like illegal and demanding folks be extradited here.

Start flooding the US State Dept with extradition applications for US citizens who violate British firearms laws.

lunncal:
Well for a start, what the hell America? Why should he have a trial in your country rather than the country he lives in and was caught in. This has nothing to do with America, or at least nothing more to do with America than any other country.

Secondly, I'm pretty sure linking to illegal sites isn't illegal, and if it is it shouldn't be. In fact, if his site linked to The Pirate Bay and other torrent sites, then all he was doing was linking with a site that has it's own links to illegal software. If that's illegal then where does it end?

Surely Google is just as guilty of this crime as the student is? Try searching "Pirate" in Google and look what the top result is.

Should we then punish the sites that link to TV Shack?

What about the sites that link to the sites that link to TV Shack?

This simply doesn't work, and the only reason these kind of stupid laws get allowed in the first place is because the companies who are hurt by this have all the money, and therefore all the power. Obtaining copies of things you don't own should be illegal, that's fair enough, but I think this is just ridiculous.

American law, the best a company or major organization that a company works for can buy. Sometimes it's federal, sometimes it's just based on in a state.

http://www.wired.com/epicenter/2011/05/nc-gov-anti-muni-broadband/ North Carolina law making municipal broadbands illegal to form.
http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2011/05/protect-ip-act-coica-redux Description of the PROTECT IP act, which scares the hell out of a lot of people.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_Millennium_Copyright_Act A description of an act that gives all kinds of powers to do things that kind of scare me.

Of course, that's nothing compared to the power grab that was the patriot act, or the war on drugs. Don't even get me started on how much of a federal government power grab that +++CARRIER LOST+++

i agree with geek.com, this isnt illegal. its actually what i prefer when it comes to how i get my favorite TV shows that basic cable doesnt offer. its not illegal to provide links to websites that actually are breaking the law.

the gov'mint tried to do this to the website i use, and the creator of the site had to create hundreds of carbon copies of the website, and base it in Norway or something. i dunno

point is, if he didnt upload or download the content himself, hes not breaking the law.

When companies enforce law, ah such a wonderful world.

You can't convict because you linked to a place where you can get a torrent.
That's like charging you for murder if you see someone getting shot.

RhombusHatesYou:

theultimateend:
Just start making things we don't like illegal and demanding folks be extradited here.

Start flooding the US State Dept with extradition applications for US citizens who violate British firearms laws.

Lol can you imagine the Daily Mail headlines? 'US immigrants cause massive wave of gun crime and obesity epidemic, house prices plummet'

The sad thing is, we're so obsessed with immigrants over here, we'd probably be happy to send our own citizens anywhere, we're so 'full'.

I suggest just accusing the FBI of copyright infringement 3 times, then cut off their internet, should slow down the extradition process a bit if they have to do everything by carrier pigeon.

I also hate the idea of celebrity, and that their opinions should be important,but when I see who's on the side of 'gah, death penalty for home taping' and who's on the 'yes it's bad but we don't need to string em up' side, I'm gonna side with Stephen Fry, Billy Bragg, Joss Stone and many others. When it comes to the artists, it seems mainly the ones who are already internationally famous and have nothing to gain from word of mouth who are most angrily anti piracy, see Metallica.

As stated above:
the War on Drugs
the War on Terror
the War on Piracy

Kinda makes Vietnam look like a clean victory. I genuinely don't think this is a winnable fight, unless you just turn off the internet and make us go back to burning cds and dvds. Sadly I think if they could, those in power would happily take the internet away, sacrificing all that is good, free, educational and social about it to protect the threat to the bottom line of big business.

As the guy above said, we're not defending the pirates, they should be punished for spreading the material, IF they break the law, but the laws shouldn't be ignored in the hunger for revenge,and we shouldn't be letting our politicians throw all our freedoms on a fire because their rich friends don't like us watching the new episode of the Daily Show a few days early.

Ha ha... Wait. Oh crap. BURN EVERYTHING! IF THERE'S NOT ENOUGH FIRE, EAT IT! IF YOU CAN'T EAT IT, JUST SHOVE IT DOWN THE TOILET!

Wait, inst it his right to free speech? And also, doesn't the copyright laws in america ONLY apply to america? Life is confusing.

mikozero:
quit trolling FogHornG36

the BBC is the largest broadcaster in the world.

Now now, he said "of value" can't argue with him there! All that crap we get on BBC America is mindnumbingly stupid, especially "Doctor Who", EUUUUUGH!

But seriously though, is this REALLY worth extraditing somebody for? Seriously? Copyright infringment? Christ alive, don't we have more important things to worry about that some college student on the other side of the Atlantic breaking COPYRIGHT LAWS?!

this is just ridiculous he didnt really pirate anything only link and yet we are pushing to exctide him... its not like he is the guy running pirate bay or anything..
just a big fat waste of money..

and as this is piracy related I have a feeling anon is gonna come and stick their noses into this too

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