What are your opinions on Red Dead Redemption 2 so far?

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hanselthecaretaker:

Johnny Novgorod:
Now that the world's opened up a bit I'm loving the game more and more. The attention to detail to the world is insane. I like how the random events and side activities have taken an even bigger life since the first game, like the whole backroom robbery business that came up purely ona series of hunches and just played out seamlessly and unobtrusively. Wish the missions were a little more like that. Also wish they were upfront about the bonus objectives leading to gold rather than tell you after the fact, as it is the game forces you to play each mission twice before acing it.

I think it's on purpose to serve as something merely extra from a challenge perspective; to try after getting a feel for the mission. If I saw those objectives before starting every mission I'd be less keen on paying attention to the story or letting things play out naturally, especially for the time limit stuff.

I get it, immersion. Just wish at least I could skip the "playable custscene" portion of missions upon replay.

Just got a profanity check for trying to name my horse Sarah Jessica Parker. What the hell?

Johnny Novgorod:
Just got a profanity check for trying to name my horse Sarah Jessica Parker. What the hell?

Okay that was pretty good!

OP: Got a question on side missions. I'm towards the ending chapters, like just got off the island and want to go save John. But I don't want to rush to the end, but I can't find any side missions. I keep seeing a white bubble up in the north where professor Farnsworth is doing his thing, but every time I go there all the doors are locked and he's nowhere to be seen or heard. Likewise I have a bunch of homestead raids, but the loot never shows up. I even googled it and I think I messed up as I was supposed to get the occupants to tell me where the money is, but they all pulled knives and guns and even with fists I still beat them to death. Also all the posts have stopped selling tips on stagecoach robberies. Also also also the random little asides, like bandit ambushes or women in distress have all just stopped. Its like the game just blew its load in the first 3 chapters, but decided it needed to be twice as long but with no content.

My opinion is that those @#$%&*@# at RockStar had better put out a PC version this time, dagnabbit.

So I'm taking my sweet time with the story and just fucking about the world. In part because I tend to do that with open worlds, in part because I'm afraid to miss out content by advancing the plot. Just unlocked fast travel, or rather its one-way ticket equivalent, but I'm still on chapter 2, working past level 1 challenges and figuring out perfect-pelt hunting. Honor's nearly 100% good, got three (out of five? That seems little) bounties and robbed the requisite 4 homesteads. I don't know how many hours I've crunched at this point.

I must admit, I am really struggling to play RDR2. It's is extremely slow and seems to want to keep players at a slow pace with all the things to keep track of. Taking care of yourself and your horse, while also trying to stay on top of the missions, donations to camp, upgrades, etc. It's all a bunch of slow systems that do not motivate me to keep playing very much.

Silentpony:

Johnny Novgorod:
Just got a profanity check for trying to name my horse Sarah Jessica Parker. What the hell?

Okay that was pretty good!

OP: Got a question on side missions. I'm towards the ending chapters, like just got off the island and want to go save John. But I don't want to rush to the end, but I can't find any side missions. I keep seeing a white bubble up in the north where professor Farnsworth is doing his thing, but every time I go there all the doors are locked and he's nowhere to be seen or heard. Likewise I have a bunch of homestead raids, but the loot never shows up. I even googled it and I think I messed up as I was supposed to get the occupants to tell me where the money is, but they all pulled knives and guns and even with fists I still beat them to death. Also all the posts have stopped selling tips on stagecoach robberies. Also also also the random little asides, like bandit ambushes or women in distress have all just stopped. Its like the game just blew its load in the first 3 chapters, but decided it needed to be twice as long but with no content.

I don't know about any of that except that it's recommended to do most homesteads in the early chapters. The dudes you mention that pulled weapons on you, you're supposed to leave one of them alive so he'll tell you where the stash is. The Aberdeen pig farm, you're supposed to take the glaringly obvious bait and fall for the ruse or you won't learn where the stash is hidden. Most of the time the game just wants you to go against your instinct, I find. And if the list at PSN Profiles is comprehensive then my trophy popped early at the third homestead robbed.

Just another open world game. I have no interests. If I need one, I'll get Just Cause 4.

I must be nearing the end of chapter 2 because my camp is being dismantled after the shootout in Valentine. I've only gotten one homestead though so hopefully I can still get the others. I haven't talked to Dutch yet as I figured that would trigger the jump to chapter 3.

I put in around 20 or so hours, but I got so bored. Everything felt like a chore and I just wasn't having fun. Maybe I'll come back to in a month or so and try again.

I think the problem a lot of people have with the game is being too preoccupied with "finishing it" like other action games, vs simply enjoying the journey and everything it offers along the way.

It ain't meant to be rushed.

hanselthecaretaker:
I must be nearing the end of chapter 2 because my camp is being dismantled after the shootout in Valentine. I?ve only gotten one homestead though so hopefully I can still get the others. I haven?t talked to Dutch yet as I figured that would trigger the jump to chapter 3.

If you really want to, I'll spoil the name of the mission that ends chapter 2. If you go on the map and focus on Dutch's icon the name of the mission will show up and you'll know if you're ending the chapter by accepting it.

hanselthecaretaker:
I think the problem a lot of people have with the game is being too preoccupied with ?finishing it? like other action games, vs simply enjoying the journey and everything it offers along the way.

It ain?t meant to be rushed.

Except with Red Dead 2 you can see where it's going a mile away, and dragging it out isn't adding anything other than another 10-minute long horse ride followed by yet another shoot-out. And the story keeps repeating itself, with Dutch's arrogance causing some powerful individual to get pissed, and making the whole gang have to move again, usually due to some robbery that went bad.. again. And yes, I know the story is supposed to show this gang go to pieces under Dutch's guidance, but the way it's structured leaves very little to be surprised about.

The intro itself is two and a half hours long, and for what - to find out how to ride, shoot, hunt, and skin? Rockstar has never known how to pace a game, but RDR2 takes the cake.

To very briefly summarise:

Single player campaign - Excellent. Well written characters that have geniune relationships with one another. An enjoyable campaign that unfortunately ended up too soon, although that is kinda my fault. I misread where the story was headed and plowed through what turned out to be the last 3rd of the story thinking I would simply be unlocking the next chapter. I could wax lyrical about the single player for ages, but as you can see I have an axe to grind first ...

Online multiplayer - Crap. The same open world sandbox with missions scattered around the place that we got with GTA:O (which is good), but forced into public servers with no option for private lobbies (which is bad), so if you and your friends fancy duking it out in the Old West you'd better be prepared to have random monkeys jump in on every little piece of action. Want to collect a bounty? Prepare to be griefed. Want to rob a train? Prepare to be griefed. Want to save a town from bandits? Griefed. Horse race from Blackwater to Saint Denis? Griefed. Buffalo hunting? Griefed. Treasure hunting? *Definitely* gonna get griefed. Hell, even riding from camp to a mission trigger point ends up in a running gun battle between you and every XBL troll within three miles.

Casual Shinji:

hanselthecaretaker:
I think the problem a lot of people have with the game is being too preoccupied with ?finishing it? like other action games, vs simply enjoying the journey and everything it offers along the way.

It ain?t meant to be rushed.

Except with Red Dead 2 you can see where it's going a mile away

See, I thought there'd be another few chapters before the end. I could see

Johnny Novgorod:

hanselthecaretaker:
I must be nearing the end of chapter 2 because my camp is being dismantled after the shootout in Valentine. I?ve only gotten one homestead though so hopefully I can still get the others. I haven?t talked to Dutch yet as I figured that would trigger the jump to chapter 3.

If you really want to, I'll spoil the name of the mission that ends chapter 2. If you go on the map and focus on Dutch's icon the name of the mission will show up and you'll know if you're ending the chapter by accepting it.

Thanks, I'll look out for that. Hoping I can still do the honor/homestead robbery side missions without backtracking hours.

Casual Shinji:

hanselthecaretaker:
I think the problem a lot of people have with the game is being too preoccupied with ?finishing it? like other action games, vs simply enjoying the journey and everything it offers along the way.

It ain?t meant to be rushed.

Except with Red Dead 2 you can see where it's going a mile away, and dragging it out isn't adding anything other than another 10-minute long horse ride followed by yet another shoot-out. And the story keeps repeating itself, with Dutch's arrogance causing some powerful individual to get pissed, and making the whole gang have to move again, usually due to some robbery that went bad.. again. And yes, I know the story is supposed to show this gang go to pieces under Dutch's guidance, but the way it's structured leaves very little to be surprised about.

The intro itself is two and a half hours long, and for what - to find out how to ride, shoot, hunt, and skin? Rockstar has never known how to pace a game, but RDR2 takes the cake.

It's practically impossible to "pace" an open world game. Players need to go into them expecting that there will always be more activity surrounding the storyline than that itself. I'm almost 20 hours in and have barely even considered the story in the midst of all the hunting, treasure seeking, horse scouting, crafting, bounty hunting, escaping, exploring, etc. It's just kind of "Oh...right...there's something supposed to be happening here at some point."

But yeah, enjoying the setting and style of game design is paramount to it not feeling like a slog.

Grouchy Imp:
To very briefly summarise:

Single player campaign - Excellent. Well written characters that have geniune relationships with one another. An enjoyable campaign that unfortunately ended up too soon, although that is kinda my fault. I misread where the story was headed and plowed through what turned out to be the last 3rd of the story thinking I would simply be unlocking the next chapter. I could wax lyrical about the single player for ages, but as you can see I have an axe to grind first ...

Online multiplayer - Crap. The same open world sandbox with missions scattered around the place that we got with GTA:O (which is good), but forced into public servers with no option for private lobbies (which is bad), so if you and your friends fancy duking it out in the Old West you'd better be prepared to have random monkeys jump in on every little piece of action. Want to collect a bounty? Prepare to be griefed. Want to rob a train? Prepare to be griefed. Want to save a town from bandits? Griefed. Horse race from Blackwater to Saint Denis? Griefed. Buffalo hunting? Griefed. Treasure hunting? *Definitely* gonna get griefed. Hell, even riding from camp to a mission trigger point ends up in a running gun battle between you and every XBL troll within three miles.

I just tried the online last night to take advantage of this..

I'm normally not a fan of multiplayer due to the time sink element to be competitive along with an erratic playtime schedule, but I could see going back to it when the kinks are workout out. I like the character I made and there looks to be some good variety to it. Even as-is I haven't had a problem with griefing as you say, but I'm on PSN (if that even matters). I wonder how well this idea will pan out down the road.

hanselthecaretaker:
I just tried the online last night to take advantage of this..

I?m normally not a fan of multiplayer due to the time sink element to be competitive along with an erratic playtime schedule, but I could see going back to it when the kinks are workout out. I like the character I made and there looks to be some good variety to it. Even as-is I haven?t had a problem with griefing as you say, but I?m on PSN (if that even matters). I wonder how well this idea will pan out down the road.

That's a cool little idea, I'll look out for that in future matches. Cheers for the heads up.

hanselthecaretaker:
It?s practically impossible to ?pace? an open world game. Players need to go into them expecting that there will always be more activity surrounding the storyline than that itself. I?m almost 20 hours in and have barely even considered the story in the midst of all the hunting, treasure seeking, horse scouting, crafting, bounty hunting, escaping, exploring, etc. It?s just kind of ?Oh...right...there?s something supposed to be happening here at some point.?

But yeah, enjoying the setting and style of game design is paramount to it not feeling like a slog.

Sure, it's hard, but in the last two generations great strides have been taken to improve upon open-world pacing, strides Rockstar continues to ignore.

A good thing to have for example is to allow the player to activate quests/missions without completely locking them into it (and out of other missions) until it's finished. In games like Skyrim, The Witcher 3, Horizon: Zero Dawn, and Breath of the Wild you can just collect missions indefinitely and finish them whenever you get close to the objective, or drop them, do something else, and then pick up where you left off later. It gives the player a great sense of freedom in how to approach quests, something that fits neatly with how an open-world should generally make you feel. Even the recent God of War did this, and it's not even an open-world really.

In RDR2 however, when you start a (main) quest you are gated into that quest from beginning to end, and any deviation will result in a mission failed, like it's still the PS2 days. My first mission once I got out of the snow, I accidentally hit a random guy on horseback with my cart and was visited by an instant 'mission failed', because 'don't attract the law'. It makes the missions feel so strict and railrouded, making me wonder what the point is of setting it in an open-world. And it also adds to the incessant back and forth traveling that plagues Rockstar's games, but the Red Dead franchise in particular, since you don't have access to a car.

Other open-world games have pretty much left Rockstar in the dust in terms of mechanical design and narrative pacing, and all they have to show anymore is how much more money by comparison they've pumped into they're overly stuffed gameworld.

CritialGaming:
I must admit, I am really struggling to play RDR2. It's is extremely slow and seems to want to keep players at a slow pace with all the things to keep track of. Taking care of yourself and your horse, while also trying to stay on top of the missions, donations to camp, upgrades, etc. It's all a bunch of slow systems that do not motivate me to keep playing very much.

I hardly took care of Arthur, the horse or the weapons at all and you get through the game fine without really noticing much. It's certainly not as complicated as the stuff you need to keep track in RPGs which are often required in order to complete them.

I found the slow pace more broadly with the horse riding similar to RDR1 so I think it was pretty obvious what to expect going in. It's like going into a GTA game and saying it's too violent. You know what expect going in.

Casual Shinji:
in the last two generations great strides have been taken to improve upon open-world pacing, strides Rockstar continues to ignore.

In RDR2 however, when you start a (main) quest you are gated into that quest from beginning to end, and any deviation will result in a mission failed, like it's still the PS2 days. My first mission once I got out of the snow, I accidentally hit a random guy on horseback with my cart and was visited by an instant 'mission failed', because 'don't attract the law'. It makes the missions feel so strict and railrouded, making me wonder what the point is of setting it in an open-world. And it also adds to the incessant back and forth traveling that plagues Rockstar's games, but the Red Dead franchise in particular, since you don't have access to a car.

Other open-world games have pretty much left Rockstar in the dust in terms of mechanical design and narrative pacing, and all they have to show anymore is how much more money by comparison they've pumped into they're overly stuffed gameworld.

I think you're plagiarizing my posts, haha. I've been saying Rockstar's linear mission design doesn't merit the open worlds they create. What's the point of the open world when you can't go "off script" finding different solutions to the objectives the game's missions give the player? Why not just make linear game along the lines of Uncharted if your mission structure is going to be as linear? You can go back to GTA3's generation and find a game (Mercenaries) that just blows Rockstar's game mission structure out of the water.

Phoenixmgs:
I think you're plagiarizing my posts, haha. I've been saying Rockstar's linear mission design doesn't merit the open worlds they create. What's the point of the open world when you can't go "off script" finding different solutions to the objectives the game's missions give the player? Why not just make linear game along the lines of Uncharted if your mission structure is going to be as linear? You can go back to GTA3's generation and find a game (Mercenaries) that just blows Rockstar's game mission structure out of the water.

It's never been great, but RDR2 puts a giant magnifying glass over it. It's also just stupifying how they refuse to implement control/quality of life improvements that other games have. And it has nothing to do with adding to the realism, since Horizon: Zero Dawn and God of War show you can have realistic graphics and generally grounded animation, and still have snappy input. Heck, I went back to The Last of Us after dropping RDR2-- itself a relatively slow moving game -- and it was like coming up for air, with how well that controlled by comparison.

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