New Vegas: Is Hardcore Mode Worth It?

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Wolfenbarg:
Now I'm not talking about the little achievement that the game gives you for beating the game in hardcore mode. I already know that that isn't worth it because I'm not a whore for grinding achievements or any other throwaway game stats. What I want to know is whether or not it makes the gameplay experience more fulfilling at all. It sounds like it can take roleplaying to the absolute max, but it also sounds like it could be a whole lot more trouble than it's worth. What are your opinions? Who has tried it and finished the game? Who has tried it and decided that it wasn't worth the effort?

It's pretty difficult at the beginning of the game but when you progress a ways it isn't so bad. It's totally worth playing through though. It's fun, it's difficult, and you get a real sense of accomplishment when you do anything. It's awesome.

Hardcore mode isn't so hardcore. The only thing it adds is more weight problems and some limitations every few hours. I sorta like it since it adds to realism, but it's nothing special.

its so bloody ironic, hardcore mode is actually EASIER than normal mode. because stimpacks and super stims heal over time, you jut pump yourself full off them and watch as your health grows back as soon as you lose it. i fought against lanius and his dogs and legion guards doing this, and i just sat ther while they pounded the fuck out of me, while i just mowed them down with the minigun. every time i got hit, my health just grew back, and the shitloads of hydra made my limbs heal too. i dont think bethesda thought that through very well.

As far as I'm concerned, Hardcore is the only way to play New Vegas.

Always felt weird to play through Fallout 3 and only live off of stimpacks. Food? Who needs food! Or water for that matter! I have stims!

Followers dying sucks...

Stupid ED-E.

I say don't do it.

I love Hardcore mode. I always felt like I was ludicrously overpowered in Fallout 3 because at even a modest strength level I could carry one of each type of weapon so I always had the perfect loadout for any situation, and carrying unlimited ammo in a type I never used (say, 5mm, since I never used the Minigun, or .32 once I got Lincoln's Repeater to replace the Hunting Rifle) was basically carrying around money by another name (and once I hit level 30 and had a maxed-out character, it's not like I even needed money because Barter was so easy). And any enemy, no matter how powerful (SM Overlord with Gatling Laser or Tri-Beam Laser Rifle, I'm looking at you) could be handled by spamming the Stimpak button, which I'd hotkeyed.

Can't do any of that in New Vegas. Ammo has to be conserved because it has weight (and in case of the .50 MG ammo for the Anti-Materiel Rifle, aka "the only Guns weapon that does shit against Deathclaws at least until they close range, in which case you're fucked", it's quite heavy), Stimpaks heal over time (you're better off maxing Survival and making Desert Salad and Brahmin Wellington and Caravan Lunch and spamming THOSE, but even that only works short-term), and the game just generally feels 1000x more immersive.

I really liked it, stimpacks healing over time made a lot more sense and meant you had to be more careful with your health.

What I didn't like was perm death on companions, because they die all the time! After a couple of hours I started telling my companions to wait behind whenever I knew a fight was coming after a couple of hours of that I just gave up on companions and played solo.

Actual:
I really liked it, stimpacks healing over time made a lot more sense and meant you had to be more careful with your health.

What I didn't like was perm death on companions, because they die all the time! After a couple of hours I started telling my companions to wait behind whenever I knew a fight was coming after a couple of hours of that I just gave up on companions and played solo.

That was actually my only beef as well. Those fuckers are made of glass in hardcore mode. It just ended up being easier going alone.

Hardcore mode isn't hardcore enough.

Really depends on the kind of gamer you are, to some people encumbrance rules add to gameplay, to me however they add frustration, I don't mind a sensible set of limitations but going overboard just makes me avoid the game.
Even on normal mode Fallout has way too many ifs and buts to my liking(addictions, radiation, fatigue, limb damage,...) so I would actually prefer a softcore mode.

it's basically just for the achievments.

i dont really think it was worth it.

There's a couple of good aspects about hardcore mode, which genuinely make the game tougher (like Companions who can die or how ammo has weight). But I gave up on it because it essentially means you have to tinker with your inventory far too often just to eat and drink. This was a bit of a challenge early on, but once you solve the caps problem (which is exceptionally easy to do), it's just a pain in the ass. Especially when you're in the casino, lots of free water supplies all around you, and you have to stop gambling to take a swig of water.

I think it would have been much better if there had been an auto-eat/drink option. Set some food or drink item as your default consumable and let the game sort it out for you. An auto-drink option would have been exceptionally easy since you could just have a canteen that you periodically fill. Free water is actually pretty common in the game (irradiated or not), but you seem to chuck your used bottles instead of reusing them, which doesn't make a bit of sense for a game character trying to survive in a hostile environment on a budget.

But, no, it's not really worth it, unless you sincerely love fiddling with your inventory. I do wish they had let us select which bits we could turn off. Only thing I had an issue with was eating & drinking and would have gladly left all the other options on... although someone was having a major issue with characters getting poisoned and not taking anti-venom, which (had I experienced it) would have me opting out of the Companion dying option. It's one thing if I lead them into fights that they are ill-prepared to survive, but quite another if they suicidally battle some lone Radscorpion at close range, then refuse treatment.

I found that it gave the game an extra dimension. It forces you to make decisions like whether you should pick up an extra bottle of water instead of more ammo which gives the game a lot more depth.

However, I didn't like the whole campanions can die element, especially when the AI starts a fight that it can possibly win.

I haven't been able to really play Hardcore mode. Why? Whenever I try to make a character on that mode, it won't level up. I had one character at about 800 XP, and the XP meter said: 800/200 and wouldn't level me up. Outside of Hardcore mode, I can level just fine, but I'm kinda peeved that I can't play this mode, because it sounds fun...

Nighthief:
I found that it gave the game an extra dimension. It forces you to make decisions like whether you should pick up an extra bottle of water instead of more ammo which gives the game a lot more depth.

That's exactly what I liked about it. I'd even go so far as to suggest that *all* items have weight, since most of the addictive chemicals in the game were still weightless.

But I think it needed some automated features to make it work. I should have to think about supplies, but they should make the basic process of consuming them as seamless as possible. If you're trudging through the desert, you're going to be eating & drinking as you go. You probably wouldn't even be thinking about it too much, especially in food/water rich areas. Let the player select which water source is his "canteen" and which food items (by HP/Rad stats) is his "trial mix" and go from there.

But as is, I found the system far too tedious.

MiracleOfSound:

teh_gunslinger:

I've noticed you keep posting about loading screens? Is that a common complaint? What system are you playing on? In my experience it takes a couple of seconds when you go between one area and the next. A bit annoying yes, but hardly excruciating.

I'm on 360.

How long have you been playing the game? It was when I got to Freeside/Vegas area that they started to get really long for me. We're talking a minute and a half for some of them.

It's a commonly had problem too, I'm surprised you haven't heard about it.

http://www.giantbomb.com/fallout-new-vegas/61-25933/the-first-game-thats-basically-a-loading-screen-in-a-box/35-464986/

http://www.playfire.com/a/forum/fallout-new-vegas/thread/88524

http://forums.bethsoft.com/index.php?/topic/1150977-loading-time-is-stooopid/

http://www.neoseeker.com/forums/43594/t1588389-how-to-make-loading-screens-faster/

http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/959557-fallout-new-vegas/57177448

I'm on PC so that might be it. According to Steam I've played for about 30 hours.

And I think the reason I've not really heard about it is that I've practically read nothing about NV. A piece on Rock Paper Shotgun and a piece on Shamus Youngs blog.

Wolfenbarg:
Now I'm not talking about the little achievement that the game gives you for beating the game in hardcore mode. I already know that that isn't worth it because I'm not a whore for grinding achievements or any other throwaway game stats. What I want to know is whether or not it makes the gameplay experience more fulfilling at all. It sounds like it can take roleplaying to the absolute max, but it also sounds like it could be a whole lot more trouble than it's worth. What are your opinions? Who has tried it and finished the game? Who has tried it and decided that it wasn't worth the effort?

It really doesn't make the game any more challenging at all. So you just need to carry around a little food (which you wouldn't in nonhardcore mode)

OOOOOOOOH, DIFFICULT!

Oh, stimpacks are just as exploitable. Just a little differently so.

OOOOOOOOH, DIFFICULT!

I've finished the game (siding with House). It's not a "waste of effort" because there is none. Although I'd hate to see how easy the game is without hardcore mode if this is the game WITH it.

Also, I kid you not but I beat the game without sleeping once. How? Damned if I know.

teh_gunslinger:
]

I'm on PC so that might be it..

'Nuff said... everyone I've spoken to who plays it on PC says the load times are far quicker. I wish I had money for a PC :( You guys and your mods and fast load times.

Chibz:

Also, I kid you not but I beat the game without sleeping once. How? Damned if I know.

That shouldn't have happened if you were playing on Hardcore. Either it was a bug, you cheated or you were on normal.

Wolfenbarg:
Now I'm not talking about the little achievement that the game gives you for beating the game in hardcore mode. I already know that that isn't worth it because I'm not a whore for grinding achievements or any other throwaway game stats. What I want to know is whether or not it makes the gameplay experience more fulfilling at all. It sounds like it can take roleplaying to the absolute max, but it also sounds like it could be a whole lot more trouble than it's worth. What are your opinions? Who has tried it and finished the game? Who has tried it and decided that it wasn't worth the effort?

I play on hardcore mode, not THAT noticeable if you drink or eat something every now and then. If you're looking to replay the game, might as well be on hardcore mode, not THAT drastic of a change.

The biggest problem iv noticed is that im a fatass now, because I like to carry boatloads of ammunition, which is now a no no because every bit of ammo weighs something. The whole stimpacks HOT thing is also kinda a bitch.

I've never played the game without Hardcore mode, so I can't really say, but to me I think the biggest fault with Hardcore Mode is the name. It's not very hard or hardcore. Do you like keeping track on a couple of extra meters and be more careful about what you carry? With added weight for ammo, and the need for food and water, Hardcore MOde was for me mostly an "anti-cleptomania" mode, in these types of games I usually pick up everything not glued to the floor and making myself change that was my biggest reason for playing with Hardcore Mode turned on.

MiracleOfSound:

teh_gunslinger:
]

I'm on PC so that might be it..

'Nuff said... everyone I've spoken to who plays it on PC says the load times are far quicker. I wish I had money for a PC :( You guys and your mods and fast load times.

Ah. Sorry mate. Didn't mean to pour salt on it. I was just curious.

teh_gunslinger:

MiracleOfSound:

teh_gunslinger:
]

I'm on PC so that might be it..

'Nuff said... everyone I've spoken to who plays it on PC says the load times are far quicker. I wish I had money for a PC :( You guys and your mods and fast load times.

Ah. Sorry mate. Didn't mean to pour salt on it. I was just curious.

Don't mind me, I'm just jealous :D

I didn't mind most of it, but my ammo having weight was annoying, especially how heavy the Micro Fusion Cells were, especially when I found a stash of them, and the Missiles weighing 3lbs makes you just not bother having a launcher. That said, it's made the game feel more new to me, so I like it.

Calumon: But, I don't want games to tell me to go to bed! Jack does that already.

It's shit. Every so often (like 20 minutes) you need a drink or you'll get a -1 debuff to a stat. Same with sleep and food. I never stole throughout the game, yet i always had enough food and drink to nullify this piece of shit. As for sleeping, i just took an hours kip every few weeks and i was right as rain.
I expected a little more from hardcore mode, although, considering how quickly they pushed the game out, i suppose i should have expected to be disappointed.

If the game hadn't been so glitchy, I think I might have enjoyed it. I really didn't have a problem finding food or ammo, so I didn't have to carry that around with me. Food is everywhere. I used a common gun so ammo wasn't a problem. It was the purified water that was the stickler for me. That I kept having to go back for. It weighs a pound each bottle, and I don't play with a high strength so those 15 extra pounds really fill up my pack. I didn't use dirty water to reduce the rad intake.

If you like roleplaying, you will enjoy hardcore. You have to do the basics. But I will agree with a bunch of the people here, it does get tedious after a while. But if you don't care about the achievement, you can turn it off and on whenever you feel like it. The best of both worlds, really.

One complain I did have though, if you didn't have a high survivalist skill, finding food that wasn't radiated was a pain in the ass. With the survivalist skill, you could theoretically make some better food. But the best food, Caravan Lunches and Wasteland Omelets, required so much shit to make, it wasn't worth carrying around the weight of the random pieces you picked up to complete the meal. It would have been nice to have a few more simple meals you could use a radaway with, like making the batches of purified waters.

Internet Kraken:

One thing that bugged me though is that the "special reward" was an achievement. Achievements are not special rewards.

Yea, that annoyed me too.
I thought it would be something to encourage another playthrough.
Hardcore is okay.
I'm looking at it as something to spice up my second playthrough which I started a couple of weeks ago but have since gotten sidetracked by Asscree Bro... so I guess it doesn't spice things up much.
It makes things a little different. You have to plan things out more. But it doesn't refresh the game as much as (for example) switching to a new class in Borderlands.

MiracleOfSound:

Chibz:

Also, I kid you not but I beat the game without sleeping once. How? Damned if I know.

That shouldn't have happened if you were playing on Hardcore. Either it was a bug, you cheated or you were on normal.

Check out my xbox 'tag. Hardcore mode's achievement (Special reward my butt) is there. And I swear that I never once slept. Bug? My sleep-meter went up, but it seemed to go down on its own accord. Cheated? How? Oh, the buggy PC version. Normal mode? Nope, got achievement.

I'm going through hardcore mode now and I have to say it doesnt make much difference to anything except for combat. You just have to make sure to carry food, water and radaway. The biggest problem is that you lose health quicker in combat and you cant heal crippled limbs by yourself. Also its more difficult to fight groups of people so dont do what I did and piss off all the factions so that they shoot on sight.

Chibz:

Check out my xbox 'tag. Hardcore mode's achievement (Special reward my butt) is there. And I swear that I never once slept. Bug? My sleep-meter went up, but it seemed to go down on its own accord. Cheated? How? Oh, the buggy PC version. Normal mode? Nope, got achievement.

Certain consumable items will reduce your sleep meter, some of them by a lot. I'm guessing you just used a few of those throughout the game without realizing what they did.

Internet Kraken:

Chibz:

Check out my xbox 'tag. Hardcore mode's achievement (Special reward my butt) is there. And I swear that I never once slept. Bug? My sleep-meter went up, but it seemed to go down on its own accord. Cheated? How? Oh, the buggy PC version. Normal mode? Nope, got achievement.

Certain consumable items will reduce your sleep meter, some of them by a lot. I'm guessing you just used a few of those throughout the game without realizing what they did.

This is likely. But I'd have had to accidentally done this the entire main storyline (And a bit of messing around)

It's likely I might've eventually had to sleep if I played it longer (Read as: Didn't rent it). But I don't know.

I'm mostly embittered about having been promised a special reward, and getting an achievement instead.

I enjoyed it as it had more of a survival aspect to the game. If your starting a new character (or indeed starting for the first time) and want to give it a try, I'd say go for it. Just watch out in battles as companions die and don't just pass out.

Chibz:

Internet Kraken:

Chibz:

Check out my xbox 'tag. Hardcore mode's achievement (Special reward my butt) is there. And I swear that I never once slept. Bug? My sleep-meter went up, but it seemed to go down on its own accord. Cheated? How? Oh, the buggy PC version. Normal mode? Nope, got achievement.

Certain consumable items will reduce your sleep meter, some of them by a lot. I'm guessing you just used a few of those throughout the game without realizing what they did.

This is likely. But I'd have had to accidentally done this the entire main storyline (And a bit of messing around)

It's likely I might've eventually had to sleep if I played it longer (Read as: Didn't rent it). But I don't know.

I'm mostly embittered about having been promised a special reward, and getting an achievement instead.

Yeah that really bugged me. I mean, I wouldn't have cared if beating Hardcore mode only got you an achievement if that was all I was expecting. But at the beginning of the game they say you get a "special reward" for beating the game with it on, which led me to bnelieve we would at least get some amusing little easter egg. An achievement is hardly special, that's par the course for most games nowadays.

Internet Kraken:

Chibz:

Internet Kraken:

Certain consumable items will reduce your sleep meter, some of them by a lot. I'm guessing you just used a few of those throughout the game without realizing what they did.

This is likely. But I'd have had to accidentally done this the entire main storyline (And a bit of messing around)

It's likely I might've eventually had to sleep if I played it longer (Read as: Didn't rent it). But I don't know.

I'm mostly embittered about having been promised a special reward, and getting an achievement instead.

Yeah that really bugged me. I mean, I wouldn't have cared if beating Hardcore mode only got you an achievement if that was all I was expecting. But at the beginning of the game they say you get a "special reward" for beating the game with it on, which led me to bnelieve we would at least get some amusing little easter egg. An achievement is hardly special, that's par the course for most games nowadays.

I was expecting something like a gamer pic pack, or an avatar award (I checked partway through, it didn't have any so I dismissed this one early). SOMETHING. ANYTHING more special than a slightly bigger achievement. 100 gamerscore isn't even the largest achievement I've ever seen. Isn't even top 5.

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