WARCRAFT 3 REMASTER!!!!!! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!!

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Hawki:

Dalisclock:

Do the first two games have enough vital story to require playing them first? I'm curious because the only game in the series I played was WC3 and I didn't have any trouble following that only having a vague idea what happened in the prior games. I knew there was a big war between the humans and orcs in the past, apparently the humans won and thus the orcs ended up in internment camps at the beginning of WC3.

It depends what you mean by "require."

Playing Warcraft III for the first time in an Internet cafe, I had no idea what was going on outside "humans good, orcs bad" (didn't get to play much because my friends were there for the multiplayer). Later getting the game and getting the manual, that helped, but you still need to piece it together. I remember for instance that in the Alliance history section it discusses the Second War ad nauseum, but the First War isn't ever mentioned until the Horde history section, and even then it mostly pertains to Thrall's backstory.

So, it's technically possible, but I'd argue that playing the earlier games would help. As it turned out, the order of me playing the games was 3>1>2. But point being, there's little reason to skip to three straight away IMO, even if it's the strongest of the bunch.

From my general recollection, the story is mostly in the manual for Warcraft 1. And the Dark Portal expansion for Warcraft 2.

The main big point in Warcraft 1's campaign is killing Medivh (which happens in both campaigns), and thats not even well-presented if you didn't read the manual thing.

I'm not 100% sure I actually finished all of WC2's campaigns, but I don't recall much other than Orcs chase humans across sea, then they both just start adding quasi-random ally races. Dark Portal did specifically have a story, and might have been when they started the whole chapter setups and defined canon rather then having two opposed campaigns with only one being canon.

Hawki:

I'll believe it when I see it.

That said, assuming it's a full adaptation, it strikes me as making more sense to adapt Metal Gear, because otherwise you're going to have to get an awful lot of backstory out of the way. Metal Gear Solid is able to convey that backstory well because not only does it have a manual, but it's not beholden to the pacing of a movie. So when Snake is in the cell for instance, and him and Naomi discuss how he killed Big Boss, that can work. In a film though, it would come off more as exposition. In contrast, the plot of Metal Gear is light enough that it can better fit a film, but it would arguably benefit from it since you'd gain a cinematic presentation, whereas most Metal Gear games already have cinematic presentation.

Yeah, it might turn out good but I thought the same about Max Payne and look how that turned out.

Either Metal Gear or a mixed adaptation of that and MG2 would make sense, since both games effectively follow the same course. I agree, it's gonna be interesting to see just how they explain what the big deal with Big Boss is and why everyone keeps jabbering on about him. Even more tricky is that there's more games taking place before MGS then after it, so just how much information and how to convey that to the audience.

The easiest way I can think of is do some kind of quick overview of Big Bosses Backstory during the opening credits, ending with Solid Snake killing him a couple years before the movie begins. Just hit the points about preventing WW3 in 1964, leaving government service before forming a PMC and getting engaged in conflicts across the planet for the next 30 years.

After seeing this trailer I got excited and dug out my original discs for WC3 and TFT (yes I still have them. They even survived a house fire). Honestly, I think the visuals have aged pretty well. The cartoony style holds up much better over time than "realistic" aesthetics.

The only thing that really reminds me how outdated it is is the UI. Holy jumping jesus does the UI take up massive portions of the screen. You view the actual gameplay through a tiny slit in the middle of the screen with the rest of it taken up by action bars and character portraits.

I'm on the fence in regards to the remaster. Seeing as I still have access to the original there's no incentive other than making it prettier.

Hawki:

Dalisclock:

Do the first two games have enough vital story to require playing them first? I'm curious because the only game in the series I played was WC3 and I didn't have any trouble following that only having a vague idea what happened in the prior games. I knew there was a big war between the humans and orcs in the past, apparently the humans won and thus the orcs ended up in internment camps at the beginning of WC3.

It depends what you mean by "require."

Playing Warcraft III for the first time in an Internet cafe, I had no idea what was going on outside "humans good, orcs bad" (didn't get to play much because my friends were there for the multiplayer). Later getting the game and getting the manual, that helped, but you still need to piece it together. I remember for instance that in the Alliance history section it discusses the Second War ad nauseum, but the First War isn't ever mentioned until the Horde history section, and even then it mostly pertains to Thrall's backstory.

So, it's technically possible, but I'd argue that playing the earlier games would help. As it turned out, the order of me playing the games was 3>1>2. But point being, there's little reason to skip to three straight away IMO, even if it's the strongest of the bunch.

I played WC1 back in the mid-90's. Then skipped to WC3 when it came out in '02. I later went back and played through 1 & 2. I don't think it's necessary. WC3 is still a great game today, but 1 & 2 have not aged well. They are really primitive, with awful graphics.

The WC3 manual has everything you need to know, and is actually a pretty interesting read.

BTW, apparently they are going to retcon some things to make it more consistent with WoW's lore. I hope they don't cheese things up too much, because the WC3 story is ten times better than anything WoW ever came up with.

Kerg3927:

BTW, apparently they are going to retcon some things to make it more consistent with WoW's lore. I hope they don't cheese things up too much, because the WC3 story is ten times better than anything WoW ever came up with.

Yeah that doesn't sound good at all. If it's just limited to map and such no big deal, but there's some pretty big difference that I hope they don't touch on. Like at the end of Rexxar campaign Jaina version of the alliance is slowly becoming friendlier with the horde just to have all of that ignored when you start WoW.

Kerg3927:

BTW, apparently they are going to retcon some things to make it more consistent with WoW's lore. I hope they don't cheese things up too much, because the WC3 story is ten times better than anything WoW ever came up with.

Annnnnd there goes my pre-order. I was looking forward to it now I'm wallowing in cynicism and pessimism. I have no problems with reimagines but for the sake of WoW. Pffft.

mad825:

Kerg3927:

BTW, apparently they are going to retcon some things to make it more consistent with WoW's lore. I hope they don't cheese things up too much, because the WC3 story is ten times better than anything WoW ever came up with.

Annnnnd there goes my pre-order. I was looking forward to it now I'm wallowing in cynicism and pessimism. I have no problems with reimagines but for the sake of WoW. Pffft.

Out of curiosity, what is it you don't like about WOW lore. I have my misgivings but I am curious about how much you know?

Knowing what's gonna be retconned in Warcraft 3 for example. The assault on the Black Temple in the Illidan/Kael'thas campaign will be in Shadowmoon Valley rather then Hellfire Peninsula. Basically a switch from Red Wasteland to Black and Green Wasteland.

If you read the article (and others) you'll see they're not retconning - least not in the sense that you're thinking of. Off the top of my head, the "retcons" I can recall reading about are:

-Changeing the layout of Stratholme to match WoW, and changing its architecture to be less 'random' (the whole 'fish fountain' example)

-Adding a scene that shows Arthas resurrecting Invincible, to explain where he gets his horse in the Scourge campaign

-Adding extra material for Sylvanas and Jaina

-Giving Jaina extra lines in the Horde TFT campaign, to better acknowledge her grief over her father's death

-Addressing the issue of the draenei (this is a bit vague, but it'll probably be along the lines of acknowledging that these are Krokul draenei)

It's "retconning" in the same way that REmake retcons RE1. There's plenty of stuff added, but the core of the story remains the same.

Meiam:
Like at the end of Rexxar campaign Jaina version of the alliance is slowly becoming friendlier with the horde just to have all of that ignored when you start WoW.

Jaina's not a major figure in the Alliance when WoW starts. I'm also not sure where it conveys the idea of the Alliance becoming "friendier" to the Horde when the people of Theramore have had to stand aside and let the Horde deal with Proudmoore. This is touched on in 'Cycle of Hatred', which, if anything, makes things worse. Plus, there's various other things that contribute to deteriorating relations by WoW (logging in Ashenvale, Alterac Pass dispute, issue of Lordaeron and the Forsaken, the issue of Northwatch, etc.

Hawki:

Jaina's not a major figure in the Alliance when WoW starts. I'm also not sure where it conveys the idea of the Alliance becoming "friendier" to the Horde when the people of Theramore have had to stand aside and let the Horde deal with Proudmoore. This is touched on in 'Cycle of Hatred', which, if anything, makes things worse. Plus, there's various other things that contribute to deteriorating relations by WoW (logging in Ashenvale, Alterac Pass dispute, issue of Lordaeron and the Forsaken, the issue of Northwatch, etc.

She's literally one of the major PvP boss for the alliance...

Meiam:

Hawki:

Jaina's not a major figure in the Alliance when WoW starts. I'm also not sure where it conveys the idea of the Alliance becoming "friendier" to the Horde when the people of Theramore have had to stand aside and let the Horde deal with Proudmoore. This is touched on in 'Cycle of Hatred', which, if anything, makes things worse. Plus, there's various other things that contribute to deteriorating relations by WoW (logging in Ashenvale, Alterac Pass dispute, issue of Lordaeron and the Forsaken, the issue of Northwatch, etc.

She's literally one of the major PvP boss for the alliance...

Okay, sure, but how does that change everything else?

Jaina doesn't represent the Alliance as a whole during TFT (though at the time we could easily think so since the fate of human kingdoms bar Lordaeron and Dalaran was left ambiguous). And IIRC, at the time WoW begins, the Alliance is quite ineffectual - the night elves are only there for conveniance, Onyxia's pulling the strings on Stormwind, there's no strong central leadership, etc. The Alliance and Horde falling out after defeating a common enemy has strong real-life parallels (Cold War), and in lore, there's various tensions that erupt.

Hawki:
The Alliance and Horde falling out after defeating a common enemy has strong real-life parallels (Cold War), and in lore, there's various tensions that erupt.

They have a falling out mainly because of racism by Jaina's father and his soldiers. But also because Blizzard needed it to happen so they could have PvP in WoW.

I'll be honest, I'm not that excited, and I absolutely love the first 3 Warcrafts. It looks pretty identical except for a few things I don't consider important and with a bit better graphics. What's the point? I guess if it hits consoles it might be worth it to play it on a different platform?

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