Smash Bros. Fan With Early Copy Streams Gameplay, Leaks Characters - Update

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Hero of Lime:
Yeah I've wanted Isaac in there for such a long time too. However, I think it's neat to have the Duck Hunt Dog, it's just so unexpected. Now having Dark Pit and possibly Dr. Mario as separate characters over Isaac, or other new characters? That is kind of messed up. Was anyone really clamoring for Dr. Mario to return?

The benefit to Dr. Mario is he has been given a lot of the classic Mario moves (like the tornado down b instead of fludd). So normal Mario's modified specials include various versions of fludd for down b while Dr. Mario has an entirely different set. This is just one example I've seen that they have many different moves although they share up b for sure.

This allows people who prefer one type of Mario to the other to have options (a lot of pros dropped Mario because fludd is stupid, but they might pick up Dr. Mario).

I am assuming Dark Pit has a different range of moves as well but I haven't seen confirmation of that yet.

Anyway I wouldn't view Dark Pit or Dr. Mario as being in instead of someone else. They were easy clones to make and the decision was probably more along the lines of, do we have less characters or go ahead and add these? Presumably part of the team with nothing else to work on was permitted to put them in since clones probably require less oversight than entirely new models/moves.

I'd play the hell out of the Duck Hunt Dog, so long as his laugh is incorporated somehow. Whether as a taunt or a move, I care not.

fieryshadowcard:
I'd play the hell out of the Duck Hunt Dog, so long as his laugh is incorporated somehow. Whether as a taunt or a move, I care not.

It's in a bunch of his animations. His introduction animation is him popping out of the grass and laughing, his taunt is laughing and if I remember correctly his victory animation is laughing.

MrPhyntch:

The hate isn't only for that dog, either. Paulentina, Baby Bowser and Rosalina are annoying.

All of which look like fun characters to play as with interesting fighting styles, I'm more upset at the fact that Ganondorf is still a Captain Falcon clone. I'd love to have the Hyrule Warriors version of Ganondorf in a Smash game.

It boggles my mind when people complain about "wasted slots" when there aren't a set limit of slots in the first place, I'm sure the Duck Hunt Dog got added because some guys in the development team were talking about how fun/funny it would be to have him in the game. I highly doubt that they put a fan favorite character in (like Zero from Mega Man X for example) and then decided to cut them out and replace them with the dog.

The rest of the remaining rouster is not a suprise except for the Hunt dog and duck. Does this mean there will be a new Dunk Hunt game in the future like Pit?

See, I don't mind Duck Hunt Dog at all, in fact I'm gonna use it to taunt my friend who had some strange notion that there'd be no more joke characters. No, what I'm pissed about are these things:

1.) Why the hell does Ganondorf still not have a unique moveset!? Seriously, Sakurai, it's been 3 games now since his introduction to Smash Bros, and one of the most iconic villains in video games is still a clone? Ever gonna have him use those swords that he's used in the past? Seriously, if anyone deserves his own moveset, it's Ganondorf.

2.) Why the hell are Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario not just alternate costumes? I get that Dr. Mario has the old Mario's moveset, but that's not justification at all for it. You gave Wario, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, and Robin alternates that were more work that just putting the Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario costumes over the characters. Hell, even Project M did that for Dr. Mario. If you really wanted more Kid Icarus characters Sakurai, then you could have put in Hades or something. My main point is, I thought we were past the whole clone crap.

Remember when we didn't know who the hidden characters of a game were, and we were actually surprised to unlock some really cool character we liked in our other games? Good times...

Andway, it's the 4th game in the series and Samus is STILL the only character from the Metroid franchise to be in Smash Bros? Seriously, fans have been begging for a shrunken down Ridley, or Galactic Federation Marines, the Bounty Hunters from Prime: Hunters, the bounty hunters from Prime 3: Corruption, a Chozo, or just any other Metroid character. But no, all we get is Samus split into two characters, and four characters from Fire Emblem. Way to treat one of your founding franchises. I'm going to go cry in the corner now. Q_Q

MrPhyntch:
Dammit. I knew he was a long shot because his series hasn't put out a good game in a long time, but I'm genuinely pissed that freaking Duck Hunt Dog beat Isaac (Golden Sun) as a playable character in Smash Bros.

Ah well, a man can dream. And there's always the hope for DLC...

You should be more angry at Lucina or Robin for that.

EyeReaper:
Ugh. I dislike how much representation Kid Icarus gets. Blatant Nepotism from Sakurai I say

However those Koopalings look fucking tops. I think I know who I'm maining from the looks of it. Roy's our Boy.

If Sakurai was being nepotistic, don't you think Kirby would have gotten more representation than Kid Icarus, well?

OT: Well those are some....interesting choices for characters, curious to see what Dog Hunt Dog does though. Glad Ganondorf is confirmed and after seeing Palutena, I knew Black Pit was confirmed, but I hope he has a different move set. Only 3 more weeks, I can make it.

Xan Krieger:
Nintendo must be pissed, what legal stuff can they hit him with? Also I wish he'd play the wii fit chick, she's cute.

Considering that they were going to show the full game tomorrow, and the official release is in two days, I don't think they're too bothered.

TKretts3:

Andway, it's the 4th game in the series and Samus is STILL the only character from the Metroid franchise to be in Smash Bros? Seriously, fans have been begging for a shrunken down Ridley, or Galactic Federation Marines, the Bounty Hunters from Prime: Hunters, the bounty hunters from Prime 3: Corruption, a Chozo, or just any other Metroid character. But no, all we get is Samus split into two characters, and four characters from Fire Emblem. Way to treat one of your founding franchises. I'm going to go cry in the corner now. Q_Q

My thoughts as well. I get that this is a great roster for some but I'm unfortunately not one of them.

It's great if you like fire emblem and kid icarus though.

Neronium:

1.) Why the hell does Ganondorf still not have a unique moveset!? Seriously, Sakurai, it's been 3 games now since his introduction to Smash Bros, and one of the most iconic villains in video games is still a clone? Ever gonna have him use those swords that he's used in the past? Seriously, if anyone deserves his own moveset, it's Ganondorf.

2.) Why the hell are Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario not just alternate costumes? I get that Dr. Mario has the old Mario's moveset, but that's not justification at all for it. You gave Wario, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, and Robin alternates that were more work that just putting the Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario costumes over the characters. Hell, even Project M did that for Dr. Mario. If you really wanted more Kid Icarus characters Sakurai, then you could have put in Hades or something. My main point is, I thought we were past the whole clone crap.

Ganondorf is Sakurai's favorite character and also his main. I don't think he really WANTS to change his favorite, but at the same time, Falcon has been the same in 4 games, so he can't change him either.

As for the others, I feel like they wanted to have characters who weren't part of the early leak, but didn't have quite enough development time for drastically different characters. The claim that "all characters were decided before development" was most likely a lie.

There's also the matter that Sakurai didn't want to expand the roster too much because of balance issues, he did state at the start of Smash 4's development that he wouldn't make it much bigger than Brawl's roster.

An alternative possibility is that they finished development of the game ahead of schedule, so they decided to spend some time modelling and programming a few clone characters.

Stats ^1:

Neronium:

1.) Why the hell does Ganondorf still not have a unique moveset!? Seriously, Sakurai, it's been 3 games now since his introduction to Smash Bros, and one of the most iconic villains in video games is still a clone? Ever gonna have him use those swords that he's used in the past? Seriously, if anyone deserves his own moveset, it's Ganondorf.

2.) Why the hell are Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario not just alternate costumes? I get that Dr. Mario has the old Mario's moveset, but that's not justification at all for it. You gave Wario, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, and Robin alternates that were more work that just putting the Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario costumes over the characters. Hell, even Project M did that for Dr. Mario. If you really wanted more Kid Icarus characters Sakurai, then you could have put in Hades or something. My main point is, I thought we were past the whole clone crap.

Ganondorf is Sakurai's favorite character and also his main. I don't think he really WANTS to change his favorite, but at the same time, Falcon has been the same in 4 games, so he can't change him either.

As for the others, I feel like they wanted to have characters who weren't part of the early leak, but didn't have quite enough development time for drastically different characters. The claim that "all characters were decided before development" was most likely a lie.

There's also the matter that Sakurai didn't want to expand the roster too much because of balance issues, he did state at the start of Smash 4's development that he wouldn't make it much bigger than Brawl's roster.

An alternative possibility is that they finished development of the game ahead of schedule, so they decided to spend some time modelling and programming a few clone characters.

Balance issues only matter if the game is expected to be played competitively. Which this won't. Because Project M exists, as does original Melee, and the hardcore players of those games hate everything about the new ones because (GASP) they're accessible to beginners.

LarsInCharge:

Balance issues only matter if the game is expected to be played competitively. Which this won't. Because Project M exists, as does original Melee, and the hardcore players of those games hate everything about the new ones because (GASP) they're accessible to beginners.

That argument isn't valid at all, because they WANT the game to be played competitively.

Even if they didn't, then balance is still an issue. If one character is godlike compared to the other 44 or so characters, then you have an extremely poorly designed game which borders on being unplayable.

I'm with the people who are wondering why the hell the DHD is in there. He better have bloody amazing, original gameplay to kick out other, far more worthy additions to the roster.

Kitsune Hunter:

EyeReaper:
Ugh. I dislike how much representation Kid Icarus gets. Blatant Nepotism from Sakurai I say

However those Koopalings look fucking tops. I think I know who I'm maining from the looks of it. Roy's our Boy.

If Sakurai was being nepotistic, don't you think Kirby would have gotten more representation than Kid Icarus, well?

OT: Well those are some....interesting choices for characters, curious to see what Dog Hunt Dog does though. Glad Ganondorf is confirmed and after seeing Palutena, I knew Black Pit was confirmed, but I hope he has a different move set. Only 3 more weeks, I can make it.

Ehh, Kirby's high time was brawl. King Dedede was the Big Hero of the story mode, and who was widely considered the most overpowered and toppest of tier characters? Meta Knight. Aka a KIRBY CHARACTER!

Case closed Watson.

But seriously, In this new game, Kid Icarus has three characters, like five items, a couple stages, and (if the smash wiki is correct) two Assist Trophies. That's more than the Metroid, Star Fox, or Donkey Kong (If you count him separate from the Mario series).
That's injustice if you ask me.

Personally, I'm totally okay with this roster... save for Dark Pit. Did he REALLY need to be an individual character? I understand that Lucina is different Marth. I actually appreciate the thought behind Dr Mario (I'm more of a fan of pre-Brawl Mario than post-Brawl, so I like being able to choose between them). But... what does Dark Pit bring to the table? Admittedly, I haven't seen gameplay of him yet, so maybe he's DRASTICALLY different, but still I ask, why?

Still, I can live with one new clone if it means that the rest of the roster is this awesome. And don't kid yourself, this is the best Smash roster to date. Pretty much every character I could possibly want is here, and the Miis will help fill in a few gaps.

We finally get the legendary veteran gaming quad-fecta of Mario, Sonic, Pac-Man, and Megaman. My main, Mr Game and Watch is back. Rosalina. Villager. Wii Fit Trainer. Little Freaking Mac (about damn time). Plenty of great newcomers, and almost all of the really important guys return.

Loss of Ice Climbers is regrettable. Lack of Mewtwo is unfortunate. Personally, I never really cared about Lucas or Wolf. And don't get me started on my lack of caring about Ridley. But I feel like what we've gained MORE than makes up for anything we've lost.

All I can hope at this point is that the online isn't cold shit like the last game. Some playable 4-player matches wouldn't hurt.

Stats ^1:

Neronium:

1.) Why the hell does Ganondorf still not have a unique moveset!? Seriously, Sakurai, it's been 3 games now since his introduction to Smash Bros, and one of the most iconic villains in video games is still a clone? Ever gonna have him use those swords that he's used in the past? Seriously, if anyone deserves his own moveset, it's Ganondorf.

2.) Why the hell are Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario not just alternate costumes? I get that Dr. Mario has the old Mario's moveset, but that's not justification at all for it. You gave Wario, Villager, Wii Fit Trainer, and Robin alternates that were more work that just putting the Dark Pitt and Dr. Mario costumes over the characters. Hell, even Project M did that for Dr. Mario. If you really wanted more Kid Icarus characters Sakurai, then you could have put in Hades or something. My main point is, I thought we were past the whole clone crap.

Ganondorf is Sakurai's favorite character and also his main. I don't think he really WANTS to change his favorite, but at the same time, Falcon has been the same in 4 games, so he can't change him either.

One thing he could have done as a work around to keep most people happy is give Ganondorf his own moveset, but also give his old move set to a new character. For example, they could have easily added Black Shadow from F-Zero in to smash and had him take over said move set. Sakurai gets to keep a character that plays exactly like Ganondorf, we get a new character (from F-Zero no less, even if it is a clone.) and lastly Ganondorf finally gets his own move set. I think this is a win all around.

Sadly this didn't happen which is a shame.

Mr.Mattress:

Zepherus14:
Now, who else thinks that the final smash for Duck Hunt Dog will be essentially his game but shooting the other players?

From what I read (on VGChartz) His Final Smash is a Group of Ducks flying Up in a V Pattern, followed by a bunch of Wild Gunmen (From the NES Shooter Wild Gunman), shooting whoever remains on the ground.

And from Gameplay I watched on Youtube, Duck Hunt Dog pretty much has a bunch of shout outs to NES Shooters that used the Zapper (Makes sense, since he was the first game)...

he's actually pretty dangerous

Sooo...DHD...does he have a name or does the game actually refer to him as Duck Hunt Dog?

I wasn't excited about Bowser Jr. but the fact that he's basically Bowser Jr. AND all the Koopalings is actually pretty cool.

Dark Pit...yeah, he should've just been an alt form. I just can't imagine his move set is unique enough to warrant him being his own character. Maybe it is, but even if that were the case I just can't see that as a smart choice.

Mr. Game and Watch. Super excited he's back. He's been one of my favorites since Melee, and since Mewtwo is apparently never coming back, he's my longest running playable character.

Honestly though, Little Mac is still the character I'm most excited for. Punch Out is one of my favorite Nintendo franchises.

But DHD seems like he'll be a lot of fun. I can't wait to check him out for myself.

I will admit that this is interesting, although I am still depressed about the lack of Solid Snake but...guess he was a one shot character for this franchise.

Still, Doctor Mario's Final Smash looks really mean...

Hoping for Mew two as dlc at least..

duck hunt dog is a nice surprise

Randomosity:

One thing he could have done as a work around to keep most people happy is give Ganondorf his own moveset, but also give his old move set to a new character. For example, they could have easily added Black Shadow from F-Zero in to smash and had him take over said move set. Sakurai gets to keep a character that plays exactly like Ganondorf, we get a new character (from F-Zero no less, even if it is a clone.) and lastly Ganondorf finally gets his own move set. I think this is a win all around.

Sadly this didn't happen which is a shame.

But then at the same time, he could also just add Black Shadow with a new moveset, which would be 10x less confusing to everyone playing Ganondorf.

EyeReaper:

Kitsune Hunter:

EyeReaper:
Ugh. I dislike how much representation Kid Icarus gets. Blatant Nepotism from Sakurai I say

However those Koopalings look fucking tops. I think I know who I'm maining from the looks of it. Roy's our Boy.

If Sakurai was being nepotistic, don't you think Kirby would have gotten more representation than Kid Icarus, well?

OT: Well those are some....interesting choices for characters, curious to see what Dog Hunt Dog does though. Glad Ganondorf is confirmed and after seeing Palutena, I knew Black Pit was confirmed, but I hope he has a different move set. Only 3 more weeks, I can make it.

Ehh, Kirby's high time was brawl. King Dedede was the Big Hero of the story mode, and who was widely considered the most overpowered and toppest of tier characters? Meta Knight. Aka a KIRBY CHARACTER!

Case closed Watson.

But seriously, In this new game, Kid Icarus has three characters, like five items, a couple stages, and (if the smash wiki is correct) two Assist Trophies. That's more than the Metroid, Star Fox, or Donkey Kong (If you count him separate from the Mario series).
That's injustice if you ask me.

Seriously? Kirby gets 3 characters from his series in Brawl and somehow that makes Sakurai nepotistic and over represented?

I could very much make the same criticism about Mario characters(6 in Brawl) and Pokémon (6 if you count that PT allows you plays as 3 Pokémon). In terms of the other series, Star Fox got the same amount of characters as Kirby and new stages as well. Zelda has got more representation as of now, since Zelda and sheik are now there own characters which now makes 5 characters for Zelda. Also didn't Meta Knight get nerfed awhile back? In terms of the story mode, "Oh no, Dedede saved some of the characters, OVERREPRESENTATION!", But seriously, I can make the same claim that Sakurai is a Sega fanboy for letting Sonic come out of nowhere and stopping an attack that all the Nintendo characters couldn't. See how ridiculous that sounds, so is your claim about Dedede in the story mode and I really doubt the other players cared about it. Your claim that Sakurai over represents his own series doesn't hold much ground, you're complaining about a problem that doesn't exist.

Plus, Kid Icarus gets 2 extra characters, SO? Kid Icarus only has two games, what's wrong with giving it more representation. Sakurai made the game, despite the fact he never planned to make another Smash Bros. he can add whoever he wants.

Fasckira:
Duck Hunt Dog, brilliant stuff. I wouldn't mind seeing another Duck Hunt game, get a new Zapper and have it up on the big screen!

I've always wanted to kill that dog.... This is finally the opportunity.

Neronium:
1.) Why the hell does Ganondorf still not have a unique moveset!? Seriously, Sakurai, it's been 3 games now since his introduction to Smash Bros...

And there's your answer. How many people would complain if people suddenly made Ken fight vastly different than Ryu in Street Fighter IV?

I'm wondering if 100% of the characters have been unlocked yet.

Brawl had characters like Wolf who were unlocked by going through specific doors after completing the game.

Melee had characters like Mewtwo who were unlocked by playing twenty hours of vs mode, or luigi, who was obtained by completing the first stage of adventure mode with the time ending in '2', and then by beating luigi and peach in under a minute.

Surely such obscure unlock methods couldn't have been discovered so quickly.

EyeReaper:

Kitsune Hunter:

EyeReaper:
Ugh. I dislike how much representation Kid Icarus gets. Blatant Nepotism from Sakurai I say

However those Koopalings look fucking tops. I think I know who I'm maining from the looks of it. Roy's our Boy.

If Sakurai was being nepotistic, don't you think Kirby would have gotten more representation than Kid Icarus, well?

OT: Well those are some....interesting choices for characters, curious to see what Dog Hunt Dog does though. Glad Ganondorf is confirmed and after seeing Palutena, I knew Black Pit was confirmed, but I hope he has a different move set. Only 3 more weeks, I can make it.

Ehh, Kirby's high time was brawl. King Dedede was the Big Hero of the story mode, and who was widely considered the most overpowered and toppest of tier characters? Meta Knight. Aka a KIRBY CHARACTER!

Case closed Watson.

But seriously, In this new game, Kid Icarus has three characters, like five items, a couple stages, and (if the smash wiki is correct) two Assist Trophies. That's more than the Metroid, Star Fox, or Donkey Kong (If you count him separate from the Mario series).
That's injustice if you ask me.

You realize that Sakurai is renown in the gaming industry for being humble about his own franchises, right? He nerfed Kirby drastically and excluded Dedede and Meta Knight from Melee to avoid these kinds of accusations.

The only arguably under represented game is Metroid, but it hasn't exactly been relevant the last few years, and it isn't exactly known as being historically iconic.

Why is Doctor Mario not a skin, instead of an actual character slot? That confuses me. EDIT: It seems he has the melee move set, so he's a little bit different, never mind.

TKretts3:
Andway, it's the 4th game in the series and Samus is STILL the only character from the Metroid franchise to be in Smash Bros? Seriously, fans have been begging for a shrunken down Ridley, or Galactic Federation Marines, the Bounty Hunters from Prime: Hunters, the bounty hunters from Prime 3: Corruption, a Chozo, or just any other Metroid character. But no, all we get is Samus split into two characters, and four characters from Fire Emblem. Way to treat one of your founding franchises. I'm going to go cry in the corner now. Q_Q

I know right? It's not like Ridley is the only candidate (if they can up size Olimar and downsize Bowser then Ridley could be in there too.) when they have a tonne of bosses and other characters to choose from, like Rundas for example, he'd be unique.

I get the impression Nintendo doesn't care much for Metroid anymore.

Nooners:
I just want another Sonic the Hedgehog character, please. Tails, Knuckles, Dr. Robotnik, I'll even settle for Amy or Shadow. Is that really too much to ask for?

Sonic is lucky to be in these games, you get another when Metroid gets at least one character more other than Samus.

Stats ^1:
The only arguably under represented game is Metroid, but it hasn't exactly been relevant the last few years, and it isn't exactly known as being historically iconic.

Metroid has had games on the Wii and is quite arguably iconic, seeing as how she was one of gaming's first female protagonists and a lot of people know it as a major Nintendo franchise. One could argue Starfox hasn't been relevant for a long time, since it hasn't had a proper release since the GameCube. When people think of Nintendo, the main franchises that come to mind are Mario, Zelda and Metroid, and this was after me asking a dozen friend of mine currently online.

Duck hunt dog?....

I've been planning my vengeance for a while now....and now...I only have to wait a few months...

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