Update: Fez Dev Tells Media Member To Kill Himself

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Welp, it's official, Fish is a Call of Duty gamer.

All jokes aside, I don't think I can add anything to this discussion other than my own iteration of "Wow, that guy's a douche."

Senare:
I think that the way Fish acted is very human and that is not something I would hold against him. If this was someone else, would you really hold it against that person to steam up and lash out if they were attacked? How much of a moral high ground should we really expect others to take?

If he wants to steam up and lash out, he's in the wrong industry. In fact, I think any occupation that even remotely puts in him in a situation like this one is inappropriate for him. It was a sarcastic comment, a joke, even. And Fish thinks highly enough of himself to say his life is so much better than his that he should realise it and kill himself.

Not all human beings are this childish and egotistical. I think I'd have taken this comment far better than Fish did. It's a pun on his name, as far as I can see, nothing near a below-the-belt remark.

I didn't realise Futurama references were taken so seriously.

I will now refrain from telling anyone to bite my shiny, metal ass from now on.

Anyway, Fish quitting Twitter, at least for a while, is probably a good thing for him. He seems to get a shit ton of criticism on there, and Phil can't seem to deal with that very well. Hell, the amount of abuse he got on there would be enough to put most people off.

And to be fair, the media member wasn't exactly classy himself, in the video.

Games journalists are going to struggle though, I'm pretty sure some could probably live off the amount of shit he said that got turned into news posts.

EDIT: Y'know, this topic probably doesn't need my input. I'm just gonna indirectly delete it.

Move along here, folks; nothing to see.

Alcaste:

Senare:
I think that the way Fish acted is very human and that is not something I would hold against him. If this was someone else, would you really hold it against that person to steam up and lash out if they were attacked? How much of a moral high ground should we really expect others to take?

I'll give you a moment to think about that statement. That he acted 'human'. Suicide is a pretty big deal. People DO kill themselves because bullies tell them to. Phil Fish doesn't deserve any sympathy. He's always been a melodramatic ass that lashes out at everyone. Him shutting up for a while is better for the whole industry. At least until he grows up.

He is not a bully. If anything, he's the one getting bullied. No doubt he brought it upon himself, because he's an asshole, but even he doesn't deserve the sheer amount of constant shit he gets. When he says he's constantly getting attacked, he's really not exaggerating.

Senare:
I think that the way Fish acted is very human and that is not something I would hold against him. If this was someone else, would you really hold it against that person to steam up and lash out if they were attacked? How much of a moral high ground should we really expect others to take?

I completely agree. Ultimately, I value having one more good game developer over having one less person acting like an asshole on the internet. I can ignore assholes, I can't ignore a lack of fun games. What he's doing isn't really destructive, it's just being a jerk. I can deal with that.

Here's how you fight back.

"The thing with us "tosspots" "hipsters" is that we're not beholden to media leeches like you, and you're right. we're VERY successful. And we're not going anywhere. Get used to it because you will be reporting on my success stories for a long while more."

There you go Philly. A snarky comeback where you applaud yourself, scoff at him for being a decrepit old media parasite and basically do take the high-ground whilst still denigrating him to nothing more than someone who will be heralding your achievements.

That is how someone would react if they weren't hipster tosspot douchebags. It's best if you keep to making games and not engaging in empty exchanges of excessive insults.

This guy's clearly having a mental breakdown. It doesn't excuse him lashing out like this and cancelling a game because of a remark, but the guy does need to get away and take some time out to clear his head.

Complain about being called a tosspot...
by proving you are, indeed, a tosspot.
Good job!

http://i.imgur.com/R9i47.png

I mean, it's Phil Fish. Dude's not exactly known for being stable and friendly. Yeah, he gets attacked on a pretty regular basis, but the things he says tend to warrant it. If he thinks internet satire is enough motivation for closing up shop, maybe working on the internet-centric indie game scene isn't exactly the place for him.

I'm going to start off by saying that a quote from Futurama being the main focus of the headline is a bit silly, in my honest opinion.

The rest of what Fish is going on about is, of course, completely and utterly moronic. I just don't think that particular line should be what this article is pointing out as ridiculous, as it's not a real threat or statement.

Love how the OP reduces Marcus Beer's relentless attack against Fish to just 'blowfish'. How about providing some better context, hmm?

No one looks good here, but presenting Marcus Beer as some innocent wronged party in this is just insane.

I just think this is a real shame all round. Phil Fish is obviously a talented guy but he's in the wrong medium for someone of his sensitive disposition, and I think it's shameful that the medium can't accommodate someone of that disposition. I'm not excusing his actions this time and he's often done himself no favours, but he has been pushed around and hounded A LOT. And before the bedroom crusaders start judging him, I'd like them to try and imagine how they would handle even half that level of scrutiny and abuse.

I often daydream about being involved in the games industry in some writing capacity or some sort and the first obstacle that crushes it isn't my talent (or lack of), knowledge or connections, it's always "could I handle the gaming community?" because I'm really not sure I could. I wonder how many other people, maybe even with actual talent, are being put off for the same reason.

Steven Bogos:

-snipped-

Akalabeth:

So someone calling him "Blowfish" is "Criticism of his work"?

Phil Fish wasn't being called Blowfish. BlowFish was being used to refer to both Jonathan Blow and Phil Fish. It also, very clearly, isn't a criticism of his work.

Senare:
Without knowing any historical context, acting like this is very human and that is not something I would hold against him. Dick or not - if this was someone else, would you really hold it against that person to steam up and lash out if they were attacked? How much of a moral high ground should we really expect others to take?

So... insulting someone while putting yourself up upon a pedestal, then telling them to go kill themselves, is perfectly fine with you I take it?
If I heard ANYONE talking like that, friend or not, I'd smack them down.

The moral high-ground here would of been for Fish to just shut up and think before typing. Trying to assert yourself as something superior to another, then telling them to go kill themselves after seeing how pathetic they really are, is about as low as low can be, in terms of morality and ground. In fact, I'm willing to bet Fish is currently sitting under the Mole People at this point.

Compare my life to yours and then kill yourself? That's quite an ego for someone most people have never heard of. Another big fish in a small pond.

Riobux:

Brussels:

Riobux:

And just then nothing of value was lost.

This is just as tasteless as Phil telling someone to kill themselves.

I just don't understand what was so great about Fez, and therefore I struggle to work out what is the value of Fish beyond the "but he's a human being!" excuse.

What have you produced? If you say that someone being a conscious human being is just an 'excuse' and their life means nothing, what would be lost if you died? People are worth more than just what they produce.
OT: So in this situation everybody is an ass? Fish loses his rag and goes overboard; somewhat understandable given that he's been insulted repeatedly by people who also should know better, and now he's paying for it by no longer being able to make his games, for whatever reason. Sad story, whatever way you look at it. I do really hope he hasn't decided to go and do something stupid in his anger/depression.

So 'indie dev throws tantrum cause some guy called him a name' basically? spiffy, and not really news worthy >.> the part about Fez 2 getting canned, sure, worth a report, but the dev throwing a hissy fit cause some one called him 'blow fish', ugh ....

It'd been more worth while to write up a news story on Transformers Prime ending then reporting some assholes temper tantrum

Beer needs to fuck off. What has he contributed, exactly, to this industry? That's what I thought. At least Fish does shit.

Fractral:

Riobux:

Brussels:

This is just as tasteless as Phil telling someone to kill themselves.

I just don't understand what was so great about Fez, and therefore I struggle to work out what is the value of Fish beyond the "but he's a human being!" excuse.

What have you produced? If you say that someone being a conscious human being is just an 'excuse' and their life means nothing, what would be lost if you died? People are worth more than just what they produce.

Let's be realistic: Why would you care if I got hit by a car tomorrow? Sure you may have a brief moment of "oh, it's sad he got hit by a car", but because I haven't had any significance to your life in any way you probably wouldn't care beyond five minutes. I haven't produced anything note-worthy, not in terms of physical content, social content or something mentally stimulating. Phil Fish, to me, hasn't provided me anything that has been note-worthy to me personally in any way. Therefore, if he offed himself in the near future nothing of value would be lost to me.

Although if you can name someone who has been worth a lot despite not making anything of worth in terms of physical, social or mental content, I'll admit fault.

Eri:
Beer needs to fuck off. What has he contributed, exactly, to this industry? That's what I thought. At least Fish does shit.

Philly Fishsticks acted like a textbook NFL diva: showboating, bragging, over-estimating his abilities and status all because he made one half-decent game that was well-received by critics. And it finally came back to bite him in the ass.

This guy fucking ridiculed people on Twitter on a daily basis, but it looks like he can't handle the taste of his own medicine.

Good riddance. This is not how a grown man is supposed to act.

Alcaste:
I'll give you a moment to think about that statement. That he acted 'human'. Suicide is a pretty big deal. People DO kill themselves because bullies tell them to. Phil Fish doesn't deserve any sympathy. He's always been a melodramatic ass that lashes out at everyone. Him shutting up for a while is better for the whole industry. At least until he grows up.

thebobmaster:
[quote="Senare" post="7.823359.19932869"]Lashing out is one thing. Telling a critic to kill themselves, because he is so much better than them, though? What would he have to say for you to hold it against him?

Suicide is a very big deal, yet to me it is besides the point because I perceive his tweet as just a singular attempt at being hurtful in response to a perceived attack.
I view the interchange abstractly as a verbal attack against another (perceived or actual). This is a different perspective than a logical exchange of words (content) and more an emotional exchange of intentions. Thus the exact content does not matter because to me this is about the human urge to attack back when being attacked. What content is "one step to far" would be more a matter of taste and values of the observer.

Having someone completely overcome such behaviour in all areas of life is rare; Fish's tolerance and maturity is just on a different level than what is expected of him (so a bit of personal development would do him good). Who everyone think Fish is does not really matter to me. Dick or no, it is still very human behaviour and I would not hold such behaviour against him as a human being because such behaviour is natural to me.

What would he have to say to tick me off? The answer is pretty unsatisfying actually: he would have to attack something I hold dear and push my buttons enough to lose my respect. But that would still not make me hold such behaviour against him, because then everyone else reacting the same way (in a general sense) would get the same treatment (by my estimate that would be the majority of the world population).

Hopefully that made some semblance of sense. :/

This Fish guy needs to grow the hell up. Done. End of Story. He reduced himself to the level of a 13 year old with a mic and no parental guidance. I'm surprised he didn't start calling the critic a fag before he told him to kill himself. Plenty of people have contributed more to their field while taking more shit and have still come out on top.

Oh he's been doing this shit for ages, I remember when Fez came out on PC and when it did better on PC than Xbox Live he called people who bought a PC copy "cheap bastards" or something to that degree.

I really share no sympathy for him because of how he talks to people, but at the same time I'll miss reading the reports of him verbally abusing a large demographic of people or individuals.
I'm sure he'll be back in a few weeks.

"You're a fucking tosspot hipster"
"Hey, fuck you, I make this shit. And you eat it."

Seems fair enough to me. Good for you, Phil Fish.

Eric the Orange:
Seems to be pretty common problem for some creative types that they cannot take criticism of there work.

It's a problem with people full stop, but doubly so when they've invested themselves so heavily into something that criticism of that thing essentially becomes a direct criticism of the person in that person's mind.

It can be very hard to take a step back no matter how obvious it is to outsiders. Been there, not on this scale, but definitely been there.

Anyway.

Having said that, of all the people to freakout at, Marcus Beer? As in the guy who used do PR for Ubisoft then Vivendi, who has his name in the credits of things like IL2, Ghost Recon and FEAR? The guy who NBC go to for a gaming opinion? Yeah, total parasite, never had anything to do with games, not in our corner at all, I'm sure when he looks at his nice house, wife and kids he feels totally awful too.

I guess Fish is learning this the hard way, but there are people out there who are both on 'our' side and perfectly willing to criticise you and your behaviour if they feel you deserve it. He would have been better off quietly asking Beer for advice, goodness knows Fish needs someone out there with the experience and knowledge to tell him to shut up, Beer would have been just the man.

Hazy:

Good riddance. This is not how a grown man is supposed to act.

That little video had me in hysterics, whoever put that music to is a genius, if it was you, you're a genius, a comedy genius.

I'm still giggling like an idiot now.

fix-the-spade:

Hazy:

Good riddance. This is not how a grown man is supposed to act.

That little video had me in hysterics, whoever put that music to is a genius, if it was you, you're a genius, a comedy genius.

I'm still giggling like an idiot now.

Nah, I wish, but I can't take credit for this. I was asleep when the news broke, haha.

Steven Bogos:
Fish lashed out at Beer on Twitter

NO! Fish and Chips will never be the same without beer! How will this affect the British Economy!?

Seriously, this is sad. I recently watched the Indie Game documentary, and even under that positive light Fish seemed a nervous and unstable person, likely due to massive overwork and being slightly unhinged to begin with. I'm sad for him.

Here's hoping this all works out for everyone.

I think this points to something that is very problematic with the industry: It needs to grow up. Both the games creator, and the game media, act like spoiled rotten children that, when they don't get their way, they decide to insult, belittle, and throw a tantrum. This whole industry needs to really grow up and end this kind of Spoiled ness. I remember when Notch went on a rampage and insult the Yogcast for something he didn't even witness personally. I remember Spoony (who was/is suffering from depression) breaking down and going on a rampage on Twitter. Now this (And apparently, Mr. Fish might also have depression). The Industry needs to grow up.

Things like this make me wish I had pirated Fez.
But then again, that would be just as immature.

Wait wait wait... Someone acted like a prick on the internet? That can't be right... Can we check again? Maybe it was a mistake.

To be honest, if he's going to act like a dick he deserves silly comments like "blowfish."

I definitely feel like the minority here, but that's me not knowing much till this. If people are going to be complete assholes to him and they expect no consequence to come to it, this seems like a consequence and *should* tell others to watch what they say. But seeing how people didn't even watch the arrest of Justin Cart ehh....
Though there were better options, neither party did the proper one.
EDIT: OH wait I read the article wrong. I thought he was being told to kill himself, the creator that is for a minor issue in their game. Never mind, he is an asshole.

Eri:
Beer needs to fuck off. What has he contributed, exactly, to this industry? That's what I thought. At least Fish does shit.

Beer called out Fish on a very pertinent point: when it comes to shilling his own game, he and Blow are more than happy to talk to the games media, and get their games as much exposure as possible. Yet when those same media types ask them for their opinion on Microsoft's indie stance, a valid enough question given how they're two of the most prominent indie developers around, all of a sudden they're too good for the media? That's bullshit. If they just wanted to give a 'no comment' that would be one thing, but to suddenly go all primadonna despite the fact that both men's success is largely owed to the games media is just ridiculous.

I don't much care for Beer, the guy mixes his work with his personal life way too much, often uses his show on GT to talk about his personal issues and generally treats the camera like his personal therapist. But damn, this wasn't cool.

Akalabeth:
Fish was out of line certainly. But the other guy sounds like a grade-a juvenile asshole as well. This is an example of two people who should've been the better man, and yet neither of them were.

Worthwhile note, when he was talking about Blowfish he was talking about the collective pairing of Jonathan Blow of Braid fame and Phil Fish of Fez fame. Also, like the Blowfish, they're quite tasty but potentially lethal.

He was specifically talking about the pair's tendency to court the media at every opportunity, but immediately lash out the moment the attention they'd created didn't suit them or the coverage moved in a direction they didn't like. Whilst his delivery was typically sweary welshman the point was that 'BlowFish' have set themselves up as the self proclaimed faces of Indy Game Development. Having created that image themselves, they don't get to be surprised when the press turns to them for an opinion. As the 'faces' of an entire industry they have a duty to make that industry look good, not lash out all the time which could hurt many more people and projects than their own.

Unfortunately that seems to have sailed past Fish, who's reverted to type.

A man insults another man for insulting him. We must all comment on this! =p

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