Rumor: 360 Successor's GPU and Release Date Detailed

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Rumor: 360 Successor's GPU and Release Date Detailed

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According to some sources, the next Xbox will ship in either October or November of next year and feature an AMD 6000-series GPU.

According to IGN, sources have confirmed that mass production of the Xbox 360 successor's graphics processor will begin by the end of 2012. Early reports claimed the system would be shipping with an AMD 7000-series GPU, but this latest report, from yet another anonymous source, claims it will use a 6000-series GPU instead. Specifically, one based on the Radeon HD 6670, which can currently be had for around $79.99.

While PC users may scoff at the relatively underpowered 6670, it is far more powerful than the GPU found in the Xbox 360; the ATI Xenos, which is roughly equivalent to Radeon X1900. IGN reckons the GPU will give the new Xbox six-times the graphical processing power of its predecessor, allowing it to outperform the upcoming Wii U by around 20%.

I'd take all this with a grain of salt, however. Microsoft has confirmed nothing yet and uncompromising analyst Michael Pachter has labeled rumours of an impending "Xbox 720" launch "silly."

"Microsoft is still selling a ton of Xbox 360s, and they won't replace the existing one until sales begin to slow," he said in November of last year. Microsoft sold a ton of 360s over the holiday season.

Source: IGN

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To quote Jeremy Clarkson "POWER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Seriously though, it's good to see at least a half-decent GPU lined up for the next 360. Radeon cards aren't my strongpoint, however, they just have such a screwed up numbering system.

Even more screwed up that Nvidia's, and that's saying something.

Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

Was the PS2 weaker than the Gamecube? I thought the latter was less powerful, sure has seemed it. I've played 007 : Nightfire on both of them, pretty much side-by-side, and the PS2 one seems prettier.

Oh it's from IGN, probably not true. I heard that they were going to use ARM processors.

If this is true, then it's nice to hear that the consoles get finally a power boost. But it's a bit less than I had hoped. A year or two after the release, they would be outperformed again by the PCs.
But it would be better than the current situation.

vrbtny:

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

Was the PS2 weaker than the Gamecube? I thought the latter was less powerful, sure has seemed it. I've played 007 : Nightfire on both of them, pretty much side-by-side, and the PS2 one seems prettier.

It really depends on which was the native system. For 1st-party titles, you could see the difference on the Gamecube. But for anything that was ported, it was fairly obvious downgrade.

Performance-wise, the two systems were not all that far apart.

PS2:
*299Mhz "Emotion Engine" processor
*32MB RAMBUS (very premium RAM for the time, I'll admit)

Gamecube:
*478 MHz "Gecko" processor
*47 MB total RAM (Graphical operating RAM: 27 MB, 3 of which was specialized for textures, the remaining RAM was dedicated to the DVD system and prebuffering)

Both systems operated in 64-bit though the Gamecube had far more specialized components for each bus (for better or worse) in which some operated in 32-bit.

I have this very same graphics card in my PC, which is just a market DELL with the graphics card installed by me for Skyrim. This would therefore leave me with an easy comparison of graphics on an Xbox and PC game - which would come out looking nicer I wonder?

vrbtny:

Seriously though, it's good to see at least a half-decent GPU lined up for the next 360. Radeon cards aren't my strongpoint, however, they just have such a screwed up numbering system.

Even more screwed up that Nvidia's, and that's saying something.

wait...

what?

more screwed up that nvidia O.o.....?

i'm either incredibly smart or beyond retarded, nvidia's is definitely 10x more confusing to the untrained eye, my friend who i have been "tutoring" in pc building/gaming, still has no idea what is what with nvidia while he is already looking into radeon's hd 7000 series

OT: I much rather would've had them use the 7000 series...but still 6670 isn't horrible, definitely shouldn't boosted up though, that 79.99 value is only going to get cheaper come soon, which is what i'm assuming xbox is banking on heavily to make for cheap and sell for a tidy profit.

And so the Eighth Generation is nigh, gather your standards and pick a side, the flamewars are coming.

Ouch, hopefully its a bit better than 6670 cause that card doesn't exactly set the world on fire..... I was kind of hoping the next gen would be a decent jump.

Good either a DirectX 11 or 11.1 GPU (not a big difference as most 11.1 features don't require new hardware over 11). The power does not matter so much from a PC gaming perspective as long as it supports the latest API's. That means that PC games will not have to always be on old versions of DirectX. That is until DirectX 12 comes out, whenever that is. This is good as when the current Xbox launched it was it was just after the Directx 10 launch, so straight away it was behind.

This will mean PC ports will push PC's better even if more powerful, as all the hard work has been done by programming to the latest API with features like tessellation, etc. For the PC versions you just turn up the amount each feature is used. Good stuff.

Waaghpowa:
Oh it's from IGN, probably not true. I heard that they were going to use ARM processors.

They are talking GPU above not CPU. For CPU it looks pretty certain it will be another PowerPC CPU, but obviously one with a more recent architecture, speed profile and extra cores.

sneakypenguin:
Ouch, hopefully its a bit better than 6670 cause that card doesn't exactly set the world on fire..... I was kind of hoping the next gen would be a decent jump.

It is a jump, it is a GPU from a Radeon 6670 card vs a GPU from a Radeon X1900/X1950 (current Xbox). That's a four to five generation jump. If that is not good enough for you, I don't know what is. I don't know if they could get more current with current high-end PC GPU's without heat issues for the form factor they want.

I must admit this isn't the best of signs but it's early days yet.
Now if someone said this might be the last generation of consoles then it would slightly more worrying.
Better go out with a bang than a whimper.

http://www.gamefront.com/paradox-boss-the-next-console-generation-will-probably-be-the-last/

Oh dear.

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

It is not only the power but the hardware features supported. The WII U is only DirectX 10, whereas the next rumored XBox will be DirectX 11. So the WII U will not support hardware tessellation, etc. Also the features brought about by directX 11 actually make just using that code path more efficient even if not extra features are used. Battlefield bad compnay 2 was 10 - 20% faster on Directx 11 GPU's, than DirecxtX 10 ones of the same power, just due to using that code path.

ph0b0s123:

sneakypenguin:
Ouch, hopefully its a bit better than 6670 cause that card doesn't exactly set the world on fire..... I was kind of hoping the next gen would be a decent jump.

It is a jump, it is a GPU from a Radeon 6670 card vs a GPU from a Radeon X1900/X1950 (current Xbox). That's a four to five generation jump. If that is not good enough for you, I don't know what is. I don't know if they could get more current with current high-end PC GPU's without heat issues for the form factor they want.

It is a huge generational jump but the difference is the XBox360's GPU was high end when it came out. The 6670 is an entry level gaming card, barely qualifying as midrange. While it is an improvement over the 360, it will choke if you try to use DX11 features like Tessellation on it. Once again games will be forced to run at 720p or lower in order to deliver playable framerates. Even with code optimization, there is only so much you can squeeze out of that GPU. If this is true, I won't need to upgrade my graphics card for a very long time, as my single Radeon HD 6870 vastly outstrips the 6670's capabilities. Frankly, the 6870 should be the minimal baseline for a console upgrade. It can easily run most current titles at 1080p and deliver 60FPS. That allows for much more breathing space for future games, rather than the 6670 which is already considered a fairly weak gaming card today, it will be even weaker by 2013 standards.

vrbtny:
To quote Jeremy Clarkson "POWER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

Seriously though, it's good to see at least a half-decent GPU lined up for the next 360. Radeon cards aren't my strongpoint, however, they just have such a screwed up numbering system.

Even more screwed up that Nvidia's, and that's saying something.

The 6670 is the low end gaming card for the AMD 6000 series.

Couple that with the 7000 series was already released now.

ph0b0s123:

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

It is not only the power but the hardware features supported. The WII U is only DirectX 10, whereas the next rumored XBox will be DirectX 11. So the WII U will not support hardware tessellation, etc. Also the features brought about by directX 11 actually make just using that code path more efficient even if not extra features are used. Battlefield bad compnay 2 was 10 - 20% faster on Directx 11 GPU's, than DirecxtX 10 ones of the same power, just due to using that code path.

Lot of funny comments on this thread.... It's stupid to compare the WiiU to anything, since no one knows what is actually in it. They built a system they believe will be comparable to the WiiU in power, but nothing is known for sure. Also, this is just a rumor anyway. Everyone is speculating on something we definitely don't know and things that "MAY" be true. No one has stated the WiiU is going to use DX10 at all. Or if they did, it was not a reliable source since Nintendo has literally released zero information regarding this component or the graphical capabilities of it. Nor would it make any sense for them to release something that didn't support DX11 since the cards that support it are now common place and inexpensive. And there is no reason a company would choose to use a card that only supports DX10 since it was complete shit.

I mean no insult and I love speculating as much as the next guy, but you should not speak so matter of fact about something that is completely unknown.

Edit: You can buy the first generation DX11 cards for $45. Just as an example of how inexpensive these cards are.

TheBobmus:
I have this very same graphics card in my PC, which is just a market DELL with the graphics card installed by me for Skyrim. This would therefore leave me with an easy comparison of graphics on an Xbox and PC game - which would come out looking nicer I wonder?

Well, they'd be pretty similar. Consoles though generally allow lower level access to the hardware, so it can get tweaked for more performance compared to a PC running through DirectX. In that case, the console could have better graphics. However, it would also greatly be affected by TV/monitor and also if they still go with 720p vs 1080p, in which case I'd generally take slightly lower settings for higher resolution.

vrbtny:

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

Was the PS2 weaker than the Gamecube? I thought the latter was less powerful, sure has seemed it. I've played 007 : Nightfire on both of them, pretty much side-by-side, and the PS2 one seems prettier.

If you compare Resident Evil 4 the PS2 version had really grainy graphics and the cut scenes were so bad you seriously had to be grateful for Capcom and their hatred for unskippable cut scenes.

OT: I'm not sure if I will go for the new Xbox or not. I got a 360 and a decent gaming PC as it is. I have had a lot of fun with my Xbox so I guess I will wait to see the exclusives.

My GTX 560 Ti laughs in the face of a meagre HD6670.

I'm sure XBros everywhere will be hailing this as some kind of miniature super computer, when in reality it's already outdated. Wonder how many decades this one will have to last? Lol consoles.

If only people could make bets on rumors, I'd be a rich man right now given how much of a 'sure thing' a game industry rumor is. Microsoft making no comment is basically a confirmation in of itself. That's so common now it's almost code for yes in game-industry-speak.

It also sounds too plausible not to be true.

Regardless of whether this is true or not, I think people are just setting themselves up for disappointment if they're expecting high end stuff in the next Xbox. The next Playstation, maybe, at least it will crush the Xbox' specs, but I get the feeling that the Xbox will be moving away from games and more towards a media center. It will be affordable while still being competitive with games for the PS3, but it'll never get near the PC.

That said, GPUs cost about the same to make, you'd think M$ has the weight to ask one of the manufacturers to give them to it at cost to promote it, that way the new Xbox can still be cheap, but it can be a powerhouse with a GPU costing more at retail than the Xbox itself.

Yopaz:

vrbtny:

j-e-f-f-e-r-s:
Funny thing: 'hardcore' gamers have been scoffing at the specs of the Wii U, and claiming that the next round of PS/Xbox consoles will wipe the floor with it. Whereas this article suggests the difference will be increased performance of around '20%'.

Which is far less than the difference in performance between the original PS2 (the weakest console of its generation) and the original Xbox (basically a gaming PC of the time sold with a controller attached). Yet the PS2 outsold the Xbox by a factor of about 10-1.

Just something interesting to think about. Of course, it could all be lies and rumours. But if not, the next generation is going to be very interesting indeed...

Was the PS2 weaker than the Gamecube? I thought the latter was less powerful, sure has seemed it. I've played 007 : Nightfire on both of them, pretty much side-by-side, and the PS2 one seems prettier.

If you compare Resident Evil 4 the PS2 version had really grainy graphics and the cut scenes were so bad you seriously had to be grateful for Capcom and their hatred for unskippable cut scenes.

But that's cuz it's a sloppy port, I remember the PS2 having the better specs, but I could be wrong. The RE4 thing though is only cuz of Capcom's disregard for the PS2.

HAH! I remember hearing that the Xbox 720 would have enough power to render the original Toy Story movie in real-time. Unless they put 20+ of those GPU's into the case that's not gonna happen!

SenorStocks:
I'm sure XBros everywhere will be hailing this as some kind of miniature super computer, when in reality it's already outdated. Wonder how many decades this one will have to last? Lol consoles.

Bitter towards console gamers much? I think it's fairly common knowledge that games will always look better on PCs because of superior hardware...

There have been so many rumors about the next console, I won't believe anything until I see it.

vrbtny:

Even more screwed up that Nvidia's, and that's saying something.

Oh please don't get me started about my heavy duty 3d modeling laptop (for school) with nifty things in it. Oh lord the amount of times I got the infamous "Nvidea bla bla kernel 285.something stopped responding and has recovered." thing where it basically tells you the graphics card ran out of juice or something...

THE BIGGEST MYSTERY IN THE WORLD! when it comes to Nvidea. Wish they fixed that issue =/
I really do.

gmaverick019:

vrbtny:

Seriously though, it's good to see at least a half-decent GPU lined up for the next 360. Radeon cards aren't my strongpoint, however, they just have such a screwed up numbering system.

Even more screwed up that Nvidia's, and that's saying something.

wait...

what?

more screwed up that nvidia O.o.....?

i'm either incredibly smart or beyond retarded, nvidia's is definitely 10x more confusing to the untrained eye, my friend who i have been "tutoring" in pc building/gaming, still has no idea what is what with nvidia while he is already looking into radeon's hd 7000 series

OT: I much rather would've had them use the 7000 series...but still 6670 isn't horrible, definitely shouldn't boosted up though, that 79.99 value is only going to get cheaper come soon, which is what i'm assuming xbox is banking on heavily to make for cheap and sell for a tidy profit.

All you have to tell him is bigger numbers are better. How hard is that? First number is generation, next 2 on nvidia are card number, next 3 on ati chips are card number.

Ot: I'm pretty sure my heatsink was twice as expensive as this card. Xbox, holding back gaming graphics for another 6 years.

why yes, I do have sli gtx 580's, thanks for asking

The Cool Kid:
My GTX 560 Ti laughs in the face of a meagre HD6670.

Nice, you can use your card to introduce both of mine at the next nvidia owners club meeting. :p

why do you need to have better graphics ot play the some old BF3-***t clone.
IT LOOKS BETTER - wow, now I am impressed /sarcasm

Ruwrak:

vrbtny:

Even more screwed up that Nvidia's, and that's saying something.

Oh please don't get me started about my heavy duty 3d modeling laptop (for school) with nifty things in it. Oh lord the amount of times I got the infamous "Nvidea bla bla kernel 285.something stopped responding and has recovered." thing where it basically tells you the graphics card ran out of juice or something...

THE BIGGEST MYSTERY IN THE WORLD! when it comes to Nvidea. Wish they fixed that issue =/
I really do.

Since you're using a laptop, it's possible that the error is being caused by overheating or some other hardware issue. I had a 285 GTX that kept having that problem, turned out that the clock speed was too high and as soon as I underclocked it the problem went away. Needless to say that was sent straight back!

WonderWillard:

SenorStocks:
I'm sure XBros everywhere will be hailing this as some kind of miniature super computer, when in reality it's already outdated. Wonder how many decades this one will have to last? Lol consoles.

Bitter towards console gamers much? I think it's fairly common knowledge that games will always look better on PCs because of superior hardware...

There have been so many rumors about the next console, I won't believe anything until I see it.

Not bitter. Just feel sorry the ones who genuinely think that the hardware in them is the bee's knees.

Oh look information on the GPU a console will use,
image
One of the things about a console is that all its hardware is uniform and thus what each component is doesn't really matter except to developers. To the layman, such as myself, its really not important since there isn't anything I can do except say "huh, that's interesting" and buy it anyways if I want the newest X-box console. The potential release date is interesting but specs as far as I'm concerned, except for the rare case of a developer who cares about such things and which seems to not be the primary demographic around here most of the time, are just so hardware geeks can have dick waving contest. I don't care how powerful it is to some other card or what you have or what something else has. I care if it can make pretty pictures. I'm fairly certain it can, so I'm good.

Twilight_guy:
Oh look information on the GPU a console will use,
image
One of the things about a console is that all its hardware is uniform and thus what each component is doesn't really matter except to developers. To the layman, such as myself, its really not important since there isn't anything I can do except say "huh, that's interesting" and buy it anyways if I want the newest X-box console. The potential release date is interesting but specs as far as I'm concerned, except for the rare case of a developer who cares about such things and which seems to not be the primary demographic around here most of the time, are just so hardware geeks can have dick waving contest. I don't care how powerful it is to some other card or what you have or what something else has. I care if it can make pretty pictures. I'm fairly certain it can, so I'm good.

You hit the crux of the issue. That other cards cn make prettier pictures, but that most games made for the next generation of consoles will have to be scaled back in terms of their prettiness in order for people's new boxes to not melt themselves.

SenorStocks:

Since you're using a laptop, it's possible that the error is being caused by overheating or some other hardware issue. I had a 285 GTX that kept having that problem, turned out that the clock speed was too high and as soon as I underclocked it the problem went away. Needless to say that was sent straight back!

A good thought, but after having a piece of tracking software installed it stayed within the bounderies of 'very safe', without the extra fan blowing. I always have my laptop on a non cluttered area, not on any soft tissue that can block the fan or whatnots. I have a MSI GT663R-432NL (http://nl.msi.com/product/nb/GT663.html#/?div=Specification) and it works fine when I run a fullscreen program. But when I have something in a windowed mode it just tells me to go do something else basically.

It crashes alot less when I set the windows theme to xp (classic) and disable aeropeek.
Yes I know it says it's a gaming laptop, but it had all the components I needed for the 3d modeling & other heavy duty programs (After Effects filmmaking etc.)

So I'm not quite sure what is going on. I got shocked by the mouse MSI delivered along with it, so I had to replace that one with my own. Don't think that got something to do with it but still.. I can't send it back (or afford to send it back since I need it on daily basis for finishing my final year). So I'm outta luck untill Nvidea get's it right I guess.

ON TOPIC:
-------------
Well I don't know much about graphics cards and consoles, but as long as it's better right? I also could do with some faster loading times with Dark Souls... Thing takes forever to load...
-------------

Twilight_guy:
One of the things about a console is that all its hardware is uniform and thus what each component is doesn't really matter except to developers. To the layman, such as myself, its really not important since there isn't anything I can do except say "huh, that's interesting" and buy it anyways if I want the newest X-box console. The potential release date is interesting but specs as far as I'm concerned, except for the rare case of a developer who cares about such things and which seems to not be the primary demographic around here most of the time, are just so hardware geeks can have dick waving contest. I don't care how powerful it is to some other card or what you have or what something else has. I care if it can make pretty pictures. I'm fairly certain it can, so I'm good.

Wait, did you just laud people being a "stupid" consumer?
"Hurrdurr goan buy next consoel anyway, don't care!"

And the ones wanting to buy their kids a computer and getting them one of these things because they don't know the difference?

image

It matters for every single development studio in what they can do with the thing, and it matters for every single consumer in what they can get out of the thing. And those "hardware geeks" (e.g. people that know what the fuck they are talking about and know how to program for a specific target hardware) are the people making your games.
Here for instance you see an NVIDIA engineer discussing "graphics stuff": http://timothylottes.blogspot.com/2012/01/games-vs-film.html with Prey 2 graphics programmer Brian Karis and DICEs rendering architect Johan Anderson.

I kinda feel sorry for you now...

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