DmC: Devil May Cry Definitive Edition Coming to PS4, Xbox One

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Okay, so...question to DMC fans (You know who you are.): What exactly IS Vergil's status if he keeps getting playable (which is awesome)? He alive or what? Did Nelo explode and he reform? I'm a confused sort of guy on that account.

FalloutJack:
Okay, so...question to DMC fans (You know who you are.): What exactly IS Vergil's status if he keeps getting playable (which is awesome)? He alive or what? Did Nelo explode and he reform? I'm a confused sort of guy on that account.

Honestly? It's probably non-canon. They had Trish playable in DMC 2 and that didn't happen. DMC is famous for having non-canon modes where you play a different character.

xaszatm:

FalloutJack:
Okay, so...question to DMC fans (You know who you are.): What exactly IS Vergil's status if he keeps getting playable (which is awesome)? He alive or what? Did Nelo explode and he reform? I'm a confused sort of guy on that account.

Honestly? It's probably non-canon. They had Trish playable in DMC 2 and that didn't happen. DMC is famous for having non-canon modes where you play a different character.

That's different. The whole game is non-canon. It's just that Vergil is {A} a popular character and {B} his defeat was ambiguous enough to make one wonder. What does Word of God say?

FalloutJack:

xaszatm:

FalloutJack:
Okay, so...question to DMC fans (You know who you are.): What exactly IS Vergil's status if he keeps getting playable (which is awesome)? He alive or what? Did Nelo explode and he reform? I'm a confused sort of guy on that account.

Honestly? It's probably non-canon. They had Trish playable in DMC 2 and that didn't happen. DMC is famous for having non-canon modes where you play a different character.

That's different. The whole game is non-canon. It's just that Vergil is {A} a popular character and {B} his defeat was ambiguous enough to make one wonder. What does Word of God say?

He was ambiguous just for these conversations. That being said, I will think that this is non-canon until proven otherwise. It is a bonus mode in a special edition after all.

ShakerSilver:
This is obviously Capcom's way of asking fans which direction they want the series to continue. After DmC flopped commercially (despite pushing ~1.6 million units), they're giving it another chance. Either that or they're just squeezing every last drop of money they can from the game. It would have been better if Capcom had remade DMC3 instead of 4, considering that 4 is quite controversial itself - albeit not as much as DmC.

Probably because Capcom, atm, is not doing well at all financially. Street Fighter 5 only exists because they had to crawl to Sony for money, marketing, and of course it's the reason behind it's exclusivity to the PS4. So in a way it's great if not iffy move on their part (DmC and Ninja Theory had a part in landing them on thin ice, so this is basically the last straw that breaks the camels back): Making some money on the side (most likely in DMC4: SE's favor...), while seeing which DMC will go on as the staple direction...... again, DmC is doomed, when you consider how much 3 added in it's Special Edition, it's only fair to assume 4:SE WILL come out the better Devil May Cry game.

xaszatm:

it's not so much DMC4 is the greatest game rather than "I CAN PLAY AS VIRGIL" and "it's better the DmC" that's being expressed here.

No, DMC 4 was fine; in fact, it's even better than DMC3 because it had a far less annoying difficulty curve and the ability to switch styles as well as having two protagonists right off the bat was way to switch up gameplay. Having to refight the bosses was nothing new for the series; heck, how many times in DMC1 did the player fight Phantom, Griffon, and Nightmare? At least in DMC4 the context is different with playing as Dante who has a radically different style and then a powered up Nero so you can take petty vengeance on the ones who annoyed you. It's still the best hack and slash to this day (yeah, even better than Bayonetta 2 and Ninja Gaiden 2); I still haven't seen anyone top it in terms of depth or accessibility.

^ Everyone getting overexcited to play as Vergil in DMC4 yet forgets this is CAPCOM we're talking about.

They'll probably just replace the Nero model with Vergil for his parts of the campaign and have a FEW new animations for his attacks and done.

I really dought they will take the time to make a whole new campaign with Vergil in it and even have less faith as how he will fit in the story chronologically.

So Capcom is basing its choice on which way to go with Devil May Cry based on which game sells better? Interesting.

While I'll continue to defend DmC to my dying breath as a good game, I wouldn't mind if it loses this battle of sales. It was a great Ninja Theory game, but a shit DmC game (the bit in Mundus' office and the boss fight immediately after make me feel dead inside)

On the other hand, I'm all for a new in-house incarnation of the series, seeing as Bayonetta 2 was Wii-U exclusive...maybe Platinum games will be willing to make it...hintedy hint hint.

Adam Jensen:

Kenbo Slice:
The new DMC actually isn't that bad. If only DMC fanboys will actually give it a chance.

Chance given. The writing is worse than writing in porn. Not that Devil May Cry ever had brilliant dialogue, but what Ninja Theory did is mind numbingly abysmal. And that's just the writing. I'm not even going to get into gameplay and how dumbed down it is compared to DMC 1, 3 and 4.

Just to add my 5 cents:

Dialogue between brothers in Devil May Cry 3:
Vergil: ...You show up.

Dante: You sure know how to throw a party. No food, no drinks, and the
only babe just left.

Vergil: My sincerest apology, brother. I was so eager to see you and
couldn't concentrate on the preparation of the bash.

Dante: Whatever. At any rate, it has been a whole year since we last met.
How about a kiss from your little brother?
Or better yet, how about a kiss from this?
So, this is what they call a heart warming family reunion huh...

Vergil: You got that right.

Dialogue between brothers in DMC:
-I am stronger
-I am smarter
-I have a bigger dick.

So "nice"

JagermanXcell:
So the REAL news is that DMC4 is finally getting a Special Edition akin to 3, Vergil might be playable (all the MOTIVATION I need), the game might be built back up to give Dante a decent campaign/ cut Nero's end game padding, and the sales will be so good for 4HD and not DmC HD, that Ninja Theory will die trying to make their gritty child artificially challenging, to where DMC5 featuring Dante from the Devil May Cry series Directed by not Tameem MIGHT be a future possibility...

Yes, yes, and yes please.

Seeing as DmC never even reached close to half of the sales total for Devil May Cry 4 I don't see why they needed a reason to bring it back.

Mister K:

Just to add my 5 cents:

Dialogue between brothers in Devil May Cry 3:
Vergil: ...You show up.

Dante: You sure know how to throw a party. No food, no drinks, and the
only babe just left.

Vergil: My sincerest apology, brother. I was so eager to see you and
couldn't concentrate on the preparation of the bash.

Dante: Whatever. At any rate, it has been a whole year since we last met.
How about a kiss from your little brother?
Or better yet, how about a kiss from this?
So, this is what they call a heart warming family reunion huh...

Vergil: You got that right.

Dialogue between brothers in DMC:
-I am stronger
-I am smarter
-I have a bigger dick.

So "nice"

And let's not forget the infamous sniper rifle abortion scene. Seriously, why the HELL did game journalists not rail against that? It was completely tasteless (and bordering on misogynistic). The worst DMC 1-4 went was some fanservice and Nero saying "bullshit." And how many times does Donte throw out swear words with no rhyme or reason? It's amazing at how that game's writing fails on every level.

I seem to be in the minority, because I really liked the new DmC, at least, I liked it more than 80% of all things Dante did before... but I still think this is mostly unnecessary. The game is fairly new, and it only had one noteworthy DLC, all of which can be found in the PC bundle. How is this a "definitive version"?

Whilst I hate DmC's aesthetics, characters and story too much to go through it all again, I can applaud Ninja Theory for listening to the fans and implementing the changes accordingly. After how much shit we went through before release (I'm making it a point not to read this thread, I just know something will set me off) they're actually changing their "vision" to suit us who want a decent challenge. Serious kudos to them for that.

Now, that said: If Vergil is playable in DMC4:SE, I will lose my shit.

FalloutJack:
Okay, so...question to DMC fans (You know who you are.): What exactly IS Vergil's status if he keeps getting playable (which is awesome)? He alive or what? Did Nelo explode and he reform? I'm a confused sort of guy on that account.

Easily explained by him using a Gold orb when he last fought Dante.

EDIT: Dammit, I said I wouldn't, but I did read the thread.

Kenbo Slice:
The new DMC actually isn't that bad. If only DMC fanboys will actually give it a chance.

You'll find that most of the people who actually bought and played DmC ARE actually those who played the previous Devil May Cry's, and that they probably played it far more extensively than other people. And most of them found it to be short of the mark by a wide margin. The changes implemented in this version is good news for DMC fans who weren't impressed by the vanilla game, good news for the devs for getting a second chance with the game, good news for those who never played it last gen (judging by the sales data, a lot of people) and good news for DMC fans who don't give a shit, because they have DMC4:SE coming out.

AgentLampshade:
Whilst I hate DmC's aesthetics, characters and story too much to go through it all again, I can applaud Ninja Theory for listening to the fans and implementing the changes accordingly. After how much shit we went through before release (I'm making it a point not to read this thread, I just know something will set me off) they're actually changing their "vision" to suit us who want a decent challenge. Serious kudos to them for that.

Now, that said: If Vergil is playable in DMC4:SE, I will lose my shit.

Although, let's be realistic here: it was not NT who listened, it was CAPCOM. NT has NEVER listened to anyone when it comes to their games, they just bitched and moaned, convinced that everyone was out to get them. It's why from Heavenly Sword to their attempted DMC reboot they improved in NO category and even regressed in a few. They were probably FORCED to fix the game by CAPCOM after the initial release was a pathetically amateur release. Them doing the things they should have done in the first place is NOT praiseworthy in the slightest but in fact a further indictment of their efforts at launch. And it probably won't make the game that much better anyway. The combat will STILL be shallow, the writing will STILL be shit, and the aesthetic will STILL be terrible.

Winnosh:

JagermanXcell:
So the REAL news is that DMC4 is finally getting a Special Edition akin to 3, Vergil might be playable (all the MOTIVATION I need), the game might be built back up to give Dante a decent campaign/ cut Nero's end game padding, and the sales will be so good for 4HD and not DmC HD, that Ninja Theory will die trying to make their gritty child artificially challenging, to where DMC5 featuring Dante from the Devil May Cry series Directed by not Tameem MIGHT be a future possibility...

Yes, yes, and yes please.

Seeing as DmC never even reached close to half of the sales total for Devil May Cry 4 I don't see why they needed a reason to bring it back.

It's most likely a last chance effort for the reboot and NT to make an impression on Capcom as a business partner... emphasis on last.

Baron_BJ:
Enslaved was actually good though, It also received little advertising before being unceremoniously booted out the door.

Yeah, Enslaved was more than good. It's on my list of flawed gems. I played it for the first time just recently and I loved it. But DmC is a bad game. It might have been good if it was a new IP. But it isn't, and therefore it has to be compared to its predecessors.

Aiddon:
Although, let's be realistic here: it was not NT who listened, it was CAPCOM. NT has NEVER listened to anyone when it comes to their games, they just bitched and moaned, convinced that everyone was out to get them. It's why from Heavenly Sword to their attempted DMC reboot they improved in NO category and even regressed in a few. They were probably FORCED to fix the game by CAPCOM after the initial release was a pathetically amateur release. Them doing the things they should have done in the first place is NOT praiseworthy in the slightest but in fact a further indictment of their efforts at launch. And it probably won't make the game that much better anyway. The combat will STILL be shallow, the writing will STILL be shit, and the aesthetic will STILL be terrible.

Yeah, I know the story and awful characters will remain, that's why I said I won't bother with it but I doubt Capcom forced them to fix anything. It's been established that NT needed help from Itsuno and Neo_G to make the game as good as it was, and Capcom has Itsuno working on the DMC4:SE, plus the fact Capcom basically disowned all their outsourcing projects a while back, I wouldn't be surprised if Ninja Theory asked Capcom if they could add all the things they're adding to this (though a few things were actually done by PC modders, wonder if they'll get any credits) and Capcom agreed, provided they throw in a DMC1 costume and other such things.

The vanilla game itself wasn't terrible. It was playable, even enjoyable in the same way God Of War is. A mindless action game that just happened to have a terrible story and terrible characters. Not nearly touching the calliber of it's big brothers and sister, but enough to do what it wanted to do. It just had the unfortunate luck of having "DMC" written above it and Capcoms ridiculous decision-making spearheading it.

Jesus, I never thought I'd be defending Ninja Theory and DmC. Just to be clear: I fucking hate what the fans of DMC went through before (and after) release that was due mainly to Ninja Theory talking shit and idiots attributing us disliking it because "hair." NT and Capcom have a damn long way to go to earn my forgiveness, but I won't pretend that DmC: Definitive Edition is not a good thing, regardless of the circumstances surrounding it.

Now, the REAL news here, is that DMC4:SE is going to rock my world! And given how much Capcom is promoting the classic DMC right now, makes me think a real DMC5 announcement is coming.

AgentLampshade:

The vanilla game itself wasn't terrible. It was playable, even enjoyable in the same way God Of War is. A mindless action game that just happened to have a terrible story and terrible characters. Not nearly touching the calliber of it's big brothers and sister, but enough to do what it wanted to do. It just had the unfortunate luck of having "DMC" written above it and Capcoms ridiculous decision-making spearheading it.

No, it sucked. There's no point in trying to be nice to it; the truth is not fair and the truth is that the game sucked. It wasn't interesting, it wasn't good, there was NOTHING about it that justified its existence. When it was released there were games older than it that were more worth playing. DMC 1, 3, and 4, Bayonetta, Ninja Gaiden 1 and 2, etc were far better examples of the hack and slash genre and stuff like Metal Gear Rising and Bayonetta 2 since the release have only reiterated how pointless NT's little half-baked experiment was. Taken on its own merits, the game is just BORING at best.

AgentLampshade:
Zoop

That makes an amusing kind of sense. I like it.

I'd like to point out that Ninja Theory was approached by Capcom to make DMC, and where told to take the series in a different direction on multiple occasions. They never entered into the fray with an attitude of "we can do this better". They where called up by a well known publisher to run an experiment on a series that at the time had been criticized for losing it's edge. I doubt they'd want to make a sequel given the poor sales and steady stream of negativity.

Aiddon:
No, it sucked. There's no point in trying to be nice to it; the truth is not fair and the truth is that the game sucked.

This is precisely why DMC fans get a bad reputation. Completely biased opinions that have no basis in reality. DmC actually did bring some interesting things to the table. Things like the Dreamrunner enemies, Ebony and Ivory's Ricochet move, a fully moveable camera in most environments, hell it was even the first game in the series to have a training room. The combat was barebones, easy and outright laughable compared to DMC, Ninja Gaiden and Bayonetta, but it's still a decent enough action game by western standards. You know you're actually knocking Itsuno and co.s inputs too?

Ultimately I even agree with you, there was nothing that justified it's existence other than Capcom being Capcom and not knowing what to do with one of their top 5 franchises. There was no reason for it to be made over DMC5 and I'm super pissed off that a) it was made, b) Ninja Theory came off as arrogant assholes during the entire course of development, c) Capcom seemingly didn't give a shit, d) it's only real legacy was to divide the fanbase and e through z) darkened the future of the series to the point we're having this irrelevant argument when we actually agree that it would have been better off an unfinished thought in Tameems head.

I played through the game, I didn't like it. I thought the gameplay was shallow compared to it's predecessors, I found the level design it gets praised so universally for to be nothing more than interesting window dressing[1], I found the music distracting, the characters despicable and the story juvenile and terribly written. Would I play it over God Of War? Absolutely.

[1] It would have been interesting if they played a part in Playstation All Stars, but I never played it, can anyone confirm if the DmC level shifting made it in?

AgentLampshade:

This is precisely why DMC fans get a bad reputation. Completely biased opinions that have no basis in reality. DmC actually did bring some interesting things to the table. Things like the Dreamrunner enemies, Ebony and Ivory's Ricochet move, a fully moveable camera in most environments, hell it was even the first game in the series to have a training room. The combat was barebones, easy and outright laughable compared to DMC, Ninja Gaiden and Bayonetta, but it's still a decent enough action game by western standards. You know you're actually knocking Itsuno and co.s inputs too?

...Huh? Like I said, the truth is the truth and the truth isn't fair. From a pure, objective standpoint, the game is CRUD. Taken on its own merits, it's worthless. It's just a plain bad game with nothing to bring to the table. The Dreamrunners were nothing new for the hack and slash genre, the ricochet is just ripping off of the Nightmare Beta's ability to screw with enemies or even the Spiral's unique Gunslinger attacks from 3. And training rooms are also nothing new as Bayonetta had that. It's not a "decent enough action game by western standards", it's just another boring, bad game. There is no point to try and be nice to it out of some illusion of "being fair' because the game doesn't deserve fair.

blank0000:
I'd like to point out that Ninja Theory was approached by Capcom to make DMC, and where told to take the series in a different direction on multiple occasions. They never entered into the fray with an attitude of "we can do this better". They where called up by a well known publisher to run an experiment on a series that at the time had been criticized for losing it's edge. I doubt they'd want to make a sequel given the poor sales and steady stream of negativity.

And I always got the feeling that they were spouting complete and utter bullshit with that. Tamtam's mean-spirited, juvenile, unprofessional, and frankly insecure rambling spoke VOLUMES about who the real culprits were.

As for the series supposedly "losing its edge", that's a complete and utter lie. DMC4 was the most widely acclaimed and best-selling entry in the series to date. It was acclaimed for bringing the trademark hack and slash to a new level and was arguably considered the benchmark for hack and slash before Bayonetta came along (although oddly, the first Bayonetta hasn't aged as well as DMC4) and of course Dante was still loved by all. That's why the the reboot was so damn weird to witness; all the justifications they tried to throw out were so divorced from reality, logic, and history it made me wonder if they came from some parallel universe. Again, the DMC4: SE making more noise that the port of NT's game clearly shows where the attention is going.

They really will make a Remastered version of just about anything, wont they?

I mean really, what is the point of even getting a current-gen console? Aside from about 2 or 3 games that are even worth a damn, most of the games are on the last-gen. The consoles have been out for a year and this really isn't helping.

Aiddon:
[quote="AgentLampshade" post="7.867121.21689757"]

As for the series supposedly "losing its edge", that's a complete and utter lie. DMC4 was the most widely acclaimed and best-selling entry in the series to date. It was acclaimed for bringing the trademark hack and slash to a new level and was arguably considered the benchmark for hack and slash before Bayonetta came along (although oddly, the first Bayonetta hasn't aged as well as DMC4) and of course Dante was still loved by all. That's why the the reboot was so damn weird to witness; all the justifications they tried to throw out were so divorced from reality, logic, and history it made me wonder if they came from some parallel universe. Again, the DMC4: SE making more noise that the port of NT's game clearly shows where the attention is going.

I never got the impression that the dialogue being had with consumers was juvenile. If you could dig up some examples of this offensive behavior, please share it so I can better understand were you are coming from. I followed the games development fairly close and found the company was open about the decisions being made for the project and why they made said decisions.

As for the foreseeable future, we are in agreement. I'm confident that the series will return to the direction/ mythos it held previously, based on user reactions. I can understand marketing the fresher game more heavily. It makes more sense to use the flashier visuals. It is likely the special edition is still in development and not in a visually appealing state.

The purpose of my original post was to point out Ninja Theory does not deserve to be painted as a villain and Capcom is not performing a praise able feat. I feel a company that was commissioned to make a game is now being treated as a scapegoat for fan frustrations at business and marketing decisions Ninja Theory had little to no control over.

blank0000:

I never got the impression that the dialogue being had with consumers was juvenile. If you could dig up some examples of this offensive behavior, please share it so I can better understand were you are coming from. I followed the games development fairly close and found the company was open about the decisions being made for the project and why they made said decisions.

As for the foreseeable future, we are in agreement. I'm confident that the series will return to the direction/ mythos it held previously, based on user reactions. I can understand marketing the fresher game more heavily. It makes more sense to use the flashier visuals. It is likely the special edition is still in development and not in a visually appealing state.

The purpose of my original post was to point out Ninja Theory does not deserve to be painted as a villain and Capcom is not performing a praise able feat. I feel a company that was commissioned to make a game is now being treated as a scapegoat for fan frustrations at business and marketing decisions Ninja Theory had little to no control over.

Lessee:

Claiming Dante would "be laughed out of any bar outside of Tokyo" and "too Japanesey"

http://www.vg247.com/2010/09/22/dmc-what-was-cool-in-the-past-isnt-cool-anymore/

Claiming this was how Dante was:

http://www.famitsu.com/images/000/031/133/l_51556bb28e407.jpg

Saying "Dante isn't cool anymore"

http://www.1up.com/previews/ninja-theory-devil-cry-cool_2

Doing a passive-aggressive "I don't care" when dealing with criticism

http://venturebeat.com/2010/10/15/should-developers-listen-to-their-fans/

Of course trying to say critics secretly want to like it. Again, trying to deflect criticism:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.307577-Ninja-Theory-Devil-May-Cry-Skeptics-Secretly-Want-to-Like-It

Bonus points with Tamtam displaying a MASSIVE ego:

http://www.nowgamer.com/features/1161217/dmc_devil_may_cry_ninja_theory_capcom_interview.html

Seriously, screw this guy, screw NT, and screw their crappy game. They are freaking pathetic and the sales for it only reinforced that. NT are just as much the villain, in fact probably more so. They are not defensible, they're just another hack company that clearly hasn't learned anything. Heck, like I said in a previous post, their reactions to their games bombing in one way or another is indicative of a egomaniac who can't take criticism. Heavenly Sword fails so the blame is clearly on Sony for it being exclusive. Enslaved fails so it HAS to be because it was a new IP during a busy time of year. Then THIS fails so they resort to making an "independent AAA" title that's a download only. What the HELL is it gonna take for these guys to take the hint? Maybe it wouldn't be so bad if they weren't clearly full of themselves. And a bit xenophobic all told.

Aiddon:

Lessee:

Claiming Dante would "be laughed out of any bar outside of Tokyo" and "too Japanesey"

http://www.vg247.com/2010/09/22/dmc-what-was-cool-in-the-past-isnt-cool-anymore/

Claiming this was how Dante was:

http://www.famitsu.com/images/000/031/133/l_51556bb28e407.jpg

Saying "Dante isn't cool anymore"

http://www.1up.com/previews/ninja-theory-devil-cry-cool_2

Doing a passive-aggressive "I don't care" when dealing with criticism

http://venturebeat.com/2010/10/15/should-developers-listen-to-their-fans/

Of course trying to say critics secretly want to like it. Again, trying to deflect criticism:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.307577-Ninja-Theory-Devil-May-Cry-Skeptics-Secretly-Want-to-Like-It

Bonus points with Tamtam displaying a MASSIVE ego:

http://www.nowgamer.com/features/1161217/dmc_devil_may_cry_ninja_theory_capcom_interview.html

Seriously, screw this guy, screw NT, and screw their crappy game. They are freaking pathetic and the sales for it only reinforced that. NT are just as much the villain, in fact probably more so. They are not defensible, they're just another hack company that clearly hasn't learned anything. Heck, like I said in a previous post, their reactions to their games bombing in one way or another is indicative of a egomaniac who can't take criticism. Heavenly Sword fails so the blame is clearly on Sony for it being exclusive. Enslaved fails so it HAS to be because it was a new IP during a busy time of year. Then THIS fails so they resort to making an "independent AAA" title that's a download only. What the HELL is it gonna take for these guys to take the hint? Maybe it wouldn't be so bad if they weren't clearly full of themselves. And a bit xenophobic all told.

Going through the information you provided, I don't see an egotistical director or a company compelled by greed or poor practice. In the interview you linked from the director, Tameem Antoniades explains the changes and direction of the game and takes the time to credit members of the Capcom team for there influence and experience, as well as the efforts of the writers, visual directors and motion capture artists the studio worked with.

I also have to say his argument about making something "Cool" makes sense. Styles and trends change and there was a repeated theme of "changing with the times" present in said reboot. It may not have been the right direction to go in, but it does not show disrespect for the original material. It seems they where hoping to capture the core themes of the games people enjoyed, with hit or miss results.

These guys are not agents of the devil. Creative risks where taken at the request of the publisher and were punished with poor sales. There is no need to demonize a studio for such actions.

AgentLampshade:

The vanilla game itself wasn't terrible. It was playable, even enjoyable in the same way God Of War is. A mindless action game that just happened to have a terrible story and terrible characters. Not nearly touching the calliber of it's big brothers and sister, but enough to do what it wanted to do. It just had the unfortunate luck of having "DMC" written above it and Capcoms ridiculous decision-making spearheading it.

I'm with you on this one, I liked the new Devil May Cry.
Is it as bad as people keep saying it is, I don't think so.
Is it as good as the other DMC's?
Of course not, but I still find it more enjoyable than Devil May Cry 2.

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