StarCraft 2 Tournament Boots Player for Rape Comment

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Good.

What a idiotic comment for someone to make.

roseofbattle:
Hayda's comment is just one example of how the eSports community pushes women away.

No. If you had said that things like this is one of the reasons women feel pushed away from the e-sports community, you would be right as that is a factual statement. By saying that the e-sports community pushes away women, you've just called me and millions of others who had nothing to do with this sexist assholes. Blanket statements like that has to be kept out of any article ever, because they are literally always wrong when referring to a large group of people.

8BitArchitect:
Framing this as "Just another way the eSports community pushes women away" is stupid editorializing. His behavior was unprofessional and caddish, but making a bigger deal out of it because it was in reference to a woman is simply another form of sexism.

You're right, it seems kinda sexist to me too that people report this shit everytime it happens while any heavy trash talk between male professionals gets ignored. Because it implies that we women should be treated differently. That insults me as a woman who wants equality. Can't we just agree that we shouldn't be dicks to each other (especially in a professional context), no matter the gender, and leave it as that?

Nope! Better write an article about eSports/Starcraft-drama that the actual community already moved on from... that involved two lesser known and (no offense) not very successfull players... for a website not really related to that. Just because a man was mean to a woman.

Le sigh.

I am 100% sure that guy wouldn't have been banned if he had tweeted the exact same thing against a male player. A few people may have said "well that's immature" but it would've been shrugged off.

Mihaylo's biggest mistake here was not realizing he was playing against a female and anything he said/did would have 10x bigger consequences. Also I'm pretty sure people were looking to make an example out of someone.

All I can thing is

Great day one she an outcast and people will use this to show women will come in and mess it up. So more of the male only competition will close tighter. Hate to say it this does not fix the problem it makes it worst. Maybe if she shot back about him or something showed she one of the gang not an outsider forced in for PC reasons more women would be welcome in the future. Now other will see this as a women who got special treatment.

8BitArchitect:
Framing this as "Just another way the eSports community pushes women away" is stupid editorializing. His behavior was unprofessional and caddish, but making a bigger deal out of it because it was in reference to a woman is simply another form of sexism.

In short.. it wasn't sexist or misogynist... he was just an asshole being an asshole.. No need to elevate his status.

Reading it I see it as.. yeah, bullshit behaviour and while I will agree that ina match such things are perfectly acceptable (psychology is a biiiig part of competitive sports and psychological manipulation of your opponent is a valid tactic in any sport, from chess to boxing it is done.. In various ways but it is done., this was just being an asshole.

Ladies though, if you're ever the target of this sort of comment here are two nice comebacks to reverse the psychological warfare.

1. "You need a dick for that"
2. "Bring it on Ken-Doll"

Trust me if you can whip that off with either dead pan tone or with a slight giggle the damage to the male psyche goes from a free attack to an outright Critical hit with Armor Piercing. He'll either shut up or be screaming. The latter scenario is a good time to deploy the mute button.

Fine, I'll be the one to say it.

Trash talk is okay. Rape in the context of competitive gaming means defeat by a huge margin. It's obviously not a threat.

If it were up to me, I'd allow this kind of talk, even against a woman. Freedom of speech to trump over quickly wounded egos.
The consequence of being an asshole should be that people will think and say you're an asshole and that knowledge can only benefit people. Everybody wins and everybody grows a thicker skin as an added bonus.

The only real mistake the guy made is that he should have known he was playing in a nanny environment.

roseofbattle:
Hayda's comment is just one example of how the eSports community pushes women away.

This story is actually just another example of how people put meaning into words that aren't there.
It's wholly subjective how offensive this comment is and how people react to this banter being in a professional setting, but if there was ever one where you very well knew that it was nothing more than banter, it would be esports.

Saying that women can't stand up to this kind of offensive language is a disservice to them, it's not helpful.

I'm very dissapointed, that after months of #GamerGate we still see these kind of opinionated articles.
Here's a tip to avoid this pitfall; Genderflip it. If a woman said something equally stupid, would there be this big an uproar over it?

I doubt it and there would certainly be a lot more people there to defend this harmless bit of stupidity.
In that case, you know that you're pandering to the PC crowd and not being very professional about writing an article.

Absolutely dissapointing.

Think it was the right thing to kick him out. Professionalism is a part of sports and if you can't keep up that part you don't belong in professional sports.

But like others said I do disagree that it's never okay to joke about rape.

It's a bit more subtle than that.

Making jokes is hard.
Making jokes to a large audience exponentially so.
Making jokes about heavy subjects exponentially so again.

So when making jokes about a subject like rape you better make sure that:
1. The size of your audience can be counted on a single hand and only includes people whom you know extremely well.
2. You're a world-renowned comedian who's an absolute master at setting up the right context and reading his/her audience.

Phasmal:
Honestly, I'm glad that he was disqualified. It shows we're still working to make eSports better, and that people are willing to take action to do so.

I'm not sure what kind of person thinks that this sort of thing is okay. It's stupid and it makes us all look bad. It certainly doesn't help anything.

But I'm going to leave before all the angry people show up and say it's wrong to punish people for doing things.

With respect I get the impression from the quote that he means rape in the gaming sense "I'm going to kick their ass" rather than the sexual version. I may be wrong but I wonder if this was a case of someone not expecting to have to tip toe around phrases he would normally use on other players just because she's a girl.

Smilomaniac:

This story is actually just another example of how people put meaning into words that aren't there.
It's wholly subjective how offensive this comment is and how people react to this banter being in a professional setting, but if there was ever one where you very well knew that it was nothing more than banter, it would be esports.

Saying that women can't stand up to this kind of offensive language is a disservice to them, it's not helpful.

I'm very dissapointed, that after months of #GamerGate we still see these kind of opinionated articles.
Here's a tip to avoid this pitfall; Genderflip it. If a woman said something equally stupid, would there be this big an uproar over it?

I doubt it and there would certainly be a lot more people there to defend this harmless bit of stupidity.
In that case, you know that you're pandering to the PC crowd and not being very professional about writing an article.

Absolutely dissapointing.

I'm glad I'm not the only one to see it that way.

Towards the whole "if he said it to a guy it would've been cool" aspect. This is something you don't say to a woman(much less tweet about it) unless you know her very and know shes cool with it, thats just common fucking sense. This is like making a holocaust joke infront of a random jewish dude, yeah some might be cool with it but this is just some shit you don't do.

I realy wonder how fucking alienated from normal human interaction this guy must be to think this behavior is cool.

Well, this has already been covered, but I'll sum it up again:

1. Joking about stuff like rape isn't necessarily taboo, but that doesn't mean you can be flippant and careless. I mean, lots of people apparently use the word "rape" to mean "quickly ROFLstomp", but it's not a word I use casually.

2. This wasn't "just" trashtalk. The idiot paused a competitive game with the person he was referring to so he could post the comment on Twitter, and even used the hashtag of the event he was in. Even if he used a different choice of words or posted something that wasn't even trashtalk... or yes, if his opponent wasn't a woman... that's very unprofessional behavior, and really not acceptable.

Anyway, it's a little thing, but I'd much rather people scrambling for an excuse would say "I didn't mean literally" rather than "It was a joke", as if they were trying to be funny.

Kas shouldn't have used that word. He's in the position of having a public persona, and we're very ready to burn these public personas in effigy for using words that we don't like. He should have known this. And the tournament was right to issue a disqualification because that seems to accord with the repressive public mood.

However, that doesn't make any of this not trivial bullshit. It is obvious what Kas meant in context to the people he was actually addressing: he was going to win very convincingly his matches. It's a metaphor, just like 'kill', 'murder', 'destroy', and so on. Kas is not some horrible person. This does not constitute evidence of him being any kind of misogynist. To reach that interpretation, we have to construct from very slim pickings. We use over-the-top hyperbolic metaphors to describe things: rape just happens to be a sexual one. And it is more than a little strange that it is the sexual rather than the violent aspect of it that seems to distinguish it from other uses of language.

On the one hand, that's pretty unprofessional behavior, especially in pausing the match to post the tweet.

On the other hand, this thread devolved into a glorious double-standard brouhaha virtually instantaneously.

As others have said:

"Rape" in the context of a game is standardized vernacular and doesn't magically change meaning because one competitor has lady bits.

If it had been about a male player, no one would have uttered a word.

Y'know, it's funny. A lot of people here are saying "if this was said about a male competitor, nobody would care"... and then instead of finishing "...and that's wrong too", they say "...so nobody should care about her either".

Imagine if a linebacker said that during an interview; he'd be lucky to have a career afterwards. eSports seems to want the same level of attention and respect as traditional sports, but it's not going to get there if its participants still hide behind the "boys will be boys" rationale. Part of being "professional" means "acting like an adult".

Oh, come on, Starcraft fans... You had one job, ONE JOB! 'Do not make rape comments', and you blew it!

Hang your heads in shame.

FalloutJack:
Oh, come on, Starcraft fans... You had one job, ONE JOB! 'Do not make rape comments', and you blew it!

Hang your heads in shame.

I could be wrong, but last time I checked the "one job" of Starcraft fans/players was to...you know...play Starcraft.

Aaron Sylvester:

FalloutJack:
Oh, come on, Starcraft fans... You had one job, ONE JOB! 'Do not make rape comments', and you blew it!

Hang your heads in shame.

I could be wrong, but last time I checked the "one job" of Starcraft fans/players was to...you know...play Starcraft.

No no no! That's recreation.

(Also, I am sort of taking the piss out of things a bit.)

EDIT: Actually, in Korea, SC is a way of life, isn't it?

FalloutJack:
(Also, I am sort of taking the piss out of things a bit.)

EDIT: Actually, in Korea, SC is a way of life, isn't it?

Indeed :P

As I said earlier, the only mistake (and a very stupid mistake at that) this guy did was make such a comment against a FEMALE player.

Publicly talking that way to female players in these times is just asking to get made an example out of.

I'm one of those people that never takes anything on the Internet seriously nor do I take anything a competitor says seriously, but that was just an outright retarded thing to do. He took the time to pause the game to post a tweet (first clue this kid isn't the brightest) and then proceeded to act like the typical 12-year old Halo screamer to his opponent? Not only is he a childish moron, he is a poor sport at that. I rarely take rape/sexism/racist/bigot/etc. jokes seriously, but he should have been banned from future tournaments for that type of shit.

If you want to act like a kid in middle school, you shouldn't be allowed to participate in a professional atmosphere.

When I played competitive L4D2 and TF2, this type of behavior would have been an immediate ejection from the team as well as permanent ban from future tournaments. If anyone remembers the TLR fiasco (TF2 player stole his own team's trophy and refused to give it back once caught), he was removed from the following year's tournament due to his actions and he just broke into his team captain's room and stole his own trophy.

Areloch:
"Rape" in the context of a game is standardized vernacular and doesn't magically change meaning because one competitor has lady bits.

Well for all practical purposes it DOES change meaning. This event proved beyond a doubt that certain words DO change meaning when used against female players.

Right now "sexism" is all about context and entirely depends on the genders of the victim/offender.

Aaron Sylvester:

FalloutJack:
(Also, I am sort of taking the piss out of things a bit.)

EDIT: Actually, in Korea, SC is a way of life, isn't it?

Indeed :P

As I said earlier, the only mistake (and a very stupid mistake at that) this guy did was make such a comment against a FEMALE player.

Publicly talking that way to female players in these times is just asking to get made an example out of.

Nah, I say punish 'em for talking rape to men too. Men don't wanna be raped anymore than women do! (It's just plain wrong, yo.)

Dragonlayer:
Between this, that Labour politician in the UK losing her job and really, just about everything ever said by anyone ever involved in or opposed to GamerGate, it continues to boggle my mind as to how incredibly stupid people are in regard to making statements on social media. It will be found, it will be saved and it will come back to bite you in the arse!

This, thisthisthisthis. After everyone's favorite hashtag movement revealed how in bed games media is with Tumblresque social justice* scene I'm surprised people will be this loose-lipped with comments like that.

Unrelated: This is why I started using the word "suplex" as a verb more.

Unrelatedx2: It'd be lovely if Escapist news people at least pretended to separate what they copy from other sites with their opinions. Maybe have a divider line between dedicated paragraphs or something.

*- Not saying that's a good/bad thing; its just true.

This raises a few questions.

Would it have been the same if he said:
"Gonna rape some girl in StarCraft 2 soon"
"Gonna kill some girl soon"
"Gonna kill some girl in StarCraft 2 soon"

Or if it was a male opponent:
"Gonna rape some guy soon"
"Gonna rape some guy in StarCraft 2 soon"
"Gonna kill some guy soon"

This also begs the question, would the even organisers have DQ'd him if he she took it as shitty trash talk? And would the answer to this change if it was a guy?

Not that I'm saying they did the wrong thing (I'm on the fence on this issue), I'm just curious how this scenarios would have played out with some slight changes.

Not really sure anything was fair here. Trash talk has always been around and in all competitions. Makes me wonder if Hayda was actually showing true equality.

The only thing I'm sure of is there are many looking out to demonise people they disagree with. Just look at the fucking ESA comet thread.

Aaron Sylvester:

Areloch:
"Rape" in the context of a game is standardized vernacular and doesn't magically change meaning because one competitor has lady bits.

Well for all practical purposes it DOES change meaning. This event proved beyond a doubt that certain words DO change meaning when used against female players.

Right now "sexism" is all about context and entirely depends on the genders of the victim/offender.

Well, I guess all my female gamer friends must have not been invited to that meeting, because they use "Rape" in the same manner at least as much as I or the next gamer does.

Honestly, this is probably another case of "you only hear about it because someone actually complained", and Internet 'journalism' ran with it for the drama.

They better lay the banhammer down equally on this one, or they're stirring up a bigger shitstorm than if they'd done nothing.

I've had a problem with the way the gaming community uses the word 'rape' for quite some time. I used to use it myself, until I thought about what the word actually means, the actions it describes. Rape isn't something I'd wish upon my worst enemy. Yeah, I get it, you don't actually mean rape, but it's pretty insulting to those that have been victims of one of the most appalling acts humans can do to one another, and how does it reflect upon you that you're okay describing yourself as a rapist?

I don't know if a DQ was fair punishment, but it sure as hell better be the punishment the next person to pull a stunt like this receives, regardless of the gender of the trash-talker or the opponent. Especially if e-sports are trying to gain some actual legitimacy.

veloper:
Fine, I'll be the one to say it.

Trash talk is okay. Rape in the context of competitive gaming means defeat by a huge margin. It's obviously not a threat.

If it were up to me, I'd allow this kind of talk, even against a woman. Freedom of speech to trump over quickly wounded egos.
The consequence of being an asshole should be that people will think and say you're an asshole and that knowledge can only benefit people. Everybody wins and everybody grows a thicker skin as an added bonus.

The only real mistake the guy made is that he should have known he was playing in a nanny environment.

I disagree. Trash talk is not ok, at least not in this environment. If you want to trash talk friends, that's one thing, but this is not a casual situation. Professionalism and sportsmanship should mean something to a professional sport, and this kind of behavior demeans the players and the sport itself. That's especially important in a sport that desperately trying to gain legitimacy outside its own community. And double-standard or not, this is a step in the right direction. Trying to argue that what this guy said is perfectly acceptable because that's "what everybody does" is not.

And free speech has nothing to do with this. The tournament is a private event. If the hosts want to deny this kind of rhetoric, they have every right to.

Good, I am happy to see this idiot was punished for making such a stupid comment. I think pausing a game for any reason should be a DQ offense too.

The Rogue Wolf:
Y'know, it's funny. A lot of people here are saying "if this was said about a male competitor, nobody would care"... and then instead of finishing "...and that's wrong too", they say "...so nobody should care about her either".

For once I'm glad someone beat me to what I wanted to say, restores a few faith points in the humanity bar.

I agree with the decision to disqualify Kas, but doing it, 'because she's a girl,' shows that they aren't addressing the problem, merely pandering to public opinion. At the same time, those pointing out the problem, that this reaction only happened because the victim happened to be female, and saying that she should have just taken it in stride, are entirely missing the reason that this is a problem.

Men deal with this kind of behaviour every day, and if any of them say anything about it, we're told to "man up," and "stop being a pussy." So instead of fixing the problem, we reinforce that it is acceptable and encouraged, because the only people who are told off are the ones who have a problem with it. We teach people that belittling others, threatening them, and being an all around bully is a perfectly acceptable way to live their life, and then we wonder why they're surprised when something like Kas' situation happens to them.

Unprofessional and incredibly stupid comment, but it's definitely not something to be disqualified over. Trash talk is just that, trash talk. It's unsportsmanlike and makes you seem like an ass at times, but it's not something that is so bad that it must be worthy of disqualification from that alone.

BoogieManFL:
If he said "Gonna go rape some dude" this would not be news worthy and no one would have cared.

Think about that for a minute.

If his opponent was some dude, he wouldn't have felt the need to point-out the gender of his opponent.

Think about that for a minute.

well it was certainly tasteless

First Lastname:
Unprofessional and incredibly stupid comment, but it's definitely not something to be disqualified over. Trash talk is just that, trash talk. It's unsportsmanlike and makes you seem like an ass at times, but it's not something that is so bad that it must be worthy of disqualification from that alone.

But can't you see it's the reason for the lack of females in eSports?

Aaron Sylvester:

First Lastname:
Unprofessional and incredibly stupid comment, but it's definitely not something to be disqualified over. Trash talk is just that, trash talk. It's unsportsmanlike and makes you seem like an ass at times, but it's not something that is so bad that it must be worthy of disqualification from that alone.

But can't you see it's the reason for the lack of females in eSports?

Hello, this a PSA. Did you know over 10000 people are flamed every month because they didn't use a sarcasm tag. Aaron here is in serious danger of his words being taken at face value and a shower of hate thrown on him. Be responsible on the internet people; use sarcasm tags.

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